# Rishi Sunak tries to lead the UK **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 24, 2022, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706 "2022-10-24T13:07:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2023, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/322 "2023-02-24T13:11:49Z")
I don’t know how things work in the rich and extravagant first world, but here in impoverished Buenos Aires I buy a kilo or two of tomatoes and one of cucumbers, I’d never buy only 2 or 3 of them, I would have to go back to the store the next day if I bought so few. This usually results in my fridge containing about 8 to 16 tomatoes and 5 or 6 cucumbers (less if they are big) which I’ll consume in about 4 days before going back to the store for more. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2023, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/323 "2023-02-24T13:39:50Z")
Sure, and I’m not surprised to learn some people - especially in a warmer climate - consume more fresh tomato and cucumber than we do (we probably average one cucumber a week and one pack of cherry tomatoes, for cooking we generally use tinned tomatoes). But I used to work at a supermarket in the UK, and as I recall it would be very unusual for a typical ‘weekly shop’ to contain more than one cucumber (or perhaps two). My main point is that imposing a limit of 3 cucumbers seems rather pointless unless people are panic-buying, and just stops the handful of people who legitimately wish to consume a higher than average amount. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2023, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/324 "2023-02-24T14:06:37Z")
> [@Dead\_Cat](#): > > It’s not as if you can stockpile fresh tomatoes like toilet paper, they go bad after a few days Some people eat a _lot_ of tomatoes. Like, nearly every day, for the whole family. I know we certainly go through a few punnets of small (Rosa, Bella or heirloom) tomatoes a week. Easily 4 or 5. They do not get a chance to go bad round these parts. So this would entail shopping more regularly, at least twice a week if not every couple of days (which is actually how I do shop, but not everyone does). ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2023, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/325 "2023-02-24T14:24:19Z")
Gotcha, cultural differences, we practically never use tinned tomatoes for example. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2023, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/326 "2023-02-24T14:26:33Z")
I just read a fascinating article in the current Mar/Apr issue of _Foreign Affairs_ on the historical reasons for UK unity, their increasing irrelevance, and the likely future trajectory. It was written in the last few months after Sunak became PM, but before Sturgeon resigned as First Minister in Scotland. The article addresses the UK unity problems Sunak will face that he seems ill-suited to manage. The article is paywalled. I don’t know what their policy on intro freebie articles is, so some of you may be able to see it anyhow: **[Disunited Kingdom: Will Nationalism Break Britain? | Foreign Affairs](https://www.foreignaffairs.com/europe/disunited-kingdom-nationalism-break-britain-fintan-otoole)** ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2023, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/327 "2023-02-24T14:44:04Z")
Ran out of time on an edit, so sorry to double post: The article with a couple of embedded pictures runs to 15 printed pages, so it’s impractical for me to usefully pick out quotes. But the punchline is that either the sitting UK government finds a way to re-kindle unity in the UK or it’ll either tear itself apart quickly or lock into a track to fall apart slowly. The near future will be decisive. ---
**Author:** ![pjd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pjd/32/3009_2.png) [@pjd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pjd)\ **Post date:** [February 24, 2023, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/328 "2023-02-24T14:47:15Z")
> [@Dead\_Cat](#): > > My main point is that imposing a limit of 3 cucumbers seems rather pointless Well, they’ll sell 3 times as many cucumbers ! It’s a marketing ploy. ---
**Author:** ![Shalmanese](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shalmanese](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shalmanese)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2023, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/329 "2023-02-25T01:40:03Z")
> [@Treppenwitz](#): > > **Environment Secretary Therese Coffey has suggested turnips could be a suitable alternative while other vegetables remain in short supply.** … > **[Turnips run out after Tory minister says eat them to avoid shortages](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/supermarkets-turnips-food-shortages-rations-b2288919.html)** > > Turnips are out of stock in Waitrose and Tesco ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2023, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/330 "2023-02-25T02:49:09Z")
