# Rip NRA? :D **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [January 15, 2021, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635 "2021-01-15T22:58:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/101 "2021-05-12T08:24:48Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > U.S. judge dismisses NRA bankruptcy in victory for New York ([msn.com](http://msn.com)) Thoughts and prayers. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/102 "2021-05-12T18:09:22Z")
It sounds pretty clear, and this is from a strong gun rights supporter, that the NRA is being run by people who are abusing the organization for personal financial gain and filed this bankruptcy petition for the sole purpose of continuing that personal financial gain. Obviously, I don’t know for sure, so this is just an opinion. The judge’s opinion looks well reasoned and is not coming from a position of a partisan. To me it reads, “You have no financial difficulties. You have this one lawsuit which may or may not be politically motivated, but you are a sophisticated party able to fight it. Go fight it. Don’t bring it into bankruptcy court because you might get a better result here. That is not what bankruptcy is for.” LaPierre needs to go. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/103 "2021-05-12T18:38:25Z")
So about thirty years ago, [William Aramony](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Aramony) abused his position as head of the national United Way organization, including that he “flew first class, sometimes on the Concorde, used chauffeur-driven town cars and alleged that he had lavished expensive gifts on friends.” (Sound familiar?) Eventually he went to prison. In the meantime, many local United Way chapters refused to support the parent group and I think I’ve read posts here from people refusing to contribute to the United Way because they remember the scandal, even though it’s been thirty years. But the NRA and LaPierre don’t seem to have lost support. Why is that? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/104 "2021-05-12T18:41:00Z")
Because, above all other goals, Pissing Off The Left is primary. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/105 "2021-05-12T18:42:47Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > In the meantime, many local United Way chapters refused to support the parent group and I think I’ve read posts here from people refusing to contribute to the United Way because they remember the scandal, even though it’s been thirty years. At about that time, I was one of the volunteers who led the annual United Way sign-up drive at the company where I worked. We did, indeed, have a number of people who said, “Nope, not gonna sign up,” specifically because of that scandal, and the belief that their donations would only be used to benefit senior management. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/106 "2021-05-12T18:46:33Z")
Heck, people still are angry about the Red Cross (briefly) charging for snacks during WWII > **[The Cost Of Free Doughnuts: 70 Years Of Regret](https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2012/07/13/156737801/the-cost-of-free-doughnuts-70-years-of-regret)** > > When the Red Cross began charging soldiers for snacks during World War II, it learned a painful lesson in the economics of free stuff. > The organization started charging only because the U.S. Secretary of War asked it to. British soldiers had to pay for their snacks, and the free doughnuts for Americans were causing tensions. So the Red Cross complied, after protesting to no avail. It didn’t last long — for most of the last 70 years, Red Cross doughnuts have remained free — but veterans haven’t forgotten. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/107 "2021-05-12T18:54:12Z")
And yet, if you’re not an NRA supporter, you may be delighted to hear that some of its money was misused. Every dollar that went to private plane charters or expensive suits is one less dollar that was available for lobbying or other political activity. I think I’ve read that the NRA was largely not involved in last year’s election. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/108 "2021-05-12T19:04:26Z")
And it should be a concern to everyone whether you join a gun group, an abortion rights group, a green new deal group or any advocacy organization. Of course any of these groups need a quality leader that isn’t working for minimum wage or even staying at a Motel 6 when he/she is on the road. But some thought needs to be given to keeping things in the relevant galaxy. You are run by donations. You keep your overhead as reasonable as possible. The NRA has failed at this basic task. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2021, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/109 "2021-05-12T21:28:42Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > At about that time, I was one of the volunteers who led the annual United Way sign-up drive at the company where I worked. We did, indeed, have a number of people who said, “Nope, not gonna sign up,” specifically because of that scandal, and the belief that their donations would only be used to benefit senior management. Our company were big supporters of the idea of United Way, and I also worked on a lot of campaigns. When the scandal broke, my company dropped UW like a hot rock, and our campaigns were re-named “Employee Contributions.” ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/110 "2021-05-13T20:02:45Z")
This article shows that on the one hand the NRA is in Deep Shit, but on the other: T_here is a very small chance that this all ends with the [dissolution of the NRA](https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/summons_and_complaint_1.pdf). That could mean the NRA’s current leadership would lose control of all the organization’s assets, including its valuable donor lists_. > **[The NRA is in deep legal trouble, and its problems just got even worse](https://www.vox.com/22432148/ny-lawsuit-against-nra-national-rifle-association-letitia-james-wayne-lapierre-texas-bankruptcy)** > > Thoughts and prayers. _Meanwhile, there’s a larger possibility that New York’s courts will allow the NRA to continue operating but will also impose significant sanctions on LaPierre and other top NRA leaders. Those sanctions could include requiring reimbursing the NRA for their own alleged self-dealing, or even removing them from the NRA’s leadership._ _And there’s an even greater possibility these lawsuits reveal humiliating information about LaPierre and other top officials. The NRA faced several [unexpected policy defeats](https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/1/17/18167430/nra-2018-midterms-trump-spending-trouble) during the Trump administration, and it is [caught up in another round of litigation](https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/10/28/20936511/nra-nratv-ackerman-mcqueen-lawsuit-complaint) with one of its former vendors. More embarrassing news about the gun rights group may discourage people from giving to the NRA in the future. NRA supporters, after all, typically give to the organization because they agree with its political views, not because they want to help pay for one of LaPierre’s trips to the Bahamas._ … _Realistically, James’s office faces a tough road if it hopes to dissolve the NRA. New York courts have likened this remedy to a “[judgment … of corporate death](https://casetext.com/case/people-v-oliver-154?resultsNav=false),” and they place a very high burden on state officials seeking to dissolve a corporation. The state often must show that the corporation committed “some sin against the law of its being” that is “material and serious … such as to harm or menace the public welfare.”_ ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2021, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/111 "2021-05-13T23:18:51Z")
