# Roger reviews American Beauty **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 12, 2005, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834 "2005-10-12T01:57:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/1 "2005-10-12T01:57:50Z")
I watched this on disc yesterday for the first time since seeing it in the cinema (or “theatre”, as some prefer to style it) when it first came out. I’m still wondering what all the fuss is about, and I still find that I fancy the plain frumpy one more than the blonde tarty one. Watching on VCD brought home the fact that in football parlance this was a film of two halves. The first half was interesting and the second half was rubbish. Melodramatic, predictable and boring. Even the director, super Sam, seemed to recognise this, resorting more and more to aerial shots and droney Kevin Spacey voiceovers. Particular gripes include in no particular order “The Two Jims”, the poofs next door - and, cunningly, just two doors down from the homosexual homophobe (even more cunning, that plot twist - I mean, to have a homophobe who turns out to be homosexual). Of course both Jim and, er, Jim, besides sharing the same name, also share other totally unpredictable qualities. They’re both incredibly handsome (even my heart went a-flutter when they first brought round the flowers); which reminds me that they’re both incredibly generous and neighbourly, as well as being incredibly artistic. (I’m assuming they arranged the flowers themselves - perhaps while out power-jogging, or whatever they call it.) And then they both hold down incredibly high-paying jobs (careers, I suppose I should call them), one as a tax attorney and the other I’m afraid I didn’t catch, as I was barfing into the nearest receptacle, which unhappily for its occupants turned out to be the hamster cage. Then, there’s the afore-mentioned gay-bashing ex Marine, who’s taken a bit too literally Captain William Jones’s words about enjoying the fellowship of a few good men. Finally, there’s the wife who falls for a two-bit salesman with eyebrows that are modelled on a Finnish ski-jumper who’s just launched himself off the runway and assumed the legs akimbo position. “The secret of my success is looking successful even when things are going tough” passes for pillow talk from the man with the Donald Trump hairdo, after he’s put the wife into a position owing less to the Kama Sutra than the Suomi Ski-jumping Manual. Meanwhile, the wife’s best efforts to regain a more ladylike posture (the old-fashioned ski-jumping position, if you like) are stymied by those eyebrows. “I am a victim. Oh God! Make me your victim”, she breathes, as she reaches down for his gun. Or something like that. But no, I remember now - the homophobic homo did it. And the moral is…quit moralising and you might make a better picture. ---
**Author:** ![John\_F](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/43a26b/32.png) [@John\_F](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_F)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/2 "2005-10-12T02:37:07Z")
It’s ok if you don’t like the film, but I can’t get behind any of your thoughts here. ---
**Author:** ![uglybeech](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/82dd89/32.png) [@uglybeech](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/uglybeech)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/3 "2005-10-12T02:37:42Z")
It’s been a long time since I saw it, so I can’t remember the details (though you reminded me of some). But I remember thinking that this is what people who never watch great films would mistake for a great film. Palatable, somewhat artful, tissue thin. I felt the same about Forrest Gump. ---
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/4 "2005-10-12T02:43:09Z")
> [@uglybeech](#): > > It’s been a long time since I saw it, so I can’t remember the details (though you reminded me of some). > > But I remember thinking that this is what people who never watch great films would mistake for a great film. Palatable, somewhat artful, tissue thin. I felt the same about Forrest Gump. Forrest Gump actually moved me somewhat. I found it sad. I think one difference between F.G. and A.B. was that the former wasn’t trying to be artful. It _was_ trying to win an Oscar, like AB, but unlike AB, didn’t take itself too seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/5 "2005-10-12T02:46:55Z")
So basically your biggest problem with the movie is that it presented homosexuals in a good light and homophobia in a bad light? Dude, I think the movie has problems (unbelievable characters, the ridiculous, “Three’s Company” ending) but I don’t see why portraying a gay couple as being good people is anything to barf about. ---