OK my understanding is that her turnip suggestion came in response to a shortage of cucumbers and tomatoes in UK supermarkets. Now, I’m no gourmet, but aren’t they completely different vegetables, used in completely different ways? You can’t just sub one in for the other. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [February 25, 2023, 11:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/331 "2023-02-25T11:22:51Z")
It’ll be apples and pears next (would you Adam and Eve it) > **[Apples and pears could be next UK food shortage, farmers warn](https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/feb/24/apples-pears-uk-food-shortage-farmers-leeks)** > > Growers say they do not get paid enough by supermarkets, as supply of leeks also comes under threat ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 26, 2023, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/332 "2023-02-26T05:43:23Z")
I wonder how long before American agribusiness tries to make a killing, importing some of these scarce fruits and vegetables into the UK? ---
**Author:** ![ShadowFacts](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shadowfacts/32/2934_2.png) [@ShadowFacts](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShadowFacts)\ **Post date:** [February 27, 2023, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/333 "2023-02-27T20:53:04Z")
[Britain and the European Union agree to a new Brexit deal](https://www.nytimes.com/live/2023/02/27/world/northern-ireland-brexit-trade-deal#britain-and-the-european-union-agree-to-a-new-brexit-deal-heres-the-latest). (NY Times link, paywalled) > Britain and the European Union struck a deal on Monday to end a festering dispute over post-Brexit trade rules for Northern Ireland, a diplomatic achievement that could resolve one of the most poisonous legacies of Britain’s exit from Europe’s trade bloc. > > The deal, known as the Windsor Framework, came after [weeks of confidential talks](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/17/world/europe/sunak-northern-ireland-uk.html). It could avert a potential trade war between Britain and the European Union and smooth over relations between Britain and its European neighbors that have been strained since Brexit. It might open the door to the restoration of Northern Ireland’s government. > Under the terms of Monday’s deal, goods moving from Britain to Northern Ireland that were intended to stay there would pass through a “green” channel without routine checks. Those destined for Ireland would pass through a “red” channel that would have more controls. The agreement also diminishes the role of the European Court of Justice, the E.U. judicial branch, in adjudicating any trade disputes. Gotta think this is a pretty big win for Sunak, as early reaction from most quarters (and particularly the business community) is largely positive, or at least optimistic. And good ol’ Boris was dead set against certain provisions of it, so that’s gotta feel good for Sunak to stuff it to him, too 😉 One wonders how this might change the perception/fortunes of the Tories overall. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 12:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/334 "2023-02-28T12:55:32Z")
So, this appears to be an actual success. It looks like the UK have won concessions from the EU that had previously been thought unachievable. The Brexit nutters haven’t immediately thrown their toys out the pram, although they are reserving judgement until they’ve thoroughly studied it. The DUP are making noises but they do get a pretty big win in terms of the Stormont Brake (which, by giving a lot of power to the NIA is again doing something that was thought undo-able not so long ago). The UK government have said that this means tehy won’t proceed with the controversial NI Bill which would have unilaterally violated teh Withdrawal Agreement. If all that holds, Sunak will have managed to undo one of the more ludicrous messes that Johnson left him with. And he’s done it by abandoning the rah-rah confrontational details are for wimps you just have to keep shouting till they understand approach that typified Johnson’s diplomatic efforts. Given that Johnson has been shitting in his hands and clapping for attention in the last week or so by threatening some vague rebellion to the deal, this is a big political win for Sunak. Whether this has long term impact on the Tories fortunes is harder to gauge. The Tories do get a news cycle or two of them looking competent and statesmanlike, standing next to EU diplomats in a spirit of positive bonhomie. However, to a first approximation nobody in Great Britain cares about Northern Ireland and most people won’t be aware that there was a problem, let alone what it was. And all that’s really happened is that NI has been returned to something more like the pre-Brexit status quo. So compared to e.g. solving the cost of living problem this isn’t going to move the needle very much. There is a minor trap for Sunak here - he’s actually come out and said that the people of NI are lucky because they have privileged access to the UK market and the EU single market and “no one else has that.” This is very close to saying that Brexit was bad for the rest of the UK and that is a dodgy spot for him to be occupying. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/335 "2023-02-28T12:58:43Z")
