# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1)
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news
**Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 166
### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3301 "2022-03-24T21:20:55Z")
I thought the same thing when I read **Euphonious\_Polemic** ’s post.
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### Author:  [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3302 "2022-03-24T21:22:15Z")
> [@Ludovic](#):
>
> What if they ~~build a third castle~~ make the port usable a third time, would that work?
That one would burn down, fall over and then sink into the swamp…
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### Author:  [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3303 "2022-03-24T21:22:55Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#):
>
> That one would burn down, fall over and then sink into the swamp…
“But the fourth one! The Fourth one Blew UP!”
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### Author:  [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3304 "2022-03-24T21:23:20Z")
And, thus, the word “Portemkin” was born.
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### Author:  [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3305 "2022-03-24T21:30:49Z")
> [@Velocity](#):
>
> firing off 154 Tomahawks at Russian targets in Ukraine
Subtle.
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### Author:  [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3306 "2022-03-24T22:16:19Z")
> [@GreenWyvern](#):
>
> Said to be a conversation with a Russian soldier intercepted by Ukraine (they’ve posted an audio recording in Russian) :
Said by whom? A conversation with a Russian soldier and … who? Could you give us the source for this?
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### Author:  [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3307 "2022-03-24T23:55:05Z")
> [@Velocity](#):
>
> I don’t understand why the Ukrainian numerical advantage hasn’t come to bear yet. No matter how many Russian troops are in Ukraine, doesn’t the present-populace of Ukrainians who are willing and able to fight outnumber them at least 20-to-1? Why hasn’t that led to Russians getting steamrolled by sheer numbers at this point?
This is from yesterday and others have addressed it, but I had wanted to point out that we are seeing the advantage of having many motivated citizen soldiers.
The difference is that they are rightly not on the front line where they would get butchered, but providing defense in depth, allowing the army to commit more professional soldiers to the fight, knowing that someone is there with a certain amount of weapons to slow down attackers if they punch through the front lines. That is huge and is allowing the Ukrainians to fight much more effectively.
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### Author:  [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)
#### Post date: [March 24, 2022, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3308 "2022-03-24T23:55:37Z")
Thank you. I appreciate the perspective you bring to this thread.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3309 "2022-03-25T00:20:39Z")
Look at 0:13 in the video posted earlier:
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#):
>
> This seems to be location of fire:
>
> [https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1505772419906211840](https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1505772419906211840)
Rail tracks. It looks like they go east along the coast to join the main line.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3310 "2022-03-25T00:59:54Z")
American volunteers on the battlefield:
>
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### Author:  [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Stainless_Steel_Rat)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3311 "2022-03-25T01:17:22Z")
Looks like I missed those (to be fair, the close-in view is less than ideal). The tracks you mention in the film might be used to move the unloading/loading cranes as required. Doubt we’ll know for sure, I seriously doubt the Rus will confide in us, and while I’m sure NATO/USG have much better views, I doubt we’ll get to see them.
Still, it requires someone with an understanding of priorities, logistics and schedules _and_ having the authority to make people do the things that are necessary to make a port work…and those folks seem to be in short supply in the Modern Russian Army,
We shall see.
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### Author:  [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3312 "2022-03-25T01:26:36Z")
Google maps doesn’t show any rail line anywhere near the port.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3313 "2022-03-25T01:29:10Z")
On Google Maps, it looks like the rail goes east along the coast. Photographs of Berdyansk support this:
[ ](https://cdn.impactinit.com/cdn/x/x@65eded7ac7/https://s52.impactinit.com/smsimg33//pv/isignstockcontributors/iss_14184_06077.jpg)
[ ](https://l450v.alamy.com/450v/2cc7bf2/berdyansk-ukraine-07232020-embankment-of-the-azov-sea-in-berdyansk-ukraine-on-an-early-summer-morning-2cc7bf2.jpg)
[ ](https://previews.agefotostock.com/previewimage/medibigoff/a0c01d3c8dc8e15082a925163d308fd4/we197375.jpg)
It looks to be non-electrified freight track. Someone more knowledgeable than me would be needed to say how useful this is to a military.
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3314 "2022-03-25T01:33:20Z")
Rails in ports are often for cargo cranes. Pretty common. Coronado and 32nd St in San Diego had such.
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### Author:  [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3315 "2022-03-25T01:34:52Z")
Those rails just don’t look like heavy duty freight rails to me.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3316 "2022-03-25T01:37:16Z")
They do appear to lead from the port docks to the main line, though. They are [shown on Google Maps regular/non-satellite view](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Berdyans'k,+Zaporizhia+Oblast,+Ukraine,+71100/@46.7530322,36.7788798,16.75z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x40e7cad0235f0c37:0x6a66d5d9231d50fc!8m2!3d46.7737707!4d36.8034779).
To add:
The tracks lead to [here](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Berdyans'k,+Zaporizhia+Oblast,+Ukraine,+71100/@46.7430798,36.799806,15.75z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x40e7cad0235f0c37:0x6a66d5d9231d50fc!8m2!3d46.7737707!4d36.8034779), where it looks like a train would have to stop and then head off north, while facing in the same direction, towards Verkhnii Tokmak. As per the railway map I posted earlier in the thread, north to Verkhnii Tokmak is the only route out for trains from Berdyansk.
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### Author:  [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3317 "2022-03-25T01:50:41Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#):
>
> The Sea of Azov is the shallowest sea in the world with an average depth of 23 feet and maximum depth of 46 feet. It would be a death trap for any submarine.
Better to call it the Bay of Azov, or the Slough of Azov.
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### Author:  [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3318 "2022-03-25T02:10:46Z")
Good News/Bad News. Precision bombs are running out. So, Russia will lob old artillery that lands in the general direction of their target. It’ll still do considerable damage and kill people.
At least Russia can’t accurately target hospitals and refugee columns. 😢
Guardian live blog
> [@](#):
>
> ## Russia is running out of precision guided munitions, Pentagon official says
>
> **Russia is running out of precision guided munitions** and it is more likely to rely on so-called dumb bombs and artillery, a senior Pentagon official said on Thursday, Reuters reports.
>
> Under Secretary of Defense for Policy Colin Kahl speculated that he did not believe President Vladimir Putin wanted to have an all out conflict with [Nato](https://www.theguardian.com/world/nato).
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### Author:  [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3319 "2022-03-25T02:33:52Z")
> [@aceplace57](#):
>
> Good News/Bad News. Precision bombs are running out. So, Russia will lob old artillery that lands in the general direction of their target. It’ll still do considerable damage and kill people.
[Private Frost]: What the hell are we supposed to use, man, harsh language?
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [March 25, 2022, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/3320 "2022-03-25T02:36:45Z")
> [@silenus](#):
>
> ETA: Given the above depths, you couldn’t even get a modern sub in there.
that’s literally what Navy Seals and mini subs are for.
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