**Author:** ![Moe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moe/32/2972_2.png) [@Moe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moe)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/6 "2005-10-12T03:06:14Z")
> [@uglybeech](#): > > It’s been a long time since I saw it, so I can’t remember the details (though you reminded me of some). > > But I remember thinking that this is what people who never watch great films would mistake for a great film. Palatable, somewhat artful, tissue thin. I felt the same about Forrest Gump. I agree wholeheartedly, including “it’s been a long time since I saw it, so I can’t remember the details…” The film seems to think it’s important. Every scene is this huge, ridiculously overdramatic and almost operatic attempt at being profound, but there’s just nothing interesting there. Same exact criticism with FG, and to a much lesser degree, Dead Poets Society. ---
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/7 "2005-10-12T03:35:07Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Dude, I think the movie has problems (unbelievable characters, the ridiculous, “Three’s Company” ending) but I don’t see why portraying a gay couple as being good people is anything to barf about. The depiction of Jims was one dimensional. They were polite, they brought flowers to their new (not next door) neighbours (where exactly do they draw the line? the whole street? only their side?), they had great faces, they had great bodies, they ran like the wind, they were successful in their careers, they reacted calmly, tolerantly and maturely to hatred and prejudice directed at them because of their homosexuality, and they did absolutely nothing else. They were redundant. They were only written in to preach. That was lazy and ineffectual film making. I’d feel the same if it was a film about the vicissitudes and hypocrisies of a gay community, and the token heterosexual couple had been such cardboard cutouts. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/8 "2005-10-12T04:38:48Z")
one was a tax atterny and the other an anesthesiologist (yes I am to sleepy to fix that poor slaughtered word) ---
**Author:** ![jackelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@jackelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackelope)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/9 "2005-10-12T05:02:14Z")
While I was watching it, I kept thinking of Mark Twain’s discussion of the difficulty he had in writing _Pudd’nhead Wilson_, until he realized that he was actually writing two different books, which he had inadvertently smushed together into one mutant. _American Beauty_ was the same: Two movies smushed awkwardly together into one big clusterf\*ck. Movie A was pretty good: A miserable guy eking out a miserable life surrounded by people who hate him suddenly says to himself, “Hey, this sucks! I don’t have to live like this!” and changes his life. This movie was entertaining and rang true to me, thanks in large part to the Pre-_KPAX_ Kevin Spacey. Movie B, though, was just about the lamest excuse for a whodunit I’ve ever seen. The voice-over tells us at the very beginning that he’s going to die, then the movie methodically goes through each and every ham-handed cliche of a character, giving each of them a reason to kill him. Then he gets killed by someone unseen, and the director, accompanied by the most manically swelling orchestral strains this side of a Ron Howard ending, gives us a montage that, one by one, shows us who didn’t do it until there’s only one guy left. And by the way, was anyone actually surprised by the rabid homophobe turning out to be gay? As soon as I saw where his character was going, and the way he would not only bash homosexuals, but actually bring it up out of the blue, I thought to myself, “Hey, I took Psych 101; I learned about Reaction Formation. I betcha that guy turns out to be gay…” 1 decent movie + 1 LAME movie != Best Picture of the Year, in my book. I want my two hours back. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/10 "2005-10-12T05:53:45Z")
I enjoyed the movie up until the ‘plastic bag floating in the breeze’ bit. There are few things more insulting than when a director pretty much comes out and says, “in case you didn’t get the theme of this movie, I’m going to let a character actually tell it to you out loud in a monologue, because either you’re too stupid to get it on your own, or I’m too bad of a director to get it across without direct exposition.” And, not only that, it’s a trite and cliched point that’s made by that character. As I said to a friend recently, “sure, a plastic bag floating in the wind is beautiful, but nine times out of ten I sure as heck would rather watch a monarch butterfly drifting through the air.” ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/11 "2005-10-12T06:08:44Z")
I was 18 when _American Beauty_ came out and I thought it was one of the best things to ever hit celluloid. I watched it again recently with 6 years of films, life experience, and college literature and film classes under my belt. Suffice it to say my opinion of it has changed about 175 degrees. I think **uglybeech** hit the nail on the head when s/he said that this is what people who never watch great films would mistake for a great film. I hope no one minds me adding that last year’s piece of garbage titled _Garden State_ should be lumped in this pile. ---
