# RIP Arlen Specter **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 14, 2012, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708 "2012-10-14T17:57:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/41 "2012-10-16T10:37:36Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > Considering that Messrs. Clinton and Gore would be in the White House soon afterwards, I’d say it ensured a balance between the branches of government. Not sure what you think Gore did. Do you honestly see no difference between Anita Hill and Monica Lewinsky in terms of willingness to participate? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/42 "2012-10-16T14:06:13Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Not sure what you think Gore did. Do you honestly see no difference between Anita Hill and Monica Lewinsky in terms of willingness to participate? Well, remember…“a little bit nutty, a little bit slutty”, which is still popular in certain circles to describe her. Even thought the author of that epithet has completely recanted it. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/43 "2012-10-16T15:24:55Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Not sure what you think Gore did. He did say Clinton _and_ Gore. It’s possible **Qin** is confusing recollected scenes from his sizable collection of slash fiction with actual historical events. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/44 "2012-10-16T16:04:13Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > He did say Clinton _and_ Gore. It’s possible **Qin** is confusing recollected scenes from his sizable collection of slash fiction with actual historical events. Actually, he’s barely old enough to even consciously remember anything that happened during either Clinton administration, so he may just have picked up a really weird belief. Or else that Clinton/Gore softcore shirtless poster that was going around back then got taken seriously… ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/45 "2012-10-16T16:09:29Z")
Or maybe he’s as creeped out as I was by that kiss between Al and Tipper at the 2000 DNC. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/46 "2012-10-16T16:33:59Z")
I’m not a huge fan of Thomas, but I’m a bit amused by the claims that Thomas was put on the Court, because of his ideology or his beliefs. Yeah, like that’s different from every other Supreme Court nominee. Beyond that, I’m a bit surprised by all the attacks on him as “a sexual predator” and “a pervert.” Let’s remember during the 90s, we had Bill Clinton has President, who invited a woman up to his hotel room and as soon as she got in, dropped his pants, grabbed his dick and said “kiss this” for which he was successfully sued and forced to fork over a lot of money. I certainly think that was much worse than anything Thomas was accused of. ---
**Author:** ![Nazarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nazarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nazarene)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/47 "2012-10-16T16:48:10Z")
Paula Jones did not successfully sue Bill Clinton. Her case was summarily dismissed for lack of merit. She later settled for claims stemming from a different claim, but not for sexual harassment. The judge in the Paul Jones case said that, even if every word Paul Jones said was true, it still would not have been sexual harassment because Clinton stopped (according to Jones’s own story) as soon as she said no, and she never suffered any consequences afterwards. You also present Jones’ allegations as factual, even though they were never really substantiated, never adjudicated as true by any judge or jury and even though PJ was supported, abetted and media driven by a coalition unquestionably partisan activists. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/48 "2012-10-16T17:16:30Z")
> [@Nazarene](#): > > Paula Jones did not successfully sue Bill Clinton. Her case was summarily dismissed for lack of merit. She later settled for claims stemming from a different claim, but not for sexual harassment. Er…yes, as I said Bill Clinton was forced to fork over quite a bit of money to her. $850,000. > [@](#): > > The judge in the Paul Jones case said that, even if every word Paul Jones said was true, it still would not have been sexual harassment because Clinton stopped (according to Jones’s own story) as soon as she said no, and she never suffered any consequences afterwards. And most people would probably disagree with the judges ruling. Are you saying you don’t think it would be sexual harassment for a boss to invite one of his female employees into the back room, drop his pants, grab his dick and say “kiss this” so long as if she refused he stopped and said, “don’t worry I won’t fire you for this”? Beyond that, when Clinton winds up settling the case for nearly a million dollars, and Gloria Steinem had to develop the concept of men being allowed “one free grope” I think it’s safe to say it happened. Susan Estrich, a Clinton defender and booster of the one free grope rule also used that to defend Schwarzenegger since he was only accused of groped all the women women once and stopping when they asked. Anyway, what exactly did Thomas do that was worse than dropping his pants, grabbing his penis, and saying “kiss this”? For that matter, are you arguing that had Thomas dropped his pants in front of Anita Hill, grabbed his penis and said “kiss this”, then he wouldn’t have been guilty of sexual harassment? ---
