# Rome, season 2 premiere 07/01/14 (spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 15, 2007, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012 "2007-01-15T01:29:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Malodorous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e47774/32.png) [@Malodorous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malodorous)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2007, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/41 "2007-01-15T22:03:08Z")
> [@Baker](#): > > I really like the young actor Max Pirkis, playing Octavian. Kid’s finally growing a spine! I’m going to keep my eye out for other work he does, he seems a natural. Not bad looking either, although much too young for me. Octavian’s my favorite character in the series. I hope we see a few Octavian centered episodes before he’s replaced. [QUOTE=John Mace] Vorenus has lost everythhing and now Pullo is on top of the world. [/QUOTE] I’m thinking some part of Vorenus’s family is still alive (the “son”, perhaps). The mob boss seemed to indicate he thought Vorenus would kill him no matter what he said, so I’m guessing he told him he killed them all just to get at him. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2007, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/42 "2007-01-15T22:22:16Z")
Disposing of Vorenus’ family kills two birds – it gives Vorenus motivation for doing whatever he’s going to do, and it saves money and story time. They don’t have to pay the actors, and we won’t be fretting about who’s taking care of the kids while Vorenus does more exciting stuff. Although they could be left alive. Niobe’s sister could take care of them and we wouldn’t need to fret about them. Or they could have been sold, which would give Vorenus and Pullo a mission. Jake and Elwood in badly sewn linen. Heh. ---
**Author:** ![Malodorous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e47774/32.png) [@Malodorous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malodorous)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2007, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/43 "2007-01-15T22:27:16Z")
[QUOTE=AuntiePam] Jake and Elwood in badly sewn linen. Heh. [/QUOTE] We’re on Mission from Zeus! ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/44 "2007-01-16T00:17:48Z")
[QUOTE=Rube E. Tewesday] For those with more knowledge of the history: Is there evidence to support portraying Cicero as a total tool? He generally gets handled very respectfully in popular histories. [/QUOTE] This seemed off to me as well. But then alot seemed off. Cicero was aghast at the notion of Vorenus being made a senator because he was a plebeian. Cicero himself was a plebeian and the whole senator must be a patrician thing was given up two centuries earlier. I know Cicero faced accusations of cowardice in battle, but from what I’ve read he was politically brave and known for his integrity. ---
**Author:** ![KidCharlemagne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@KidCharlemagne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KidCharlemagne)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/45 "2007-01-16T00:21:55Z")
[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic] I liked how Octavian was shown as cool and calculating, measuring all the angles, even when his life was most in jeopardy. That kid is going to go places. [/QUOTE] I’ve been eagerly anticipating his transformation since last season and now I hear they will be replacing Max Pirkis with Simon Woods. I like the latter a lot, but I’d have much preferred to see Pirkis go through the changes. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/46 "2007-01-16T01:42:33Z")
What is the “black stone” that people kept swearing by? I came hear hoping to see a definitive answer on the post-mortem nipple thing…no such luck, I guess. I’m guessing that the Vorenii are still alive somewhere – it gives us a good plot thread (other than the Triumvirate, of course) for this season. I loved Pullo’s line “you didn’t kill an animal on it, right?” It’s little touches like that that make this show great. ---
**Author:** ![Queen\_Bruin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/e274bd/32.png) [@Queen\_Bruin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Queen_Bruin)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/47 "2007-01-16T01:55:29Z")
The Black Stone of Pessinus was a stone brought from Asia Minor to Rome during the Second Punic war. It was prophesied in the Sibylline Books that Rome would never beat Hannibal unless the cult of Magna Mater/Cybele was brought to the city. The stone was placed in the mouth of a statue of the goddess. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/48 "2007-01-16T02:07:38Z")
[QUOTE=jsc1953] What is the “black stone” that people kept swearing by? [/QUOTE] It’s a boat full of very unstable dynamite, now covered by little bits of Arnst. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/49 "2007-01-16T14:47:59Z")
Hell, Max Pirkis aged significantly during the hiatus anyway! Shame he’s being replaced, I really like him. I assumed that the “wet nurse” thing was some pagan ritual about passing the dead man through to the other side, with some reference to the birthing process. And there’s no way Calpurnia could have done it- she is well past all that. The one-liners in this show have always been great- Vorenus’ “Pullo, have you ever had a woman who wasn’t crying or waiting for payment?” or Atia’s “A large penis is always a welcome gift!” cracked me up every time. I am very glad it’s back on, but extremely disappointed in HBO’s decision to make this the last season. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/50 "2007-01-16T14:51:24Z")
