# Riding my tail with highbeams on is a recipe to make me go slower, not faster... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 28, 2003, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697 "2003-11-28T07:51:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/61 "2003-11-29T00:11:31Z")
> [@](#): > > Despite Ilsa’s “I know the law in every state”, there are several states that recommend pulling over. And even a few that have a law on the books in re slow driving. What the FUCK are you talking about, asshole? ---
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/62 "2003-11-29T00:14:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ilsa\_Lund \* > \*\*Wrongola. All you people bitching at Windwalker are WRONG. Having been through a large amount of driving classes in preparation ofr my license, I can assure you that any state trooper will tell you that that is EXACTLY what you should do. Unless the speed limit is 65 or over, there is no minimum speed. If tailgated, you should slow down. \*\* I’m talking about this, my dear. You do know that different states have different laws concerning driving, right? And believe it or not, there are laws concering driving too slowly. ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/63 "2003-11-29T00:21:27Z")
Driving too slowly in the absence of soemone driving a foot behind your bumper. The tailgater will get a ticket; the likelihood of getting a ticket for slowing down to a speed necessary for safe driving after being tailgated by someone with his brights on are nearly nonexistent. Those laws have little bearing in this case. ---
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/64 "2003-11-29T00:22:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Windwalker \* > \*\*Yay, I’m being flamed 🙂 > > \*\* Yep, but your additional info changes my perspective. While I still think its downright stupid to mess with tailgaters no matter what their motivation, your second post states that you had little choice while your first post looks like you were intentionally inflaming the loser/desperate driver. I won’t grovel, but I WILL retract the Fuckhead remark. Bubba Can I re=direct the Fuckhead remark to Ilsa? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/65 "2003-11-29T00:22:30Z")
Oh, I garbled that middle sentence. :o ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/66 "2003-11-29T00:23:47Z")
> [@](#): > > Can I re=direct the Fuckhead remark to Ilsa? I am rubber and you are glue.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/67 "2003-11-29T00:30:49Z")
**Ilsa** , I’ll give you one example. If you keep insisting, I’ll give you a few more. [California Law](http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/hdbk/pgs19thru22.htm) > [@](#): > > Special “turnout” areas are sometimes marked on two-lane roads. You should pull to the side in these areas and allow cars behind you to pass. Other two-lane roads sometimes have “passing lanes.” **If you are driving slowly on a two-lane highway or road where passing is unsafe, and five or more vehicles are following you, pull to the side of the road wherever you can safely do so to let the vehicles pass.** Now, will you kindly apologise for all the stupid, unnecessary nastiness? ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/68 "2003-11-29T00:34:40Z")
Yes, but I still maintain that that law is not applicable in this case. I already said that when traffic begins backing up, you should do something. But when a single car is riding one foot from your bumper with it’s brights on, slowing down is the appropriate response, unless another solution is immediately obvious. ---
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/69 "2003-11-29T00:50:16Z")
Look, I agree with you that the guy was a jerk and shouldn’t have driven up **WindWalker** ’s ass with his high beams on. And yes, I imagine that most states have laws against tailgating. But the point is, different states have different laws. And you couldn’t possibly know them all. For example, you said, “Unless the speed limit is 65 or over, there is no minimum speed.” [This is incorrect.](http://www.dor.mo.gov/mvdl/drivers/dlguide/chapter8.htm) > [@](#): > > SLOW POKE DRIVING > > It is against the law for you to drive slower than the posted minimum speed under normal driving conditions. You may drive more slowly than the minimum speed if you are driving in bad weather, heavy traffic or on a bad road. > > If there is no posted minimum speed, it is still against the law for you to drive so slowly that you block traffic. If you have to drive more slowly, and vehicles line up behind you, you should pull over and let them pass. Many accidents are caused by slow drivers who block other traffic. Remember, slower is not always safer. ---
**Author:** ![Ilsa\_Lund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a6a055/32.png) [@Ilsa\_Lund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ilsa_Lund)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/70 "2003-11-29T01:12:39Z")
Ok, you aren’t listening to me. > [@](#): > > If you have to drive more slowly, and vehicles line up behind you, you should pull over and let them pass. Many accidents are caused by slow drivers who block other traffic. Remember, slower is not always safer. I have conceded that twice. In the case of a single car tailgating you, you will be hard pressed to find prohibitions against slowing down as a reaction. In 99.99% of those cases, the tailgater will be ticketed, not you. I should have qualified my minimum speed statement, yes. ---