**Author:** ![Nazarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nazarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nazarene)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/49 "2012-10-16T18:08:37Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Er…yes, as I said Bill Clinton was forced to fork over quite a bit of money to her. $850,000. not for sexual harassment. > [@](#): > > And most people would probably disagree with the judges ruling. Most people are not qualified to have a legal opinion about it. Not that you actually have any support for this claim in the first place. > [@](#): > > Are you saying you don’t think it would be sexual harassment for a boss to invite one of his female employees into the back room, drop his pants, grab his dick and say “kiss this” so long as if she refused he stopped and said, “don’t worry I won’t fire you for this”? That’s what the judge said. I defer to the judge. > [@](#): > > Beyond that, when Clinton winds up settling the case for nearly a million dollars, and Gloria Steinem had to develop the concept of men being allowed “one free grope” I think it’s safe to say it happened. No. It’s safe to say that he paid her to drop the appeal. The settlement did not include any admission of culpability. I have no interest in addressing your “one free grope” demagoguery since you still have not demonstrated that any such thing happened. I personally find the “kiss it” allegation ridiculous and unbelievable. I can’t talk you out of believing whatever you want, but you can’t say it’s a fact. It was only an unproven allegation ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/50 "2012-10-16T19:16:32Z")
> [@Nazarene](#): > > not for sexual harassment. > > Most people are not qualified to have a legal opinion about it. Not that you actually have any support for this claim in the first place. > > That’s what the judge said. I defer to the judge. > > No. It’s safe to say that he paid her to drop the appeal. The settlement did not include any admission of culpability. > > I have no interest in addressing your “one free grope” demagoguery since you still have not demonstrated that any such thing happened. I personally find the “kiss it” allegation ridiculous and unbelievable. I can’t talk you out of believing whatever you want, but you can’t say it’s a fact. It was only an unproven allegation Why do you find the allegations Paula Jones made about Bill Clinton exposing himself to her unbelievable? Particularly since you insist that a boss who drops his pants in front of his female employees, grabs his dick and says “kiss this” isn’t committing sexual harassment. Anyway, please tell us what Clarence Thomas “allegedly” did(since by your standards we can’t say he did anything wrong(since, to use your words, it’s an unproven allegation)? I’ll always respect Maureen Dowd who had eviscerated Thomas during the hearings for writing a public letter apologizing to him after seeing the dramatically different way Jones was treated and wondering whether both race(Thomas being black) and class(Jones being "some little woman with big hair from the trailer park) was involved. ---
**Author:** ![Nazarene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nazarene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nazarene)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2012, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/51 "2012-10-16T19:28:45Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > Why do you find the allegations Paula Jones made about Bill Clinton exposing himself to her unbelievable? All of it. It’s absurd. It’s along the lines of the Michelle Obama “whitey” speech allegations. It sounds exactly like something made up by political partisans, and in fact, PJ’s entire lawsuit was sponsored and media managed by right wing partisans. > [@](#): > > Particularly since you insist that a boss who drops his pants in front of his female employees, grabs his dick and says “kiss this” isn’t committing sexual harassment. That’s what the judge said. You’ll have to argue with her and with the state of Arkansas, not me. > [@](#): > > Anyway, please tell us what Clarence Thomas “allegedly” did No idea. I have not mentioned or alluded to Clarence Thomas in any way and have no clue what he did or did not do, nor do I know if he did anything that would legally qualify as sexual harassment. If you want to fight with somebody about Clarence Thomas, you’ll have to find someone else. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/52 "2012-10-17T05:03:05Z")
> [@Nazarene](#): > > What did Gore ever do? > [@BobLibDem](#): > > Not sure what you think Gore did. Do you honestly see no difference between Anita Hill and Monica Lewinsky in terms of willingness to participate? I was referring to these charges: [http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083\_162-20008704-504083.html](http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20008704-504083.html). Yes, I understand the charges were dropped but Thomas was never convicted either. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/53 "2012-10-17T05:32:03Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > I’m not a huge fan of Thomas, but I’m a bit amused by the claims that Thomas was put on the Court, because of his ideology or his beliefs. > > Yeah, like that’s different from every other Supreme Court nominee. His ideology and beliefs were deemed more important than his qualifications for SCJ. Selective reading tends to trip one up like that. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [October 17, 2012, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708/54 "2012-10-17T16:37:11Z")
Speaking as a conservative… I never had the slightest respect for Specter or the slightest use for him. Even in a business that’s, by its nature, FILLED with two-faced phonies, he was the worst of the worst. The only thing that makes me happy is… he died as loathed by the Left (who will always remember him primarily for the Magic Bullet Theory and for his reluctant support of Clarence Thomas) as he always was by the Right. Couldn’t have happened to a more deserving guy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-arlen-specter/637708.md?page=2)