# Rock Of Ages, or Holy $%#@ ? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 4, 2004, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391 "2004-05-04T01:28:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Green\_Bean](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/green_bean/32/1760_2.png) [@Green\_Bean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Green_Bean)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/21 "2004-05-04T14:20:39Z")
> [@spiralscratch](#): > > Anyone else come into this thread thinking that, based on its title, it would be about Def Leppard? Now that song is stuck in my head. > > _Gunter gleiben glauchen globen…_ RISE UP GATHER ROUND! ROCK THIS PLACE TO THE GROUND! No, you’re not the only one. I’m kind of disappointed. _Pyromania_ was one of the albums that was intensely popular when I was in seventh grade. It has huge sentimental value for me. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/22 "2004-05-04T14:26:55Z")
I just wanted to say this is a great thread title. I don’t have much experience with this stuff, but I lean strongly towards “Holy $%#@.” ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/23 "2004-05-04T15:44:57Z")
> [@Beauty Personified](#): > > Actually, I’d say 95% of _all_ music (not just Christian) is crap. So would I. In fact, I did. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/24 "2004-05-04T15:54:27Z")
I love certain gospel music, even though I’m an atheist. The people singing it are hardshell Christians, but the music is _not_ just slapped together. But I have never heard any self-labeled Christian rock that I could distinguish from whatever music it seemed to be copying. The ‘Christians-playing-the-latest-sound’ approach produces music no different than the latest Britney clone. I remember seeing a Christian rock group during Nirvana’s heyday with a lead singer who resembled Cobain, even wearing a cardigan. C’mon, a Christian version of _Nirvana?!_ About ten years ago, I worked with a very conservative Christian guy. We didn’t agre on much, but we both wished there were no such thing as Christian rock. He was a Lutheran, and we agreed to pretty much stick to Bach in the office. That’s a _great_ Hank Hill quote – I’ll have to remember it. My own quote (which paraphases Clemenceau’s comment on military justice): _Christian rock is to rock as Christian Science is to science._ Disclaimer: I don’t claim to be an authority on Christian rock, so my comments are limited to the subset of it which I’ve heard. ---
**Author:** ![Homebrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Homebrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Homebrew)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/25 "2004-05-04T16:00:18Z")
> [@GMRyujin](#): > > [M]aking The O Face for Jesus. Good God you’re going to get me in trouble. Laughing out loud at work. That’s not right. _Making the O Face for Jesus_. Maybe not a band name but a great album title. ---
**Author:** ![Rex\_Fenestrarum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rex_fenestrarum/32/7265_2.png) [@Rex\_Fenestrarum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rex_Fenestrarum)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/26 "2004-05-04T16:03:54Z")
And then there’s those of us so orthodox that it just pisses us off. Every time I hear those Prots singin’ about Jeeeeeeesssuuusss, it just makes my Anglo-Catholic soul weep. I don’t have a problem with anyone of faith singing, but why does it have to be these Protestant sots? ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/27 "2004-05-04T16:30:11Z")
Generally speaking, most mainstream music is going to suck and suck hard. I’ve heard some underground stuff that’s really good. Someone’s already mentioned _Tourniquet_, so I’d like to throw out _Saviour Machine_ and _Antestor_. _Antestor_ tends to tour with bands who sing the really evil Satanic stuff. Their music is in a very similar vein, except the lyrics sing praises to Jesus instead of Satan. Most of the fans in the audience can’t tell the difference. After the show, they go out and mingle with the fans and sometimes, if the opportunity arises, they will talk about Jesus. They never force the issue. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/28 "2004-05-04T16:58:04Z")
Hmm, I can’t remember some of the titles or artists. Mid 80’s ‘Kyrie elason is the road that I must travel. Kyrie elason lights the darkness through the night’ At the time (I was in elementary school) we all loved the song. We had no idea what it was about (Kyrie the laser? A girl named Kyree Laison?). ‘All zombies hide your faces, all you people in the streets! All you sitting in high places, the rains gonna fall on you’ Good music, but when you finally listen to the lyrics, they suck. Sting ‘If I Ever Lose My Faith In You’ While IMHO not one of his best songs, it’s still a good one. Yes, the problem with nearly all the offerings on Time-Life’s Songs Of Worship is that they suck. ‘Open the eyes of my heart , Lord. Oh, won’t you open the eyes of my heart.’ WTF are the eyes of your heart? Your metaphor is tortured and for writing that song, you should be too. BTW- I do not always respond to Christianity with Cthulu. The Jesus Declares thread called for it. And the Songs Of Worship ads used to be shown so frequently, I had them memorized and participated as though they were the Rocky Horror Picture show. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/29 "2004-05-04T17:18:17Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Mid 80’s ‘Kyrie elason is the road that I must travel. Kyrie elason lights the darkness through the night’ At the time (I was in elementary school) we all loved the song. We had no idea what it was about (Kyrie the laser? A girl named Kyree Laison?). Wasn’t that Mister Mister? ---