I can’t imagine much will change with a new “deal”. It’s not as if they actually implemented the previous “deal”, not Johnson, not Truss, and not Sunak. What’s the value in THAT signature now? Unionists will still riot. Nothing will change on UK mainland for Brexit. To get a view of how mad Unionists are, I’ll describe a moment when I forgot where I was when going to see a band in small town Northern Ireland. The scene: Taxi phoned from outside Ballymena station to go and see Baleful Creed, a northern Irish band. It’s the Queens 70th Jubilee weekend. The protestants LOVE the queen. We’re trying to avoid that. I mistakenly get into a conversation with the taxi driver. Turns out that this is a massive protestant area. Indeed, there appears to be a five hour Orange walk planned (which we saw some people preparing for when we got to the pub) just starting. Opinions of that taxi driver? That f\*\*king Boris Johnson is a wimp. Thatcher would never have giving up to those nazis in the EU. Thatcher SHOULD have nuked Argentina in the Falklands war (despite threats to do so, and it was explained that would not happen on threat of retaliation from the US, according to tales from the time) I shut up after that and stop listening. The driver back was fine. Anyway, in other news, Sunak, a Brexiteer, mistakenly admits the genuine actual truth seven years too late: > **[Sunak: NI in 'unbelievably special position' with access to EU and UK markets...](https://www.itv.com/news/2023-02-28/sunak-ni-in-unbelievably-special-position-with-access-to-eu-and-uk-markets)** > > People criticised the PM's remarks, saying England, Wales and Scotland were in the same position as Northern Ireland before Brexit. | ITV National News ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/336 "2023-02-28T16:23:19Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > I wonder how long before American agribusiness tries to make a killing, importing some of these scarce fruits and vegetables into the UK? This time of year the US gets most of those fruits & veggies from Mexico & points south. Not sure why those countries’ own agribusinesses won’t cut out the middleman of US distributors and sell to the UK themselves. ---
**Author:** ![FurloeRoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@FurloeRoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FurloeRoth)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/337 "2023-02-28T16:46:33Z")
Not sure how much of a killing they’re going to make by rejigging their business model to take advantage of a temporary shortage of salad vegetables that has occured once since Brexit. Perhaps Remain should have campaigned on a platform of “there’ll be this year when it will be harder to find tomatoes for a couple of weeks in February.” They’d have romped home. Anyway, they’re back in stock in my local. Italian grown. ---
**Author:** ![FurloeRoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@FurloeRoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FurloeRoth)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/338 "2023-02-28T16:59:43Z")
As for Sunak’s Northern Ireland deal, I’m not sure how much it actually amounts to, but one thing I will say is that it has been expertly news-managed by Downing St. First, they have been drip-feeding details of progress in the talks, which makes it seem like a fait accompli, and anyone with reservations about it is some swivelled-eyed Brexit stick-in-the-mud; second, they have got prominent Brexiteers on board, like Steve Baker (perhaps soon to be Sir Steve, who can say? 😉 ); and third they have given it the rather grand title of the Windsor Framework, and even, rather naughtily, roped in the king to give it an air of legitimacy and finality. ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2023, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/339 "2023-02-28T20:13:36Z")
Yes, that has been played very well. And the EU have collaborated with set piece events and Macron coming out to praise it. As much as anything else, the general air that business is being done is the big win here. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/340 "2023-03-01T13:49:48Z")
> [@Frodo](#): > > This usually results in my fridge containing about 8 to 16 tomatoes and 5 or 6 cucumbers (less if they are big) which I’ll consume in about 4 days before going back to the store for more. I’m sorry for the hijack, but but… you put tomatoes IN THE FRIDGE 😱 ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2023, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/341 "2023-03-01T14:09:00Z")
> [@Smid](#): > > Anyway, in other news, Sunak, a Brexiteer, mistakenly admits the genuine actual truth seven years too late This is the weirdest thing about their messaging, and I have trouble believing it won’t produce any blowback: “Look how lucky they are to be inside the EU! Their economic opportunities are gonna skyrocket!” How can this pass without recognition or comment? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706.md?page=18)