# Roger Stone Guilty on All Counts **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 15, 2019, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497 "2019-11-15T16:59:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![skdo23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@skdo23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/skdo23)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/21 "2019-11-15T20:43:32Z")
I think _Esquire_ said it best:D: > **[Professional Ratf\*cker Roger Stone Has F\*cked His Last Rat](https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a29813171/roger-stone-convicted-seven-counts-lying-congress/?utm_campaign=socialflowFBESQ&utm_medium=social-media&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR3h1FufimA2IlI5PFE0EaRe_3L1pGfa2EVX3nrOBg0Oc5rHR8QS75xDhTQ)** > > But his crimes against democracy—which the Republican Party abided as long as it was convenient—will never be atoned for. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/22 "2019-11-15T20:54:35Z")
Better yet: [Cop Rock - He's Guilty [High Quality] - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwz4k4n1ezM) ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/23 "2019-11-15T20:54:51Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > If Stone’s pardoned, he can be compelled to testify. > > Trump might still be dumb enough to do it. Can he be compelled to tell the truth? ---
**Author:** ![skdo23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@skdo23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/skdo23)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/24 "2019-11-15T20:57:32Z")
> [@skdo23](#): > > I think _Esquire_ said it best: > [Roger Stone Convicted on Seven Counts, Including Lying to Congress](https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a29813171/roger-stone-convicted-seven-counts-lying-congress/?utm_campaign=socialflowFBESQ&utm_medium=social-media&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR3h1FufimA2IlI5PFE0EaRe_3L1pGfa2EVX3nrOBg0Oc5rHR8QS75xDhTQ) Sorry, double post. Mods, could you please remove it, thx. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/25 "2019-11-15T21:12:53Z")
> [@skdo23](#): > > Sorry, double post. Mods, could you please remove it, thx. It was so nice, I read it twice. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/26 "2019-11-15T21:13:38Z")
> [@skdo23](#): > > I think _Esquire_ said it best:D: > [https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a29813171/roger-stone-convicted-seven-counts-lying-congress/?utm\_campaign=socialflowFBESQ&utm\_medium=social-media&utm\_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR3h1FufimA2IlI5PFE0EaRe\_3L1pGfa2EVX3nrOBg0Oc5rHR8QS75xDhTQ](https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/politics/a29813171/roger-stone-convicted-seven-counts-lying-congress/?utm_campaign=socialflowFBESQ&utm_medium=social-media&utm_source=facebook&fbclid=IwAR3h1FufimA2IlI5PFE0EaRe_3L1pGfa2EVX3nrOBg0Oc5rHR8QS75xDhTQ) Hilarious, but I just have to point out – there are rats in prison. ---
**Author:** ![skdo23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@skdo23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/skdo23)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/27 "2019-11-15T21:21:45Z")
Perfect time to make an example of someone for lying to Congress. ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/28 "2019-11-15T21:32:26Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Better yet: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwz4k4n1ezM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwz4k4n1ezM) At the time, I thought Cop Rock was a terrible idea. I now think it was just too far ahead of its time. Also, to stay on topic; Eat shit, Roger! ---
**Author:** ![Aspenglow](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspenglow/32/76_2.png) [@Aspenglow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspenglow)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/29 "2019-11-15T21:39:03Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > That’s not how Trump thinks. He’s asking what does he have to gain from pardoning somebody. And after all, you know, he hardly knew the guy. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/30 "2019-11-15T22:45:25Z")
I have yet to be convinced that we have seen the last of these fuckers. We really do need to grow a spine and start using the word “treason” more often. ---
**Author:** ![Mike\_Mabes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mike_mabes/32/1782_2.png) [@Mike\_Mabes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mike_Mabes)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2019, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/31 "2019-11-15T22:48:38Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > Most successful witch hunt in the history of witch hunts. All these witches found to be witches by an actual impartial jury. > > I thought that witch hunt was supposed to be a situation where you try to pin bad things on innocent (non-witch) people, and yet here we are. Maybe the term witch hunt should be retired by the president’s supporters (and the president himself) at this point? I’m not around Trump supporters very often but when I am and they talk about it being a witch hunt I say, “It must be a witch hunt because they sure caught a lot of witches.” ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/32 "2019-11-16T00:05:00Z")
On a day when I badly need to hear something resembling a bright spot of good news, this will do. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/33 "2019-11-16T00:14:40Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > If Stone’s pardoned, he can be compelled to testify. > > Trump might still be dumb enough to do it. I think about this a lot. Trump pardons someone, which means he’s compelled to testify. But he could testify and just lie his ass off. Then he’s in jeopardy again for lying under oath. Could he get pardoned yet again for that? I don’t know the answer to that question. But anyone considering lying to cover Trump’s ass must now be calculating that with an election in November, the window of opportunity for pardoning is getting smaller and smaller with each passing day. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/34 "2019-11-16T01:36:15Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > \*nitpick. It’s reported that Trump is about to pardon some war criminals. > > _Washington Post_, via [_Stars and Stripes_](https://www.stripes.com/news/us/white-house-and-pentagon-prepare-for-trump-to-issue-pardons-in-war-crimes-cases-officials-say-1.607397): No longer “about to”. He [pardoned them](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/trump-issues-pardons-service-members-accused-war-crimes/story?id=67055490). ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/35 "2019-11-16T02:16:08Z")
The advantage to Trump in pardoning all those who lied for him is as a signal to other potential witnesses that he has their back. Failing that, they might decided they have to tell the truth. ---
**Author:** ![Personal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Personal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Personal)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/36 "2019-11-16T03:38:21Z")
It was asked above about the timing of pardons. I guess this could be its own thread, but don’t presidents pardon on the last day of their terms to avoid political consequences? Could a seemingly improper pardon be an article of impeachment? ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/37 "2019-11-16T05:21:47Z")
> [@Derleth](#): > > If Stone’s pardoned, he can be compelled to testify. Why would the pardon change anything on that front? To the extent that these matters gave him a legitimate reason to use his Fifth Amendment rights, didn’t that end today, or at least won’t it in February when he’s sentenced? ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/38 "2019-11-16T05:37:12Z")
I wonder if Stone will be going to a place with lax-enough rules and security where he’ll still be able to wear his costumes that he likes to dress up in so so much? I think taking _that_ ability away from him would be what really breaks the man. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/39 "2019-11-16T05:53:45Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > I think about this a lot. Trump pardons someone, which means he’s compelled to testify. But he could testify and just lie his ass off. Then he’s in jeopardy again for lying under oath. Could he get pardoned yet again for that?.. Yes. The President’s pardon power for federal offenses is almost unlimited: [Federal pardons in the United States - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_pardons_in_the_United_States). > [@Personal](#): > > It was asked above about the timing of pardons. I guess this could be its own thread, but don’t presidents pardon on the last day of their terms to avoid political consequences? Could a seemingly improper pardon be an article of impeachment? Some Presidents have issued lots of pardons towards the end of the terms, most notoriously Bill Clinton in early 2001, but there’s no legal reason it has to be done then. No President has ever been impeached for “a seemingly improper pardon,” but we’re in uncharted political waters in many ways, and these days I would never say never. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2019, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497/40 "2019-11-16T06:10:53Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > That’s not how Trump thinks. He’s asking what does he have to gain from pardoning somebody. > [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > The advantage to Trump in pardoning all those who lied for him is as a signal to other potential witnesses that he has their back. Failing that, they might decided they have to tell the truth. Agree with Hari. Communicating: "with pardons, I got your back " doesn’t need to come from a place of kindness, it can also come from strict self-interest. It will make people less nervous about working with him now, even if it doesn’t completely extinguish the legal risks of associating with him. It’s a crooked use of power for self-interest, just that should appeal to Trump. Someone can also explain to me how being pardoned means they’re easier to compel to testify. Maybe I just don’t know that point of law. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/roger-stone-guilty-on-all-counts/843497.md?page=3)