# Rishi Sunak tries to lead the UK **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 24, 2022, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706 "2022-10-24T13:07:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 28
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/542 "2023-11-16T11:58:28Z")
Cynically, this is probably the best result for the Tories. If the plan had been ruled lawful, they’d have had to go ahead with it and that would mean: a) we’d see how little impact it actually had on the backlog of asylum claims; b) we’d start to hear about appalling treatment of refugees in Rwanda and c) they’d somehow make a mess of it because they are at heart incompetent. Instead, they get to blame their failure on interfering leftie lawyers, unelected judges and foreign courts. This is meat and drink to them. It is their happy place. Sunak has lost no time in coming out swinging against all three of the above “enemies of the people”. The party Deputy Chair, Lee Anderson, went one better and said they should just fly the planes to Rwanda in defiance of the law. Because if there’s one ting the Conservative and Unionist Party of Great Britain and Northern Ireland has always stood four-square against, it’s the rule of law. ---
**Author:** ![Toffe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e19adc/32.png) [@Toffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toffe)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/543 "2023-11-16T14:55:26Z")
According to the Guardian / Home Secretary Cleverly, the Rwanda flights will still go ahead: > **[Cleverly ‘determined’ to get removal flight to Rwanda before general election](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2023/nov/16/james-cleverly-determined-removal-flight-rwanda-before-general-election)** > > Home secretary says legally binding treaty will be drafted ‘within days’ despite policy being ruled unlawful > Ministers are “absolutely determined” to get a removal flight to Rwanda off before the next election, and will finish drafting a legally binding treaty with the country “within days”, the home secretary, [James Cleverly](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/james-cleverly), has said, after the policy was ruled unlawful. Why is this so important to the government? Typically governments around the world will promise (whether they actually mean it or not) to e.g. improve access to health care, improve education, improve standard of living, etc. The tories, now having left the world’s biggest trading bloc, now seem laser-focused on… shipping desperate asylum-seekers attempting to make a better lives for themselves and their families while contributing to their host country’s economy and society, to Rwanda at great cost to the taxpayer and no benefit to anyone. What’s the actual goal or policy behind it, beyond “the cruelty is the point”? If it’s about not hosting asylum-seekers, they could simply deny asylum to more applicants, surely? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/544 "2023-11-16T14:59:40Z")
The cruelty is the point. That’s it. And there is a certain pro-cruelty demographic who will vote Tory because of it. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/545 "2023-11-16T15:09:02Z")
> [@Toffe](#): > > If it’s about not hosting asylum-seekers, they could simply deny asylum to more applicants, surely? Ah, but the aforementioned lefty lawyers/activist judges/tofu-eating wokerati/blob would tie up that many more cases in appeals. Somehow the idea that it might just be more cost-effective to employ more assessors, simplify procedures and get decisions right in the first place doesn’t seem to have any traction. Because “taking control” of the immigration system doesn’t mean that sort of control, so much as just keeping numbers down to levels arbitrarily decided as the most the community can accept. ---
**Author:** ![Toffe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e19adc/32.png) [@Toffe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toffe)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/546 "2023-11-16T15:16:08Z")
And pro-cruelty (ex-)members of government, of course, eg. Braverman and Patel. But if that’s really **it** , I don’t understand how they’re so incompetent about it. AIUI the push to send asylum-seekers to Rwanda has been going on for years but keeps getting stalled in courts, for fairly obvious reasons. But if I was a cruel empathy-free far-right Britain First scheming pillock tory (but I repeat myself), I would think I’d be able to dream up a more successful solution, if the end goal is to (1) be cruel (2) get rid of asylum-seekers (3) grab the pro-cruelty vote. For example, turning back all boats and damn the consequences; denying asylum immediately to anyone crossing from France as they ought to have sought asylum in the first safe country they entered; and processing asylum claims faster (with a lean towards “no” in all but extreme cases). Or simply shipping off all asylum seekers to camps on, say, the Falklands or South Georgia as it’s still UK territory, something like Austtralia does with Nauru I believe? That ought to get the same level of cruelty and similar levels of “deterrence” (if it works at all) with less of the incompetence or legal barriers. **PatrickLondon** > Ah, but the aforementioned lefty lawyers/activist judges/tofu-eating wokerati/blob would tie up more cases in appeals. As opposed to tying up the whole Rwanda scheme in courts for years, and now potentially tying it up in the Lords. I _get_ it, sort of, but I don’t get why they willingly look incompetent on a core issue, when it seems like they could annoy “the left” just as much with a more workable alternative. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/547 "2023-11-16T15:18:27Z")
> [@Toffe](#): > > I don’t get why they willingly look incompetent on a core issue Because they _are_ incompetent. “Willing” has nothing to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/548 "2023-11-16T15:26:27Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > The cruelty is the point. I’m not so sure. If British authoritarians are anything like American ones, I think their first goal is riling up their base. If they successfully shipped off the Africans when they first tried, it’d be in the news and then forgotten. But by trying and failing and trying again and again, they keep themselves and their goals in the news. That’s a win for them. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2023, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/549 "2023-11-16T20:48:54Z")
