# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 133
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2641 "2022-03-17T16:49:44Z")
What’s with all of the fires in Kaliningrad? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2642 "2022-03-17T16:51:11Z")
Wild-ass guess: Russians burning crops to cause as much civilian suffering as possible? At this point, it looks like their goal (if they still have one) is simply to wreck as much stuff as possible so that it will be costly for the west to help Ukraine rebuild. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2643 "2022-03-17T16:53:07Z")
I see that Ludovic said that too. I should have read the thread before posting. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2644 "2022-03-17T16:56:25Z")
Kaliningrad is in Russia. Social media suggests it’s for agricultural reasons, clearing fields for springtime sowing. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2645 "2022-03-17T17:01:11Z")
I saw a video from this channel earlier in the discussion from another poster, so I’ve been on and off following his take on how things are going. He seems to have a more realistic perspective on what is going on in Ukraine, though his perspective is from that of basically a junior enlisted soldier who fought in Iraq, not a really high-level strategic or top-down one. That said, it’s worth looking at, as it puts a lot of this into a different light. If it’s too long, didn’t want to watch, then his perspective is that we are getting a very skewed view of what’s going on, essentially just the Ukrainian side of things. The battle map many are using (including myself) is updated from pro-Ukrainian sources, so mainly shows what they feel is important…not necessarily what all is going on. In any case, I’ll link to the video below for anyone who wants to see it. I don’t think this channel has a real bias in this…aside from an American soldier’s usual bias against the Soviets that probably has, to an extent, translated into Russia, especially now…but as with anything like this, be aware that everyone has blindspots or their own focus on things that can detract from other information. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/Igq2fqa7RY4/maxresdefault.jpg "Ukraine Fog of War: What's Really Happening?") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Igq2fqa7RY4) ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2646 "2022-03-17T17:03:09Z")
Looking at the fire map across the world, it doesn’t look like it is confined to just range, agriculture, forestry, and structure fires but also industry like factories, refineries and power plants with open flame stacks. Could a lot of that concentration in Ukraine just be a reversion back to fossil fueled energy and heat production while the (nuke fueled) power grid is disrupted? ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2647 "2022-03-17T17:10:23Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > Social media suggests it’s for agricultural reasons, clearing fields for springtime sowing. Burning fields kills insects in the soil, and the ash is considered a fertilizer. The smoke is not great if you live anywhere near it though. Cite: living in the Willamette Valley that did field burns until a few years ago. ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2648 "2022-03-17T17:13:55Z")
I really do love him. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2649 "2022-03-17T17:29:00Z")
Latest victim of Putin’s purge: > ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2650 "2022-03-17T17:32:37Z")
Latest reports are that he’s been fired. I wonder what that word means at his job? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2651 "2022-03-17T17:33:21Z")
Wow. I don’t know to what extent Russians or Russian soldiers will see that, but that is some powerful stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2652 "2022-03-17T17:34:07Z")
He has to take it easy on the purges though because while it worked for Stalin it didn’t go so well for Robespierre. Even if you’re not on his target list, a widespread purge for obviously trumped up charges will make everyone, target or not, _think_ that they’re a target. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2653 "2022-03-17T17:56:50Z")
> [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](#): > > Latest reports are that he’s been fired. I wonder what that word means at his job? “Out of a cannon,” most likely. Or is that just a North Korean thing? ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2654 "2022-03-17T17:58:50Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > What’s with all of the fires in Kaliningrad? > **[Spring Fires in Kaliningrad](https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/91895/spring-fires-in-kaliningrad)** > > Limited enforcement of laws against burning and a large number of abandoned fields contribute to the high frequency of fires in this part of Russia. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2655 "2022-03-17T18:21:54Z")