**Author:** ![Doomtrain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/0ea827/32.png) [@Doomtrain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doomtrain)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/30 "2004-05-04T17:23:57Z")
> [@Rex Fenestrarum](#): > > I don’t have a problem with anyone of faith singing, but why does it have to be these Protestant sots? Because the Catholics are too guilty to indulge in the Road Sluts For Jesus and would thus make an inadequate rock band? ---
**Author:** ![cuauhtemoc](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecb155/32.png) [@cuauhtemoc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cuauhtemoc)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/31 "2004-05-04T18:58:59Z")
[Bart Simpson]Pfft. All the best bands are affiliated with Satan.[/Bart Simpson] ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/32 "2004-05-04T19:03:04Z")
How can I pass this thread without posting from the South Park episode Christian Rock Hard? > [@](#): > > ``` > All right, guys, this is gonna be so easy. All we have to do to make Christian songs is take regular old songs and add Jesus stuff to them. [some sheet music is shown. Cartman has already crossed out the original author's name] See? All we have to do is cross out words like "baby" and "Darling" and replace them with [writes next to "baby"] Jesus. > > ``` > [@](#): > > I need you in my life, Jesus. > I can’t live without you, Jesus > And I just want to feel you deep inside me, Jesus. > [@](#): > > Don’t ever leave me, Jesus. I couldn’t stand to see you go. > My heart would simply snap, my Lord, if you walked on out that door. > I promise I’ll be good to you, and keep you warm at night. > Jesus, Jesus, Jesus, why don’t we just… shut off the lights. > [@](#): > > I love you, Jesus. I want you to walk with me > [the fans sway back and forth] > I’ll take good care of you baby. Call you my baby, baby! > You died for my sins, and you know that I would die for you, right? > What’s the matter, baby? You tremble at Jesus, baby! > Your love… is my life! You know when I’m without you, there’s a black hole in my life! Oo-ohhh! > I wanna believe. It’s all right, 'cause I get lonely in the night and it’s up to you to > Save me! Jee…sus…bay-by! > [@](#): > > K-tal Records [its logo descends from the sky and drops below the screen] presents the most inspirational Christian rock band in the world! Faith + 1, [The CD cover appears] featuring the very best in good, wholesome Christian music. Oh Lord you are my Savior! You know I miss you so much when you are gone. [speaking over Cartman] With great inspirational songs like “I Wasn’t Born Again Yesterday,” “” Yes I may be born again, but I was wasn’t born again yesterday. I wanna get down on my knees and start pleasing Jesus! I wanna feel his salvation all over my face! [a shot of a home library, with fireplace and the CD propped on an end table] The CD is filled with instant classics. Who doesn’t remember… [the titles scroll by: “The Body of Christ,” “Christ Again,” “A Night With the Lord,” “Touch Me Jesus,” “I Found Jesus (With Someone Else),” “Savior Self,” “Christ, What a Day,” “Three Times My Savior,” “Jesus Touched Me”] The Body of Christ! Sleek swimmer’s body, all muscled up and toned! > The Body of Christ! O, Lord Almighty, I wish I could call it my own! You’re one time, two times, three times my Savior… Whenever I see Jesus up on that Cross I can’t help but think that he looks kinda hot… [“Quantites Limited!!!” cycles on the screen] This album is not available in stores and limited quantities are available, so order now! Man, that was a hilarious episode. ---
**Author:** ![slortar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6bbea6/32.png) [@slortar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/slortar)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/33 "2004-05-04T19:48:56Z")
This thread reminds me of a band called **Mortification**. Christian death metal. The only difference between them and normal death metal was they wrote songs about crushing Satan’s skull between their hands and killing devils in various, gleefully horrific ways. Odd. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/34 "2004-05-04T19:54:29Z")
> [@Lord Ashtar](#): > > Wasn’t that Mister Mister? It was. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@The\_Asbestos\_Mango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Asbestos_Mango)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/35 "2004-05-04T20:28:39Z")