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/71 "2003-11-29T01:30:08Z")
So if you are driving below the minimum speed limit, and there is only one car behind you, you believe you are not breaking the law? Frankly, I think they both broke the law, depending on the state. ---
**Author:** ![Grimace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3e96dc/32.png) [@Grimace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grimace)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/72 "2003-11-29T02:06:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by leander \* > \*\*Look, I agree with you that the guy was a jerk and shouldn’t have driven up **WindWalker** ’s ass with his high beams on. And yes, I imagine that most states have laws against tailgating. > > But the point is, different states have different laws. And you couldn’t possibly know them all. > > For example, you said, “Unless the speed limit is 65 or over, there is no minimum speed.” > > [This is incorrect.](http://www.dor.mo.gov/mvdl/drivers/dlguide/chapter8.htm) \*\* **leander** I noticed you used a link from the Missouri Department of Revenue drivers guide, to make your point. I’ve done Law Enfocement in MO for a short time, and the drivers guide is basically your “cliff notes” for the law. It’s good for quickies, but for shades of the law, it’s best to go by the actual laws themselves. Here in MO, he probably would not have been ticketed, I say probably, as i’m not too sure about slowing down to 15 mph. But depending on the vehicle, and other things, all he would have to show would be that he was driving in a prudent manner, because the talgater was preventing him from seeing. If he could resonably show that going at 15 mph was the only way that he could safely drive upon the road, due to the blinding effect of the tailgaters high beams, the point would be moot, and no citation would be written. The relevant Missouri Statutes would be as follows, (Bolding is mine): [RSMo 304-010](http://www.moga.state.mo.us/statutes/c300-399/3040000011.htm) Slow speed, regulation of–agricultural implements, slower speeds, when, special permits required–penalties. 304.011. 1. No person shall drive a motor vehicle at such a slow speed as to impede or block the normal and reasonable movement of traffic, **except when reduced speed is necessary for safe operation or in compliance with law.** Peace officers may enforce the provisions of this section by directions to drivers, and in the event of apparent willful disobedience to this provision and refusal to comply with direction of an officer in accordance herewith, the continued slow operation by a driver is a misdemeanor. 1. No vehicle shall be operated at a speed of less than forty miles per hour on any highway which is part of the interstate system of highways, unless: (1) A slower speed is required for the safe operation of the vehicle because of weather or other special conditions; or (2) Agricultural implements, self-propelled hay-hauling equipment, implements of husbandry and vehicles transporting such vehicles or equipment may be operated occasionally on interstate highways for short distances at a speed of less than forty miles per hour if such vehicle or equipment is operated pursuant to a special permit issued by the chief engineer of the state department of transportation pursuant to section 304.200 and the regulations established pursuant to such section. 1. Any person who violates subsection 2 of this section is guilty of a class C misdemeanor. (L. 1957 p. 631, A.L. 1996 H.B. 1047) Effective 3-13-96 [RSMo 304-012](http://www.moga.state.mo.us/statutes/c300-399/3040000012.htm) Motorists to exercise highest degree of care–violation, penalty. 304.012. **1. Every person operating a motor vehicle on the roads and highways of this state shall drive the vehicle in a careful and prudent manner and at a rate of speed so as not to endanger the property of another or the life or limb of any person and shall exercise the highest degree of care.** 1. Any person who violates the provisions of this section is guilty of a class B misdemeanor, unless an accident is involved then it shall be a class A misdemeanor. (L. 1996 H.B. 1047) Effective 3-13-96 \*No continuity with § 304.012 as repealed by L. 1987 S.B. 83. (2002) Riding lawn mower is considered a motor vehicle under section. Stonger ex rel. Stonger v. Riggs, 85 S.W.3d 703 (Mo.App. W.D.). In this situation, and in this state, I can think of several places where what h describes can in fact happen, And for all intents and purposes, he hasn’t broken the law, as he was stating that the tailgaters position and high beams were preventing his operation of the vehicle in a safe and prudent manner, and that driving faster would have proven a danger to himself or others. Now, having said all that, I do think that slowing down to 15mph is pushing it, BUT at the same time I know of people who would HAVE to slow down to that speed, due to sensitive night vision, so to me, the speed he slowed down to is subjective at best. ---
**Author:** ![wakimika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f08c70/32.png) [@wakimika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wakimika)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/73 "2003-11-29T02:07:13Z")
Can we at least agree, regardless of laws varying from state to state, that the tailgater is the MAJOR asshole whilst the victim is the MINOR asshole? ---