> [@](#): > > Those sanctions could include requiring reimbursing the NRA for their own alleged self-dealing, or even removing them from the NRA’s leadership. They might have to give back the money they stole and lose their cushy jobs? That’s really not much of a punishment. ---
**Author:** ![SwissMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e79b87/32.png) [@SwissMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SwissMan)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/112 "2021-05-14T00:45:25Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > More embarrassing news about the gun rights group may discourage people from giving to the NRA in the future. NRA supporters, after all, typically give to the organization because they agree with its political views, not because they want to help pay for one of LaPierre’s trips to the Bahamas. Maybe 20 years ago I would have agreed with this assessment; nowadays, I’m not confident in this at all. We are really discounting how much right wing groups are truly starting to resemble cults. Their supporters are blindly following the leaders. Any information that conflicts with what the leader says is immediately discounted. You can show them pictures of Wayne LaPierre on a private jet flying to the Bahamas, or getting fitted at Brooks Brothers, and they’ll just say it’s a smear job by the liberal media. Problems like this are a good reason why the country is in the state it is in. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/113 "2021-05-14T03:04:22Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > They might have to give back the money they stole and lose their cushy jobs? That’s really not much of a punishment They are more likely to skip town (and country) with the money they stole. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/114 "2021-05-14T03:16:55Z")
Perhaps Wayne LaPierre can find refuge in Mother Russia? ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2021, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/115 "2021-05-14T03:26:27Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > “You have no financial difficulties. You have this one lawsuit which may or may not be politically motivated, but you are a sophisticated party able to fight it. Go fight it. Don’t bring it into bankruptcy court because you might get a better result here. That is not what bankruptcy is for. Yep. “You say the NY AG is persecuting you? Fight her on the merits. You’re big boys and have the resources, you can do that. Don’t come to me to bail you out.” > [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > many local United Way chapters refused to support the parent group and I think I’ve read posts here from people refusing to contribute to the United Way because they remember the scandal, even though it’s been thirty years. But the NRA and LaPierre don’t seem to have lost support. Why is that? LaPierre & Co. have skilfully aided, abetted and used the generation-long increase in tribalism and in an ideological-faith-based view of the world, to make it so that Wayne=NRA=supporting him becomes a matter of “standing up” to “THEM”, meaning the outsider enemy. They have spread and seeded the siege mentality (and probably not little corruption and cronyism for good measure) down into the affiliates. At this point in the game, anyone who wanted to leave the NRA in disgust with LaPierre already left for other groups like the GOA even before the bankruptcy, and those who remain will either believe they can nev r have it this good again, or be convinced that this is some sort of Last Stand against someone who wants to destroy them for the sake of destroying them, so let’s stand together and even if he’s a rat bastard, he’s the rat bastard that stands up for us. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2021, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/116 "2021-05-17T17:30:12Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Perhaps Wayne LaPierre can find refuge in Mother Russia? Maybe he can crash on Maria Butina’s couch? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2023, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/117 "2023-02-10T13:29:16Z")
Bump. Recent NRA financial statements show major drop in NRA membership, and in related revenue from membership fees. It’s believed that the NRA has lost over a million members and is now just over 4.2 million members, a bit over the 4 million members it had in 2012. Corruption allegations may have had an impact. > **[The NRA Has Lost Over a Million Members Since Corruption Allegations Surfaced](https://thereload.com/nra-has-lost-over-a-million-members-since-corruption-allegations-surfaced/)** > > The National Rifle Association keeps shrinking. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2023, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/118 "2023-02-10T13:57:32Z")
[![](https://i0.wp.com/brightestyoungthings.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Simpsons-nelson-ha-ha-93-p-672x480.jpg?quality=100&ssl=1) ](https://i0.wp.com/brightestyoungthings.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/Simpsons-nelson-ha-ha-93-p-672x480.jpg?quality=100&ssl=1) ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2023, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/119 "2023-02-10T14:08:09Z")
While a 20% drop in membership is a blow to this infamous gun manufacturing lobby, I’m far from convinced this portends their ultimate demise. ---
**Author:** ![Akaj](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/akaj/32/145_2.png) [@Akaj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Akaj)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2023, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635/120 "2023-02-10T14:16:05Z")
More to the point, fearmongering about Dems taking away people’s guns seems to be just as effective as ever with GOP voters. The NRA could probably evaporate tomorrow without diminishing the power of that BS message. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rip-nra-d/930635.md?page=7)