# Rioting, Murderous Mob Transformed By 8 Hour Bus Ride **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 3, 2005, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909 "2005-09-03T16:56:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/1 "2005-09-03T16:56:53Z")
Just a hale and hearty FUCK YOU to any of you, but particularly **Steph Infection** , who had the vileness of heart to suggest that the refugees in the Superdome did not deserve to be evacuated to Houston. [This is the thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=332956) [This is the post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6535121&postcount=8) where **Steph96** begins to vomit it’s bilious thoughts about the people who were trapped in the hellhole that was the Superdome. Read the rest for a nice little snapshot into the mind of a heartless, self-centered pile of human waste. Now click on this [LINK](http://www.chron.com/#), then click on **Volunteer describes scene at Astrodome** under the heading \*\*Today’s Top Stories \*\* for the Straight Dope on what those folks are _really_ like. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/2 "2005-09-03T17:01:19Z")
AH screw it. The title should read **Rioting, Murderous Mob Transformed By 8 Hour Bus Ride.** (Fixed thread title–Veb) ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/3 "2005-09-03T17:32:24Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Just a hale and hearty FUCK YOU to any of you, but particularly **Steph Infection** … How mature. :rolleyes: > [@Contrapuntal](#): > > …who had the vileness of heart to suggest that the refugees in the Superdome did not deserve to be evacuated to Houston. I read through as much of that thread as I could before giving up, but I see no one suggesting this. Some have suggested reasons, rightly or wrongly, why they might not be evacuated, but no one said they didn’t _deserve_ to be evacuated. Perhaps you should step away from the computer for a little while. You’re frothing. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/4 "2005-09-03T17:41:46Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#): > > How mature. :rolleyes: > > I read through as much of that thread as I could before giving up, but I see no one suggesting this. Some have suggested reasons, rightly or wrongly, why they might not be evacuated, but no one said they didn’t _deserve_ to be evacuated. > > Perhaps you should step away from the computer for a little while. You’re frothing. Well there’s this, where Steph continues the claim that the entire crowd should not be “taken in” because it is “raping” and “murderous.” > [@Steph Infection](#): > > I believe that nobody should be forced to take in a murdering, raping crowd under any circumstances! Where will they go after the Astrodome is destroyed? Fenway Park? Why don’t you put some of these ‘nice folks’ up in your place? Put your money where your mouth is, jackass. > > What’s that old saying? “If you want to be loved, act lovable.” ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/5 "2005-09-03T17:50:08Z")
C’mon **Q.E.D.**. **Stephe96** suggested that the presence of a few violent criminals in the dark hellish environment of the superdome meant that the entire population of the superdome was a “violent murdering mob” none of whom could be trusted anywhere. This deserves correction, and a pitting. And I don’t see how **Contrapuntal’s** language is any more out of control than many other pit threads. That’s what this forum is for. ---
**Author:** ![Q.E.D](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/51bf81/32.png) [@Q.E.D](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.E.D)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/6 "2005-09-03T18:09:51Z")
> [@Larry Borgia](#): > > C’mon **Q.E.D.**. **Stephe96** suggested that the presence of a few violent criminals in the dark hellish environment of the superdome meant that the entire population of the superdome was a “violent murdering mob” none of whom could be trusted anywhere. I didn’t read it that way. Wading through the hyperbole, it looked to me like he was saying that the presence of violent, armed individuals was reason for rescuers to abandon the evacuation effort. I don’t agree, of course, but he’s not saying that the unarmed, nonviolent people don’t _deserve_ rescue. Only that, in his opinion, they either can’t or shouldn’t be. There’s no need to mischaracterize his statements to make them worse than they are. They’re bad enough to be pitted as they stand. All I’m sayin’. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/7 "2005-09-03T18:21:37Z")
> [@Q.E.D.](#): > > I didn’t read it that way. Wading through the hyperbole, it looked to me like he was saying that the presence of violent, armed individuals was reason for rescuers to abandon the evacuation effort. I don’t agree, of course, but he’s not saying that the unarmed, nonviolent people don’t _deserve_ rescue. Only that, in his opinion, they either can’t or shouldn’t be. There’s no need to mischaracterize his statements to make them worse than they are. They’re bad enough to be pitted as they stand. All I’m sayin’. Actually, what he was suggesting was that since the crowd was riotous and murderous, the Astrodome was right to refuse them shelter. He refused to concede that the actions of a few individuals did not speak for the crowd, or that the horrible conditions they under had any bearing. To restate for emphasis, he attributed the admittedly inhuman behavior of the few to the many. Anyone who clicks on the links provided will see what absolute rot that is. ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/8 "2005-09-03T20:41:01Z")