**Author:** ![jackelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@jackelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackelope)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/12 "2005-10-12T06:10:21Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > I enjoyed the movie up until the ‘plastic bag floating in the breeze’ bit. Did you see the “Family Guy” episode where Peter gets all misty watching a plastic bag blowing around? God, watching him, gets all indignant and says something like, “It’s just a plastic bag! Have you _seen_ the human circulatory system?” ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/13 "2005-10-12T06:12:21Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > I And, not only that, it’s a trite and cliched point that’s made by that character. As I said to a friend recently, “sure, a plastic bag floating in the wind is beautiful, but nine times out of ten I sure as heck would rather watch a monarch butterfly drifting through the air.” I guess a plastic bag floating through the air might be beautiful to the people who made “American Beauty,” most of whom live in Los Angeles, where trash in the streets is pretty much the landscape. In the rest of the world, plastic bags floating on the wind are just garbage. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/14 "2005-10-12T06:14:24Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > I enjoyed the movie up until the ‘plastic bag floating in the breeze’ bit. I forgot to mention…whenever I see a plastic bag floating around like this I’ll stop and say wistfully to whoever I’m with, “That’s the most beautiful thing I’ve ever seen.” I don’t think a single person has ever gotten the joke/reference :mad:. ---
**Author:** ![soulmurk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b782af/32.png) [@soulmurk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/soulmurk)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/15 "2005-10-12T06:17:08Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > I forgot to mention…whenever I see a plastic bag floating around like this I’ll stop and say wistfully to whoever I’m with, “That’s the most beautiful thing I’ve ever seen.” > > I don’t think a single person has ever gotten the joke/reference :mad:. Do you have any idea how complex your circulatory system is?! ---
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/16 "2005-10-12T06:31:48Z")
I preferred the plastic bag bit to the red petals motif. Maybe I’m just an inverted snob. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/17 "2005-10-12T08:57:16Z")
I liked it _very_ much the first time I saw it and even more the second time. But I would have to rewatch it to defend it. (Sorry – memory problems.) I do remember that I gained some perspective or insight from almost every character in the film and that I liked the style. I don’t think it was a “great” film, but if someone _did_ think so, that would not mean that she or he has not been exposed to the truly great ones and does not relate to them. Everyone has a right to a _tilt_ now and then. BTW, **roger** , someone asked our new Chief Justice what his favorite movies are. He came up with **North by Northwest** and **Doctor Zhivago**. (The latter is my favorite film, although it wasn’t Lean’s best by any stretch.) Back to **American Beauty** : I don’t think we were supposed to be “suprised” by the homosexuality of the homophobe. I don’t think this movie is about the _plot_ that much anyway – not in what I remember of it. And I don’t remember being as certain of the ending as some of you are. Oh well. I need to see it again. At least I remember the end title music. ---
**Author:** ![seosamh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@seosamh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/seosamh)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/18 "2005-10-12T09:19:42Z")
I echo Roger’s views on the two girls in it. Mena Suvari?? Does nothing for me. But Thora Birch - now there’s an interesting actress! She was marvellous in “Ghost World” too. ---
**Author:** ![roger\_thornhill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@roger\_thornhill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/roger_thornhill)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2005, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/19 "2005-10-12T09:19:46Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > And I don’t remember being as certain of the ending as some of you are…At least I remember the end title music. The “Three’s Company” comment threw me too. The end title music had me humming along - but now of course, less than 24 hours later, I’ve forgotten what it was. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2005, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834/20 "2005-10-13T02:31:29Z")
It was the Beatles song that begins “Because the world is round…” I think it sort of fits in with the ability to appreciate the plastic bag blowing in the wind (I prefer paper) and it ends rather abruptly, as does the movie. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-reviews-american-beauty/325834.md?page=2)