**Author:** ![Grimace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3e96dc/32.png) [@Grimace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grimace)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/74 "2003-11-29T02:12:14Z")
Oh, and on more thing, so he got a kick out of the person not passing. I would have also under the circumstances, although, I probably wouldn’t have slowed down as severly as he did. Unless it was a 4x4 pickup which would have caused me to stop and wave the bastard around me while using my middle finger, as they’re set so PEFECTLY in hight as to utterly blind my poor ass. ---
**Author:** ![lucwarm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e19adc/32.png) [@lucwarm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lucwarm)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/75 "2003-11-29T02:39:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Windwalker \* > \*\* > > [. . .] > > \*\* Quite frankly, I believe that you’re rationalizing your jerkish behaviour; that when you slowed down to 15, your primary purpose was punishment and retaliation, and that you could have safely pulled aside and let the person pass – certainly at the beginning of the encounter, and very likely before you slowed down to 15. But only you know the exact circumstances and why it is you did what you did. ---
**Author:** ![imthjckaz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/imthjckaz/32/3223_2.png) [@imthjckaz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/imthjckaz)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/76 "2003-11-29T02:53:03Z")
[Tailgating](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=149113), it seems, to be a never ending subject here at the sdmb. ---
**Author:** ![leander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/bcef8e/32.png) [@leander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leander)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/77 "2003-11-29T03:59:18Z")
**Grimace** , fair enough, and thanks for the Straight Dope. It’s good to see someone around here who knows what they’re talking about. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Zero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@Saint\_Zero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Zero)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/78 "2003-11-29T04:01:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lucwarm \* > \*\*Right, so all the OP had to do was pull as far to the right as possible and come to a dead stop. Tailgater passes him, end of story. > > Actually there’s no need to debate the nature of the roads any more if you concede that the OP could have allowed the tailgater to pass. > > And for the record, I could have been a little clearer when I said there’s alway a place to pull over. I’m not trying to say that you can always get totally clear of the road. I am saying that you can always allow the guy behind you to pass. \*\* I don’t recall him saying he was impeding the guys ability to pass at all. Perhaps idiot was enjoying being in the throes of road rage and didn’t think to go around. Dangerous, but doable. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/79 "2003-11-29T07:18:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Windwalker \* > _::::::: so going 5 mph under the speed limit doesn’t seem so bad. Then this car appears in the rearview and rapidly closes the distance (he was probably going 50 mph), with his highbeams on. He gets so close as to hump my rear, ::::::: ( Actual distance was not stated, so 1-2 10- 20 feet? \<— me_) :::::::::::::: > > My first reaction was “wtf?!” followed by an intense desire to tell the guy to get the fuck off of my ass. ::::::::::::So I flashed my brake lights a couple of times, hoping he’d wise up. ::::::::: > After about a minute of this, I decided enough was enough. I slowed down to 25 mph, then to 20 mph,:::::::::::: Finally I got us down to a painful 15 mph, and said to myself, Fuck it, if Mr. Highbeam is in such a fucking hurry, then Mr. Highbeam can either back off and turn off his high beams or continue our little caravan at 15 mph (it was a double yellow line road, so I guess passing was technically illegal). He did not relent, and we went on for another 20 minutes at our fun little speed, and he honked his horn a couple more times. I think I flashed my brakelights in response whenever he did that, but he did not seem to get the point. ::::::::::::: > > \*I give it about 50/50 on intent until the line formed… \<— me \* > > ::::::::::: a line of cars began to form behind us, so these innocent folks were also getting screwed.:::::::::::: and the best response I could think of was to slow down. And yeah, I guess it was kinda vindictive, as well. Ride my tail with highbeams from hell, and you WILL get a nasty case of SLOW-ASS-WINDWALKERITIS. > ::::::::::::: > Flame away.\*\<------ no room to complain now 😉 \<— me \* \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Bandanaman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ab097/32.png) [@Bandanaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bandanaman)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2003, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697/80 "2003-11-29T07:57:24Z")
The only thing worse than a tailgaiter, is someone driving too slow in front of me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/riding-my-tail-with-highbeams-on-is-a-recipe-to-make-me-go-slower-not-faster/215697.md?page=5)