# RO alert: British tabloids sink to an all-time shit-sucking low **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 4, 2011, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850 "2011-07-04T22:13:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/41 "2011-07-06T06:02:11Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > Paranoid prediction: Mulcaire will be found hanging in his cell. “Couldn’t take the shame,” they’ll say. No chance. Mulcaire’s already spilled enough dirt that his disappearance now would raise far too many questions. My guess. He will come forward and say that he was acting completely alone, that his tactics were not sanctioned or known of by Wade/Brooks. Coulson may put his hand up as well and take management level blame. Jail sentences, if any, will be minimal. The government will say how a few bad apples have ruined journalism’s reputation, and roll out some ineffectual regulation changes Then, in a few years, both scapegoats will disappear into very well funded retirement. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/42 "2011-07-06T06:12:35Z")
> [@Gary\_Kumquat](#): > > My guess. He will come forward and say that he was acting completely alone, that his tactics were not sanctioned or known of by Wade/Brooks. He’s already [said](http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2011/jul/05/phone-hacking-glenn-mulcaire-apology): > [@](#): > > Working for the News of the World was never easy. There was relentless pressure. There was a constant demand for results. I knew what we did pushed the limits ethically. But, at the time, I didn’t understand that I had broken the law at all. So far we’ve got the PI, the NoW journos, Rebekahaha, News International, Murdoch, the Met and the Prime Minister [defending](http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2011/jan/17/david-cameron-andy-coulson-second-chance) his Director of Communications - who’s now been revealed to have been [paying off the cops](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8619499/Phone-hacking-News-International-hand-police-Andy-Coulson-emails.html). This is huge, and getting bigger and bigger. I sincerely hope the shit will stick where it’s meant to, but don’t hold out much hope. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/43 "2011-07-06T06:18:45Z")
I hear Ian Huntley’s outraged his phone was hacked. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 6:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/44 "2011-07-06T06:46:31Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > He’s already [said](http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2011/jul/05/phone-hacking-glenn-mulcaire-apology) > > > [@](#): > > > > Working for the News of the World was never easy. There was relentless pressure. There was a constant demand for results. I knew what we did pushed the limits ethically. But, at the time, I didn’t understand that I had broken the law at all. Please note how that statement leaves plenty of room to either take the blame (“I cracked under the pressure and went too far”) or point the finger (“Coulson/Wade knew what I was doing and approved it”). ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/45 "2011-07-06T09:00:34Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Are you sure about that? Because that’s not what I heard and what **jjimm** said above. Also, that assumes that someone in the phone company can look up your password. I can’t imagine it’s that simple; my limited experience with computer security is that the IT staff can reset your password, but they can’t see what it’s currently set to. This has been running for years and I’ve followed it closely. People involved say they bribe telephone companies all the time. If they can reset a password they can reset it to one their client knows for one thing. They bribe them for unlisted numbers also. They also obtain detailed bank account details. The most recent ‘revelations’ are payments to police. Tabloid news is a ruthless big business with deep pockets and people everywhere are weak and easily corruptible. [More info](http://fotozine.eu/news-international-phone-hacking-and-professional-ethics/) It won’t let me right-click copy and paste quotes but you can see the technique extends to bribing engineers to tap phones. Also sending viruses in attachments that hijack the phone. [More from the Guardian investigation](http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2011/mar/11/jonathan-rees-private-investigator-tabloid) > [@](#): > > One person who is familiar with Rees’s operations claims that he or one of his associates started using Trojan Horse software, which allowed them to email a target’s computer and copy the contents of its hard disk. This source claims that they used this tactic when they were hired by the News of the World to gather background on Freddy Scapaticci, a former IRA man who had been exposed as an MI6 informer codenamed Stakeknife. > > Two other sources claim that Rees was commissioning burglaries. One is a private investigator who was told directly by Rees’s network that they had broken into targets’ home on behalf of a Fleet Street newspaper. > [@](#): > > The bug betrayed the sheer speed and ease with which Rees was able to penetrate the flimsy fence of privacy that shields the vast reservoir of personal information now held on the databases controlled by the police and the DVLA, the phone companies and banks. On one occasion, he was asked to find out about the owner of a Porsche. Armed with the registration number, it took him a grand total of 34 minutes to come up with the owner’s name and home address from the DVLA and his criminal record from the police computer. > > When the Daily Mirror wanted the private mortgage details of all the governors of the Bank of England, Rees delivered. > > When the Sunday Mirror wanted to get inside the bank accounts of Prince Edward and the Countess of Wessex, it was equally easy, as the bug recorded: ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 10:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/46 "2011-07-06T10:12:44Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > Paranoid prediction: Mulcaire will be found hanging in his cell. “Couldn’t take the shame,” they’ll say. Is he in prison? The Guardian claims to have just commented on a doorstep interview with him. > **[News of the World phone hacking – Wednesday 6 July 2011](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/2011/jul/06/news-of-the-world-phone-hacking-live)** > > The latest developments in the phone-hacking scandal including PMQs and the emergency debate in the Commons. > [@](#): > > 10.51am: Talking of Glenn Mulcaire, BBC News have just broadcast a doorstep interview with him this morning. It must be the worst doorstep I’ve ever seen ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 10:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/47 "2011-07-06T10:13:39Z")