Well, Stryper almost rocked… I hate CHRISTIAN ROCK AND CCM with a passion, as does my keyboard, so much that the caps lock keeps trying to stick. I remember during my early teen quasiBaptist phase, talking with some people around church/school (they were one and the same to me) talking with people who were into Christian rock, and I would tell them I liked hard rock, what Christian bands would they recommend, and they would tell me something like Petra and the Imperials. I’d give it a listen, and it made Journey sound like Black Sabbath when Ozzy was still in the band. I’ve given up. One thing that really frightens- at some point in the late '80’s or early 90’s, some Xian artist came up with a song called “Butterfly Kisses”, apparently not knowing what a butterfly kiss was (an incredibly erotic move, where you stroke your lover’s skin with your eyelashes, bonus points if you can do it to the inner thigh or belly while engaged in oral sex). The song was about a father’s love for his daughter. I hear it every once in a while, and I still have to shudder. Of course, no CCM song makes me sicker than “Thank You (for giving to the Lord)” in which the singer relates a dream in which he dies and goes to Heaven, and everyone he ever mentioned Jesus to comes up and thanks him for getting them inside the Pearly Gates. Talk about self-serving tripe- the singer gets the glory for saving all those souls. Jesus\< of course\< had nothing to do with it\> damn stuck caps lock messing with my punctuation\>\>\> ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/36 "2004-05-04T21:16:43Z")
> [@Lord Ashtar](#): > > Wasn’t that Mister Mister? Actually, it was Mr. Mister. ---
**Author:** ![Velma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/85e7bf/32.png) [@Velma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velma)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/37 "2004-05-04T21:29:41Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > I’m already on record as saying most Christian rock bores me. But the problem isn’t the subject matter, it’s the approach. It’s DEFINITELY possible to write great music with Christian themes (ask Bach or Haydn), just as it’s possible to write great music with political themes. But the music HAS to come before the message. > If you start with a message and a religious or ideological agenda, and try to build a song around them, you’re likely to end up with garbage. > > [snip] > > When talented songwriters (U2 or Springsteen, say) deal with Christian themes, the results are often wonderful. But when untalented songwriters start with a wonderful theme and try to build a song around it, the results tend to be boring. Yes. This is exactly it. I hate it when Christians get so caught up in ‘the message’ that they forget you need talent to produce good music. I am a Christian but I hate this and all forms of glurge. One of my professors in college wrote a book on this subject. Basically, that Christians make half-assed copies of popular media - music, literature, theatre, movies, etc. and throw in a Christian message and the whole Christian community is supposed to go crazy over it and promote it over all other art because it is Christian art. He basically called for Christians to consider the art and talent behind truly meaningful and good music and such, and to come up with a way to create works that are good on all levels, not just having a Christian message. He correctly claimed it is not enough to slap a cross on something and call it meaningful or good, and that there is a real lack of Christians in entertainment industries who are _truly_ trained and talented. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/38 "2004-05-04T21:54:28Z")
> [@Velma](#): > > Yes. This is exactly it. I hate it when Christians get so caught up in ‘the message’ that they forget you need talent to produce good music. I am a Christian but I hate this and all forms of glurge. > > One of my professors in college wrote a book on this subject. Basically, that Christians make half-assed copies of popular media - music, literature, theatre, movies, etc. and throw in a Christian message and the whole Christian community is supposed to go crazy over it and promote it over all other art because it is Christian art. He basically called for Christians to consider the art and talent behind truly meaningful and good music and such, and to come up with a way to create works that are good on all levels, not just having a Christian message Sounds like I would like this prof…I can’t understand _why_ the xtian glurggistas dont unerstand that there is a beauty in a madonna and child [no, not _that_ madonna=)] that is worlds better that some glurgy big eyed child and Jesus…or in the sorrow of a well done peita that beats the heck out of a chick tract. The message in a pieta is sacrifice…the message in a chick tract is to shove the message down our throats that Jesus died for us… ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/39 "2004-05-04T22:03:32Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > the message in a chick tract is to shove the message down our throats that Jesus died for us… And he hates you if you do things that Chick thinks are oogy. ---
**Author:** ![rockle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/73ab20/32.png) [@rockle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rockle)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2004, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391/40 "2004-05-04T23:44:37Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > ‘All zombies hide your faces, all you people in the streets! All you sitting in high places, the rains gonna fall on you’ Good music, but when you finally listen to the lyrics, they suck. This is the Hooters. And **Doc** , for shame - _these guys are from Philly!_🆒 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rock-of-ages-or-holy/243391.md?page=3)