# Robin Williams was a groper **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 21, 2018, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976 "2018-03-21T17:39:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/21 "2018-03-21T19:54:08Z")
> [@NDP](#): > > we’ll be lucky if Gregorian chant is the only thing left to listen to. You might want to sit down while I tell you some bad news about what’s been going on in the Catholic Church. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Dope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ccd318/32.png) [@The\_Dope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Dope)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/22 "2018-03-21T19:55:04Z")
please don’t tarnish williams legacy :smack: ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/23 "2018-03-21T19:55:50Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Nonsense. If another man had come up and grabbed your dick through your pants, would you have dismissed it as a joke? If a man at your wife’s workplace (or your mother’s or your daughter’s) had grabbed her breasts or ass, would you have called it a joke? Yeah, men slapped each other on the ass pretty commonly. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/24 "2018-03-21T20:08:50Z")
> [@The\_Dope](#): > > please don’t tarnish williams legacy :smack: Yeah, leave our treasured memories of him as a coked-up whirlwind intact! ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/25 "2018-03-21T20:22:22Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > It was possible to joke around about sex, forty years ago. > > People understood the difference in a joke and malicious sexual intent > > Different time, different world. Those days are gone. This kind of feels right, except it’s very general and not strictly true in my experience. People are still people, and there are still plenty who can see the funny in mocking malice. As long as you know your audience, you’re gonna bond. What’s changed is we’re more likely to respect when someone pipes up with, “But I DON’T think that’s funny and I’d appreciate not being included in those sorts of jokes.” As for Dawber, it’s possible Williams pegged her as someone with a thick NY hide who could take the full force of his mania. She certainly played well across from him on screen. I’d be interested to know what advice Jonathan Winters (Williams’ hero/mentor, and also bipolar) gave to young Robin. About everything. Because for someone afflicted with a condition characterized by poor impulse control, remarkably little filth is to be found on Williams. And, [Here’s this](http://www.meanstars.com/celebrity/robin-williams/209). Have fun! ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/26 "2018-03-21T20:23:37Z")
**[Moderating]** > [@CarnalK](#): > > It really isn’t. She was on a plane full of people, not actually touched and Franken was mugging for a camera. You are seriously delusional on that comparison. Attack the argument, not the poster. The former is allowed. The latter is personal insults, and is not allowed. This is a formal Warning. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/27 "2018-03-21T20:26:35Z")
[Not moderating] Why is this even a story? Someone did sexual things with someone else, and both consented. That’s been going on for all of history. Your grandparents did it, too. So what? ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/28 "2018-03-21T20:29:12Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Why is this even a story? Because “OMG Sexual Harassment!” is a hot topic that gets clicks, even if the supposed victim states that she wasn’t harassed. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/29 "2018-03-21T20:45:21Z")
The key word that nobody has used in this thread is “unwelcome”. It really doesn’t matter if we are talking 2018, 1977, or 1492. The same exact behavior can be considered bad or not-bad, all depending on if it is “unwelcome”. It appears that Ms. Dawber did not state that Mr. William’s behavior was unwelcome, so then this is a non-story. It is unfortunate that biased outsiders categorize events to fit their narrative. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2018, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/30 "2018-03-21T22:19:52Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > You might want to sit down while I tell you some bad news about what’s been going on in the Catholic Church. That’s why I said “if”. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/31 "2018-03-22T00:54:03Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > The key word that nobody has used in this thread is “unwelcome”. It really doesn’t matter if we are talking 2018, 1977, or 1492. The same exact behavior can be considered bad or not-bad, all depending on if it is “unwelcome”. It appears that Ms. Dawber did not state that Mr. William’s behavior was unwelcome, so then this is a non-story. See post #15 > [@JRDelirious](#): > > Which however would not excuse the behavior if unwelcomed or exploitative, or if it was still going on 30 years later… > (…) > Today we do seem to have moved to a standard that whether the target of the behavior welcomed it or not is irrelevant, and context be damned, which is a justifiable reaction to a culture of excuses – but I can imagine individuals saying “hey, wait, so how I feel is still not what matters?” ---