> [@Contrapuntal](#): > > Just a hale and hearty FUCK YOU to any of you, but particularly **Steph Infection** , who had the vileness of heart to suggest that the refugees in the Superdome did not deserve to be evacuated to Houston. > > [This is the thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=332956) > > [This is the post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6535121&postcount=8) where **Steph96** begins to vomit it’s bilious thoughts about the people who were trapped in the hellhole that was the Superdome. Read the rest for a nice little snapshot into the mind of a heartless, self-centered pile of human waste. > Now click on this [LINK](http://www.chron.com/#), then click on **Volunteer describes scene at Astrodome** under the heading \*\*Today’s Top Stories \*\* for the Straight Dope on what those folks are _really_ like. Christ, it must suck to be you. Once again, you’re lying. And once again, you’re wrong. And easily, easily proven so. You’re lying about what I’ve said. As was noted above, I’ve never said or even implied that people did not deserve shelter. I merely suggested that the crowd’s appalling behavior at the Superdome might very well give Astrodome officials pause before allowing such a crowd into their facility. As it happens, the facts back me up. I’m right and you’re wrong. Again. It turns out the Texas officials were very aware of what happened in the Superdome this week, and they were damn sure it wasn’t going to happen again. How did they do this? For starters, they limited the number of people they allowed in the stadium. A very smart move. Fewer people are more easily controlled. Oh, they also decided to search each refugee for weapons before allowing them inside. I know, I know. A tad insensitive, right? Look at what these people have been through! They have no food or water, and they barely have the clothes on their backs. Why on earth would any of these wonderful people feel the need to carry weapons into the Astrodome? But there were rapes and murders at the Superdome this week…so it was probably a smart move. So the start patting them down. What do you think they find? Maybe a gun or a knife here or there? Maybe 10 or 20? Certainly no more than 30 weapons, right? Try this on for size: according to this article [http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/nation/20050903-9999-1n3houston.html](http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/nation/20050903-9999-1n3houston.html) …as of last count police had confiscated over _600 weapons_!!! Think about that for a moment! These darlings were trying to sneak 600 guns and knives into a _refugee shelter_ !!! Now, pray tell, why on earth would this group of loving and angelic folk feel the need to smuggle _weapons_ into the Astrodome? They had no food or water but they felt that guns and knives were important enough to hang onto? Were they planning on using them? There _were_ rapes and murders (!) earlier this week. It’s not unreasonable to think that many of these people are criminals. (And it’s hardly the “few bad apples” you would have us believe…the 600 number was as much a shock to me as I’m sure it is to you!) You could argue (lamely, I might add) that most of these people felt the need to carry weapons necessary for survival. OK, fair enough. But “survival” against whom? They are only going to be living amongst themselves, yes? Follow this to the logical conclusion: if the weapons are for protection then many of these refugees agrees with me and believes _this is not a mob to be trusted_ !! I’m sure they are basing this upon the mob’s actions earlier this week…you know, the rapes and murders. OK, so let’s recap. I would not have trusted this violent mob based upon what we saw earlier this week at the Superdome. The Astrodome officials didn’t trust them either, so they patted them down for weapons. It was a smart move. You, in your painfully naive and misguided trust, would have blithely allowed…oh, let’s say every 10th refugee… to enter an already tense and potentially explosive situation while carrying weapons. (I’m assuming you would _not_ have felt any need to search these wonderful people for guns and knives, right? After all, why would you?) I eagerly await your reply. Actually, on second thought, I don’t. Why don’t you go fuck yourself and let the adults talk, OK? You clearly out of your league. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/9 "2005-09-03T21:38:39Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Oh, they also decided to search each refugee for weapons before allowing them inside. I know, I know. A tad insensitive, right? No, only a tad idiotic start of a straw man argument. Nowhere in the OP I see that he complained on taking weapons away from the refugees, bad apples are supposed to be expected. Still, you don’t throw away the rest of the apples because of that. I have to say that your argument is good for gun control, but not for deciding which groups of people deserve shelter or not. And on the first of your quotes the OP links to, you mentioned that 5000 might be an easier number to handle, right now there are 25,000 in the Astrodome. Truly, you have a dizzying adult intellect there **Stephe96**. ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/10 "2005-09-03T21:49:37Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > . > > And on the first of your quotes the OP links to, you mentioned that 5000 might be an easier number to handle, right now there are 25,000 in the Astrodome. Truly, you have a dizzying adult intellect there **Stephe96**. Sure, a higher number of _unarmed_ refugees is much easier to control. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/11 "2005-09-03T21:58:21Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Sure, a higher number of _unarmed_ refugees is much easier to control. And the people in Texas showed adult smarts and took in a “dangerous crowd into another explosive situation” by taking their weapons away. Sorry \*\*Stephe96 \*\*. the fact remains that your point on the other thread was to find excuses why not to help a group of people. The adult and responsible way is to indeed take the bad apples’ guns away and then _help even the “bad” apples_. They are humans and presumed to be innocent, or are you forgetting they are Americans too? ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/12 "2005-09-03T22:07:08Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > And the people in Texas showed adult smarts and took in a “dangerous crowd into another explosive situation” by taking their weapons away. > > Sorry \*\*Stephe96 \*\*. the fact remains that your point on the other thread was to find excuses why not to help a group of people. The adult and responsible way is to indeed take the bad apples’ guns away and then _help even the “bad” apples_. They are humans and presumed to be innocent, or are you forgetting they are Americans too? I’ve never said differently. I was _not_ trying to “find excuses why not to help a group of people.” I was pointing out, correctly, that were many violent criminals among them (remember the rapes and murders?) and that I wouldn’t blame the Astrodome officials for being very careful about letting certain people in. Obviously, they thought the same way, hence the search for weapons. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/13 "2005-09-03T22:13:32Z")
odd, then, that you didn’t merely say “they should be searched first”, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/14 "2005-09-03T22:18:18Z")
> [@wring](#): > > odd, then, that you didn’t merely say “they should be searched first”, isn’t it? Frankly, it kind of boggled my mind that over 600 refugees felt the _need_ to try and smuggle weapons on the bus trip and into the shelter. Some in this crowd were worst than I imagined. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/15 "2005-09-03T22:18:38Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > I’ve never said differently. I was _not_ trying to “find excuses why not to help a group of people.” > [@Stephe96](#): > > I believe that nobody should be forced to take in a murdering, raping crowd under _ **any** _ circumstances! Where will they go after the Astrodome is destroyed? Fenway Park? Why don’t _you_ put some of these ‘nice folks’ up in _your_ place? Put your money where your mouth is, jackass. Enphasis mine. post #32 on that thread. And as we found, the majority of that crowd were not murderers or rapists, the only thing one reasonable can do in case like this is what the Texans did: ignore hysterical advise from guys like \*\*Stephe96 \*\* and do the right thing, removing the weapons was part of that. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/16 "2005-09-03T22:20:43Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Frankly, it kind of boggled my mind that over 600 refugees felt the _need_ to try and smuggle weapons on the bus trip and into the shelter. Some in this crowd were worst than I imagined. And still innocent. Notice please the context why I said that. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/17 "2005-09-03T22:27:25Z")
> [@Stephe96](#): > > Frankly, it kind of boggled my mind that over 600 refugees felt the _need_ to try and smuggle weapons on the bus trip and into the shelter. Some in this crowd were worst than I imagined. Why is it so hard to believe that people had weapons? Hell, I’D have a weapon too in that situation. I find it funny that a conservative who believes in gun rights, concealed carry laws, and self-determination would suddenly get incensed that 6% of the people coming out of a disaster area might have decided to arm themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/18 "2005-09-03T22:32:10Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Why is it so hard to believe that people had weapons? Hell, I’D have a weapon too in that situation. I find it funny that a conservative who believes in gun rights, concealed carry laws, and self-determination would suddenly get incensed that 6% of the people coming out of a disaster area might have decided to arm themselves. Unlike you, **Stephe96** has no beliefs or principles. **Stephe96** merely gets off on being an asshole of the highest order. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/19 "2005-09-03T22:34:39Z")
I’m pretty anti-gun in general, but after reading about what’s been going on in some of these refugee centers, I wouldn’t want to go into one without an assault rifle or two. Or, better yet, an assault helicopter or two. There’s some scary fucking shit going down in those places. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2005, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909/20 "2005-09-03T22:45:57Z")
**Stephe96** , I draw no conclusions about you or your personal motives. But some of your thinking really just doesn’t hold together. > [@](#): > > I merely suggested that the crowd’s appalling behavior at the Superdome might very well give Astrodome officials pause before allowing such a crowd into their facility. You have attributed to the crowd the behavior of individuals. I don’t know how many criminals, rival gang members, and assorted thugs there were in the Superdome. I do know it takes only a handful of people in a thousand to get the rest of that thousand branded as being of like kind. > [@](#): > > But “survival” against whom? They are only going to be living amongst themselves, yes? Living amongst **themselves**? What does that mean? What is different about “them”? How are “they” like each other? (See _branded_ above.) > [@](#): > > Oh, they also decided to search each refugee for weapons before allowing them inside. This action was also taken at the Superdome before people were allowed in. That’s why people had to wait in line so long. No weapons and no alcohol. Keep in mind that not every knife is intended as a weapon. I visited a court house recently and was chagrined to realize that I was carrying _two_ knives on me. Both were Swiss Army knives. One was the length of my pinky finger and on a keychain. Yet it counts as a weapon. How many murderers and rapes have been reported at the Superdome? I am curious about the actual number of people involved in a “city” of 25,000 people living in sub-human conditions. I cannot imagine the horror of the situation or the courage that it took to endure. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rioting-murderous-mob-transformed-by-8-hour-bus-ride/319909.md?page=2)