Now we get to it, payments to corrupt police for details such as phone number to enable hacking. So previous police investigations of this brought few results and generallly ran into the sand, not hard to work out what went on here. The fact that entire investigations appear from the outside to have been compromised indicates the extent of this corruption. This is getting bigger and bigger, as I earlier mentioned in my paranoid fantasy, it seems entirely possible that the police and the press have colluded to use this as a way of wire tapping so they can get around judicial oversight. Every trade unionist understands that telephones are not secure, I wonder how much information has been gathered by the poolice regarding protests and industrial action using this alliance with the press instead of presenting their case before the judiciary for phone taps. One wonders how much MP communication has been monitored this way and has subsequently made it out into the national press as ‘unsourced leaks’ ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_Kumquat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4491bb/32.png) [@Gary\_Kumquat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_Kumquat)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/48 "2011-07-06T10:19:59Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > Every trade unionist understands that telephones are not secure, I wonder how much information has been gathered by the poolice regarding protests and industrial action using this alliance with the press instead of presenting their case before the judiciary for phone taps. If you ever do want a reasonably secure conversation without going to extreme lengths, Skype is currently a good bet. That is likely to change though, considering their new owners. ---
**Author:** ![Cumbrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@Cumbrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumbrian)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/49 "2011-07-06T14:33:02Z")
[http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2011/jul/06/andy-coulson-phone-hacking](http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2011/jul/06/andy-coulson-phone-hacking) Here’s the stuff I was referring to upthread about Brooks potentially trapping herself in a lie. I’d kind of got it wrong - mea culpa - but the paper did publish a story about a voicemail from Millie Dowler’s voicemail during Brook’s tenure as editor of NotW - which theoretically means she did know about this. Conveniently, it is claimed by News Int that Brooks was on holiday in Italy during the period that this story was produced. Apparently, she was also on holiday around the time of the Soham murders; the families of the victims seemingly also having had their phones hacked by NotW. Two things are happening - one, the future of Brooks at News Int has obviously become a priority for the company. They are doing anything they can to remove the possibilty that she is at fault. The second thing, by extension, is that Andy Coulson, as he was her deputy at the time, is being hung out to dry. I would imagine he is going to be the fall guy - given he no longer works for NotW or News Int, I imagine that the corporation will claim that they have conducted investigations and such practices are no longer being used and thus try to worm their way out of sanction. Coulson deserves what is coming to him. Someone needs to be able to pin something substantial on Brooks though - it’s pretty wearing how she seems to have an excuse at every turn. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/50 "2011-07-06T14:42:39Z")
When I opened this thread I didn’t think this would really be an all-time low, but it might be. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/51 "2011-07-06T14:46:32Z")
> [@Cumbrian](#): > > Coulson deserves what is coming to him. Someone needs to be able to pin something substantial on Brooks though - it’s pretty wearing how she seems to have an excuse at every turn. She’s News International’s lead investigator of the issue so don’t plan on holding your breath too long. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/52 "2011-07-06T14:48:19Z")
> [@amanset](#): > > Is he in prison? The Guardian claims to have just commented on a doorstep interview with him. > > [News of the World phone hacking – Wednesday 6 July 2011 | Politics | theguardian.com](http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/blog/2011/jul/06/news-of-the-world-phone-hacking-live) Served his time and is out. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/53 "2011-07-06T14:48:21Z")
> [@Cicero](#): > > However- the police in charge of the investigation need their arses kicked for not securing the information. If this voicemail was so important they should have had access to it immediately with their own password plus the messages should not have been left only on that one device. If the police changed the password how could the (presumably alive) victim access her messages? ---