If Ukraine were to take photos of the Russians they’ve killed, wounded, or captured, along with their dog tags for positive identification, and posted them on a website, then the families of the casualties could have some closure. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2656 "2022-03-17T18:32:18Z")
That would be a breach of the Geneva Convention. They did set up a website (or a phone number?) for concerned Russians to check to see if their military loved ones were captured or killed - but the Russians blocked it. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2657 "2022-03-17T18:42:55Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > If Ukraine were to take photos of the Russians they’ve killed, wounded, or captured, along with their dog tags for positive identification, and posted them on a website, then the families of the casualties could have some closure.   They’ve done that for Russian POWs [on this site](https://invaders-rf.com/). (Click EN in the top right corner to get the English version.) Relatives can send in their details, and the Ukrainians will contact them. > [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](#): > > They did set up a website (or a phone number?) for concerned Russians to check to see if their military loved ones were captured or killed - but the Russians blocked it. [This](https://200rf.com/) is the blocked site. A few days into the conflict, they also asked the International Committee of the Red Cross to help with identification and repatriation of Russian bodies. > **[Ukraine Seeks Red Cross Help With Russian Bodies: 'Bury Them With Dignity'](https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-seeks-red-cross-help-russian-bodies-bury-them-dignity-1683047)** > > The Ukrainian ambassador to the United Nations urged the organization to not "let Putin hide" the scale of the tragedy. ---
**Author:** ![Wrenching\_Spanners](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecb155/32.png) [@Wrenching\_Spanners](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wrenching_Spanners)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2658 "2022-03-17T19:57:31Z")
One opinion I read is that it’s an attempt to play off NATO against Russia as a diplomatic bargaining point. When NATO refuses the no-fly zone, Zalenskyy is able to claim that NATO is not supporting Ukraine’s requests for military aid, and therefore the idea that Ukraine would become a member of NATO is ridiculous. He can therefore demand that Russia leave Ukraine because it has no basis to worry about NATO having another border country with Russia. But then when Russia doesn’t accept that argument, Zalenskyy can pressure NATO nations for more aid since Russia isn’t agreeing to compromise, even if they won’t commit to no-fly zone. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2659 "2022-03-17T20:03:53Z")
I’m calling it now: “Special [blank]” is the meme of this conflict. Much like “Mother of all [blank]” was the meme associated with the Gulf War ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 17, 2022, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/2660 "2022-03-17T21:22:37Z")
The US has quietly been training the Ukrainians since the Crimea annexation. Our soldiers were very surprised at the Russians technucal weapons. _Caught with our pants down_ is how sources described it. Our men had to adapt from tactics used in the Middle East. Learn to fight Russians. Then we taught the Ukrainians. It’s certainly paying off now. The Ukrainians are doing a phenomenal job against a much bigger force. Long article. I just quoted the beginning. > **[Exclusive: Secret CIA training program in Ukraine helped Kyiv prepare for...](https://news.yahoo.com/exclusive-secret-cia-training-program-in-ukraine-helped-kyiv-prepare-for-russian-invasion-090052743.html?guccounter=1)** > > As the battle lines hardened in the Donbas following Russia's annexation of Crimea in 2014, a small, select group of veteran CIA paramilitaries made their first secret trips to the frontlines to meet with Ukrainian counterparts there, according to... > [@](#): > > Shortly thereafter, pro-Russia insurgents in the eastern Donbas region began a grinding secessionist war against Kyiv. > > Russian troops soon entered the fray. So, quietly, did the CIA. > > As the battle lines hardened in Donbas, a small, select group of veteran CIA paramilitaries made their first secret trips to the frontlines to meet with Ukrainian counterparts there, according to former U.S. officials. > > CIA paramilitaries soon concluded that, in Russia and its proxies, the agency was facing an adversary whose capabilities far outmatched the Islamist groups that CIA had been battling in the post-9/11 wars. “We learned a lot real quick,” says a former senior intelligence official — including about the Russians’ laser-blinding techniques. “That s\*\*\* wouldn’t happen with the Taliban.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=132) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=134)