**Author:** ![DavidwithanR](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3bc359/32.png) [@DavidwithanR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidwithanR)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/32 "2018-03-22T01:22:19Z")
I think the sensible conclusion, both now and in the 1970s or whatever decade, is that you can’t do something to another person if they don’t like it, and that if you don’t know for sure whether they like it or not, then you have to ask them. With the added caution that from now on you sure as hell better not guess wrong about whether they’re going to like it. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/33 "2018-03-22T01:38:10Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > See post #15 Duly noted, and thank you! ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/34 "2018-03-22T01:40:35Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > It was possible to joke around about sex, forty years ago. > > People understood the difference in a joke and malicious sexual intent > > Different time, different world. Those days are gone. It is possible to joke around about sex now too. The power dynamic is changing, and the malicious intent in older humor is more obvious. Different time. Different world. I don’t miss those days at all. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/35 "2018-03-22T02:29:50Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > It was possible to joke around about sex, forty years ago. […] > > It used to be possible to touched in a joking way. :rolleyes: It’s **still** possible to joke around about sex, and to touch people in a joking way, **as long as all the people involved are okay with it**. What’s becoming less possible these days is for nasty jerks, creeps and bullies to get away with touching other people who are **not** okay with it, and excusing it on the grounds that they were “just joking”. > [@aceplace57](#): > > Pam didn’t accuse Robin of touching her V. That absolutely would be crossing the line. Really? If she had in fact been okay with having her vagina (which is not actually a dirty or forbidden word) touched, and thought it was just in fun, then why would it have been “crossing the line”? See, part of the change that’s happening now is that criteria of acceptable behavior are shifting away from some kind of arbitrary “line-crossing” rulebook that was normalized by a bunch of lecherous creeps back in the day when women had little recourse against harassment, and toward more universal principles of autonomy and consent. Nowadays we can skip all this prurient invasive nitpicking about exactly which part of somebody’s anatomy somebody else touched and whether that was officially “crossing the line” or not according to the arbitrary rulebook. What we judge on instead is simply whether the party being touched was consenting to being touched in that way. ---
**Author:** ![Omniscient](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omniscient/32/3290_2.png) [@Omniscient](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omniscient)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 7:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/36 "2018-03-22T07:09:06Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > [Not moderating] > > Why is this even a story? Someone did sexual things with someone else, and both consented. That’s been going on for all of history. Your grandparents did it, too. So what? This is the point. A few folks have noted that “times have changed” and they have, but that’s not really the problem here. The problem is that consenting pretty much the key element that matters and makes the OP a bald faced lie. Asking out a coworker is okay if he/she says yes. Asking out a coworker and they say no is harassment. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/37 "2018-03-22T12:33:34Z")
> [@Omniscient](#): > > Asking out a coworker is okay if he/she says yes. Asking out a coworker and they say no is harassment. Getting a ‘no’ doesn’t make it harassment, either. Persisting in asking after getting a ‘no’ is what makes it harassment. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/38 "2018-03-22T16:39:04Z")
I’ve said this before, but will repeat myself. At EVERY job I’ve ever held, there’s been a guy who talks trash, drops sexual innuendo, and mock-molests women. In EVERY case, the women seemed to love it. They all laughed hysterically, and none ever complained. If I had ever attempted anything similar, every one of those women would have kicked me in the shin, complained to the boss, and gotten me fired. Is there a lesson? Well, SOME guys can do that kind of thing and come off as charming or funny. MOST of us would just seem creepy if we did it. Apparently, Robin Williams was the kind of guy who could show his schlong to a nun and make her laugh., rather than offend her. Very few of us can do that. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/39 "2018-03-22T17:11:07Z")
> [@DavidwithanR](#): > > I think the sensible conclusion, both now and in the 1970s or whatever decade, is that you can’t do something to another person if they don’t like it, and that if you don’t know for sure whether they like it or not, then you have to ask them. > > With the added caution that from now on you sure as hell better not guess wrong about whether they’re going to like it. No, you don’t have to guess. As you pointed out, you can ask people if they don’t like something. There it is; that’s the big secret. Ask people. And if they say no, don’t do it. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2018, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976/40 "2018-03-22T17:19:28Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > I’ve said this before, but will repeat myself. > > At EVERY job I’ve ever held, there’s been a guy who talks trash, drops sexual innuendo, and mock-molests women. In EVERY case, the women seemed to love it. They all laughed hysterically, and none ever complained. > > If I had ever attempted anything similar, every one of those women would have kicked me in the shin, complained to the boss, and gotten me fired. > > Is there a lesson? Well, SOME guys can do that kind of thing and come off as charming or funny. MOST of us would just seem creepy if we did it. > > Apparently, Robin Williams was the kind of guy who could show his schlong to a nun and make her laugh., rather than offend her. Very few of us can do that. And there’s these guys who never have to work. But they always have money. They just go out on the street or into a business and point a gun at somebody. And then those people just hand them money. How is that fair? I have to go to work every day for hours and hours to get some money. And these guys just have people giving them money. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/robin-williams-was-a-groper/810976.md?page=3)