Jesus, I just looked up Pirkis’ IMDB page- his two biggest roles, _Master and Commander_ and _Rome_, are his ONLY roles! Other than these, he’s done a few school plays! Natural talent is a beautiful thing. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/51 "2007-01-16T14:55:59Z")
Speaking of badly sewn linen, I raised this topic last year but no one really knew. Maybe someone new to the discussion can shed light. Why are the edges of the higher class garments (those worn by Senators and such) not serged? Is that a cost cutting measure for the series (a terrible mistake given its broadcast in hi-def) or was it just a technique the Romans had not yet assimilated? ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/52 "2007-01-16T15:03:42Z")
[QUOTE=AuntiePam] Besides, how long did [Eirene] know the guy Pullo killed? She wasn’t from there, was she? So she must have just met him. Wasn’t like they were childhood sweethearts. [/QUOTE] Season one spanned at least four years. Vorenus returned home in the second or third episode to find his wife holding an infant. Episode 12 (and also the season 2 opener) showed that infant as a young boy that Vorenus grabbed, shouting “Who are you?” Eirene was brought to the Vorenus household while the boy was still an infant, so they could have been lovers for several years at least. That timeline was a bit jarring, btw. At one point Vorenus kissed the boy while putting him to sleep, and I was thinking he was treating his slave boy too familiar. It wasn’t until just now that I realized that wasn’t the slave boy who survived the flux, but rather the infant grown up. A couple great lines not mentioned: “And I’ll not do what you do not urge.” During the “I’ll not get out of bed until I’ve fucked something” scene, Atia’s response to get the German from the kitchen was great, but already mentioned. Right after that, to her seamstress: “Hurry up, and do it right or you’ll be next for the King of Goats over there.” This show is phenomenal. Both this and Deadwood put The Sporanos to shame. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/53 "2007-01-16T15:50:36Z")
[QUOTE=KidCharlemagne] But then alot seemed off. Cicero was aghast at the notion of Vorenus being made a senator because he was a plebeian. Cicero himself was a plebeian and the whole senator must be a patrician thing was given up two centuries earlier. [/QUOTE] True, but there are plebians and there are plebians, you know, and there’s a difference between a (admitedly plebian) member of the Arpinine gentry with large family landholdings, and some lower class soldier with no family worth anything who Caesar, for whatever reason, decides to like and favor. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/54 "2007-01-16T16:51:39Z")
Another good line not yet mentioned: “Now all you need are the bakers and the flute players and you can have a festival.” ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/55 "2007-01-16T20:06:23Z")
That line was in response to one mentioning the lichter’s guild (that’s a guess on the spelling). What is this? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/56 "2007-01-16T20:17:35Z")
[QUOTE=Dewey Finn] That line was in response to one mentioning the lichter’s guild (that’s a guess on the spelling). What is this? [/QUOTE] [Lictors](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lictor). I’m guessing the Lictors Guild would have been some sort of union but essentially lictors were servants maybe somewhat analogous to Congressional pages. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/57 "2007-01-16T21:40:27Z")
And it might have been lutes rather than flutes. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2007, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/58 "2007-01-16T23:49:12Z")
Another question: When Timon visits Atia and agrees to protect her (for payment), Marc Antony makes a derisive comment about Jewish businessmen. Is the stereotype actually that old? I thought it started in Medieval times. ---
**Author:** ![jsc1953](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/5daacb/32.png) [@jsc1953](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jsc1953)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2007, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/59 "2007-01-17T00:01:09Z")
An interesting note about Roman funeral attire: the men cover their heads, and the women don’t – the opposite of day-to-day wear. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2007, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012/60 "2007-01-17T00:20:30Z")
[QUOTE=hajario] Another question: When Timon visits Atia and agrees to protect her (for payment), Marc Antony makes a derisive comment about Jewish businessmen. Is the stereotype actually that old? I thought it started in Medieval times. [/QUOTE] Antony’s line was something to the effect of “not expecting a Jew to do a public service.” Nothing about businessmen. I did like how disappointed and jealous Timon was when Antony showed up. He would have protected Atia and the Julii for free if Antony hadn’t of shown. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/rome-season-2-premiere-07-01-14-spoilers/388012.md?page=4)