Why’s the Rwandan government willing to play ball? Big payments by HMG? ---
**Author:** ![UDS1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e47774/32.png) [@UDS1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS1)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2023, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/550 "2023-11-17T02:15:05Z")
> [@Toffe](#): > > Why is this so important to the government? Typically governments around the world will promise (whether they actually mean it or not) to e.g. improve access to health care, improve education, improve standard of living, etc. The Tories have failed miserably on all of these issues and have no credibility on any of them. The point of the Rwanda obsession is that it serves as a distraction from these things. The Tories can’t deliver competence or honesty but they _can_ deliver performative cruelty. It’s a “dead cat” tactic - it delights the (hopefully small) base that values or admires cruelty, and it distracts the public discourse from issues that actually matter to the (hopefully larger) base that prioritizes competence, honesty, good policy, good administration, etc. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2023, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/551 "2023-11-17T06:09:45Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Why’s the Rwandan government willing to play ball? Big payments by HMG? Money (£140 million already) and maybe they think it gives them some international cover against criticism of their hunan rights record. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2023, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/552 "2023-11-17T08:06:36Z")
Urgent news as Rishi takes charge of a crisis! > **[Rishi Sunak sets out how pothole funding from HS2 savings to be used](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67441085)** > > Councils say the money is a "significant boost" but call for longer term funding to repair roads. They’ll be reinventing the [cones hotline](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cones_Hotline) next. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2023, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/553 "2023-11-17T15:49:34Z")
Thanks, **PaLo**. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2023, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/554 "2023-12-08T15:44:11Z")
> [@Stanislaus](#): > > More seriously, as a Ministerial appointee, Cameron is dodgy as fuck. There was the whole Panama Papers thing; his involvement with Greensill encompasses both giving his chum Lex Greensill official access to government departments and nakedly lobbying for them once he’d left office (until they went spectacularly insolvent, that is). I think you are giving the whole government far too much credit. Sunak himself has ties to contracts which in any normal world, would be linked to insider trading ([BP Deal](https://www.thenational.scot/news/23697572.rishi-sunaks-family-firm-infosys-signed-1-5b-deal-bp/) and [Nanny company](https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/rishi-sunak-wife-akshata-koru-kids-budget-b1070740.html), and these are just the obvious ones). I have absolutely no doubt that the backbenches practice insider trading based on advance warning on government policies. The billions in dodgy PPE to “Tory Donors”, left uninvestigated shows exactly how blatant and careless they are. Cameron is just “one of the boys” who’s done it, and the press and tory voters seem uninterested or forgetful on the subject. ---
**Author:** ![Smid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/838e76/32.png) [@Smid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smid)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2023, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/555 "2023-12-08T15:48:10Z")
Rumblings are current on about letters to the 1922 committee on Sunak. There is apparently a line. International laughing stock was fine with Brexit for a third of the party, but becoming International Pariahs dropping from the European Court of Human Rights seems a step too far. I’m sure, as usual, they’ll be bought out. However, they usual buy out of positions in the government doesn’t work, given they can’t work in private sector for 18 months after they leave the government, and many don’t expect to survive the next election. So normal rules do not apply (the rules which managed to force through a whole rack of shameful policies under Johnson and Sunak). That’s why Cameron is in there, BTW, they can’t get anyone else. ---
**Author:** ![pjd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pjd/32/3009_2.png) [@pjd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pjd)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2023, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/556 "2023-12-09T12:08:04Z")
They appear to be a bunch of arrogant, greedy, selfish, conceited, narcissistic, hypocritical scumbags. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2023, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/557 "2023-12-09T14:42:48Z")
Well duh… ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2023, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/558 "2023-12-09T16:23:18Z")
A fair and dispassionate assessment. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2023, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/559 "2023-12-15T12:41:35Z")
And yet another bye-election may be in prospect as a result of a Tory MP’s shenanigans: > **[Potential by-election as ex-Tory MP Scott Benton faces Commons suspension](https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-67714132)** > > Scott Benton committed a "very serious breach" of parliamentary rules, standards watchdog finds. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/560 "2023-12-20T11:10:10Z")
And one more by-election is definitely on the cards: > **[Peter Bone: How Wellingborough ended up with a by-election](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-67759402)** > > A recall petition leads to the ousting of Peter Bone MP and the constituency will go to the polls. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2023, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rishi-sunak-tries-to-lead-the-uk/973706/561 "2023-12-20T11:25:50Z")
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