**Author:** ![Cumbrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@Cumbrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumbrian)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/54 "2011-07-06T14:56:50Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > She’s News International’s lead investigator of the issue so don’t plan on holding your breath too long. Maybe. Maybe not.. From my fingers to [insert deity of choice]'s Internet connection, it would appear. From today’s debate in the Commons, Tom Watson MP speaking: [QUOTE=Tom Watson MP] I want to inform the House of further evidence that suggests Rebekah Brooks knew about the unlawful tactics of News of the World as early as 2002, despite all her denials yesterday. Rebekah Brooks was present at a meeting with Scotland Yard when police officers pursing a murder investigation provided her with evidence that her newspaper was interfering with the pursuit of justice. They gave her the name of another executive at News International, Alex Marunchak. The meeting, which included Dick Fedorcio of the Metropolitan police, told her that News of the World staff were guilty of interference and party to using unlawful means to attempt to discredit a police officer and his wife. She was told of actions by people she paid to expose and discredit David Cook and his wife Jackie Haines so that Mr Cook would be prevented from completing an investigation into a murder. News International were paying people to interfer with police officers and were doing so on behalf of known criminals. We know now that News International had entered the criminal underworld. She cannot deny being present at this meeting when the actions of people she was paying were exposed. She cannot deny now being warned that under her auspices unlawful tactics were being used with the purpose of interfering with the pursuit of justice. She cannot deny that one of her staff, Alex Marunchak, was named and involved. She cannot deny either that she was told by the police that her own paper was using unlawful tactics, in this case to help one of her law-breaking investigators. This in my views shows her culpability goes beyond taking the blame as head of the organisation. It is about direct knowledge of unlawful behaviour. And was Mr Marunchak dismissed. No. He was promoted. [/QUOTE] ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/55 "2011-07-06T15:03:13Z")
> [@Cumbrian](#): > > Here’s the stuff I was referring to upthread about Brooks potentially trapping herself in a lie. I’d kind of got it wrong - mea culpa - but the paper did publish a story about a voicemail from Millie Dowler’s voicemail during Brook’s tenure as editor of NotW - which theoretically means she did know about this. I’m not fan of NOTW or the rest of the Murdoch empire, but isn’t it plausible that they got the information about the voicemail message when conducting an interview with the family? It just doesn’t feel like rock-solid “evidence” to me. ---
**Author:** ![Cumbrian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ce7236/32.png) [@Cumbrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cumbrian)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/56 "2011-07-06T15:09:13Z")
> [@amanset](#): > > I’m not fan of NOTW or the rest of the Murdoch empire, but isn’t it plausible that they got the information about the voicemail message when conducting an interview with the family? > > It just doesn’t feel like rock-solid “evidence” to me. The voicemail referred to in the article was from an employment agency - not from the family. I am no tech expert, so, to me, it’s possible that the family could have had access to her voicemail and referred to this message from the employment agency in interviews - but it seems unlikely to me that they had this access given that the initial story here is about how the family were given false hope because they weren’t getting inbox full messages from her phone, as messages were being deleted - thus leading them to believe that their daughter was still alive. It is also possible that they did not directly hack the voicemail account and paid off a phone company worker to do it for them. This would also be pretty reprehensible. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/57 "2011-07-06T15:31:07Z")
> [@Cumbrian](#): > > The voicemail referred to in the article was from an employment agency - not from the family. I am no tech expert, so, to me, it’s possible that the family could have had access to her voicemail and referred to this message from the employment agency in interviews - but it seems unlikely to me that they had this access given that the initial story here is about how the family were given false hope because they weren’t getting inbox full messages from her phone, as messages were being deleted - thus leading them to believe that their daughter was still alive. > > It is also possible that they did not directly hack the voicemail account and paid off a phone company worker to do it for them. This would also be pretty reprehensible. Ah, I thought the “false hope” was from them monitoring the inbox themselves and seeing changes. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/58 "2011-07-06T21:35:38Z")
BBC, The Telegraph and the Daily Mail all now reporting that family members of servicemen killed in Iraq and Afghanistan were targeted. What a fucking mess. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/59 "2011-07-06T21:38:26Z")
And now… it’s been revealed that more victims of Murdoch’s associates are the families of soldiers killed in Afghanistan. Cunts. ---
**Author:** ![Tatterdemalion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/43a26b/32.png) [@Tatterdemalion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tatterdemalion)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2011, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850/60 "2011-07-06T21:46:10Z")
> [@jjimm](#): > > And now… it’s been revealed that more victims of Murdoch’s associates are the families of soldiers killed in Afghanistan. > > Cunts. You cannot hope to bribe or twist (thank God!) the British journalist. But, seeing what the man will do unbribed, there’s no occasion to. Wolfe, Humbert [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ro-alert-british-tabloids-sink-to-an-all-time-shit-sucking-low/587850.md?page=4)