# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1)
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news
**Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 222
### Author:  [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4485 "2022-04-13T21:28:24Z")
You need to go to your room and think about what you just said!
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### Author:  [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4486 "2022-04-13T21:29:54Z")
The Moskva got licked in the conflick.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4487 "2022-04-13T21:51:27Z")
Yes, and Russia beat his ass. You’d think they would learn from that.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4488 "2022-04-13T21:54:13Z")
Where did the USA get M-17 Russian helicopters? Is one of the former Soviet Union countries sending them, not the USA?
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4489 "2022-04-13T22:01:20Z")
Apparently, they’re from the now-defunct Afghan Air Force.
[https://www.militaryaerospace.com/communications/article/16715565/us-army-to-buy-30-russian-mi17-helicopters-for-use-in-high-hot-areas-of-afghanistan](https://www.militaryaerospace.com/communications/article/16715565/us-army-to-buy-30-russian-mi17-helicopters-for-use-in-high-hot-areas-of-afghanistan)
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### Author:  [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4490 "2022-04-13T22:02:31Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#):
>
> Moskva,
If true then holy crap. Until I Googled it, Moskva used to be this weird helicopter carrier with a gigantic quarter-deck/flight deck. It turned out to have bad sea-keeping characteristics; I believe that it tended to plow as she steamed forward. Now Googling it, the Moskva name has been attached to a Slava class. Again, if true that’s very impressive.
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### Author:  [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4491 "2022-04-13T22:05:50Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#):
>
> This will make things interesting. How reliable is ExpressCoUk?
>
> [: Putin declares war on US and NATO as vehicles carrying weapons now 'targets' | World | News | Express.co.uk](https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1595300/ukraine-war-live-russia-vladimir-putin-volodymyr-zelensky-NATO-latest)
I don’t know about ExpressCoUK specifically, but this is just old news with a sensationalized headline. Russia said some time ago that supplies flowing into Ukraine are “legitimate targets”, but much hinges on whether they’re attacked inside or outside Ukraine. If Russia were to be foolish enough to attack, say, a supply convoy while still in Poland, that would be a major and very serious escalation.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4492 "2022-04-13T22:08:35Z")
Thanks, Walken. Good job!
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4493 "2022-04-13T22:10:31Z")
> [@wolfpup](#):
>
> much hinges on whether they’re attacked inside or outside Ukraine. If Russia were to be foolish enough to attack, say, a supply convoy while still in Poland, that would be a major and very serious escalation.
Indeed, if in Poland, that would be an attack on a fellow NATO member. I’m going to Google “Cold war home fall out shelter”.
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### Author:  [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4494 "2022-04-13T22:20:33Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#):
>
> The flagship of Russia’s Black Sea Fleet, the Moskva, has been seriously damaged by Ukrainian Neptune anti-ship missiles.
If that’s one of the platforms launching missiles at cities then what a feather in Ukraine’s hat.
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### Author:  [@John\_Bredin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Bredin)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4495 "2022-04-13T22:44:41Z")
Sending a constant stream of weapons and other aid to Ukraine is dancing to Putin’s tune?
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### Author:  [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4496 "2022-04-13T23:10:39Z")
Methinks you’ve misunderstood my post and, no snark intended, that was a culmination of a preceding conversation in which I was discussing my thoughts that sending weapons and materiel to Ukraine is not enough and that perhaps NATO should actively intervene, Putin’s threats notwithstanding.
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### Author:  [@romansperson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/romansperson)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4497 "2022-04-13T23:28:03Z")
NYT is now posting about the Moskva:
> Ukrainian missiles struck the Russian warship Moscow, Maxim Marchenko, the head of Odesa’s military forces, said on Telegram. Russia’s Defense Ministry said hours later “a fire” on the ship had caused ammunition to explode, according to [the Russian state news agency Tass](https://tass.ru/proisshestviya/14372453?utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=smm_social_share). It said that the crew had evacuated from the “seriously damaged” ship and the cause of the fire was under investigation.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4498 "2022-04-13T23:39:46Z")
> [@](#):
>
> …the cause of the fire was under investigation.
Russian state media will probably soon announce that the Moskva has been converted into a submarine for a “special undersea operation”.
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### Author:  [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4499 "2022-04-13T23:42:04Z")
Wow, that’s terrific. A single Russian cruiser probably wasn’t having much of a material impact on the kind of bloody land war that this invasion has become, but the morale impacts to both sides could be enormous. Russian naval crews may become extremely reluctant to come within even a hundred miles or so of the Ukrainian coast. And an unhappy crew can create enormous problems for any warship – engines and equipment can mysteriously fail and more.
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### Author:  [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4500 "2022-04-13T23:48:54Z")
> [@filmstar-en](#):
>
> The Deputy Mayor, Serhiy Orlov, told the BBC that Ukrainian troops there were still fighting in Mariupol.
>
> Contradictory messages from Russia and Ukraine, so I guess we still have to wait for the situation to become clear.
It is certainly possible one unit was forced to surrender while others fight on.
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### Author:  [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)
#### Post date: [April 13, 2022, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4501 "2022-04-13T23:52:52Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#):
>
> Russian state media will probably soon announce that the Moskva has been converted into a submarine for a “special undersea operation”.
Russia is saying it was an onboard explosion - I don’t think they’ve said what caused it, but we can make a safe guess - and that the ship has been evacuated, so it’s very badly damaged if the crew couldn’t contain the fire.
Moskva is a BIG ship, well over 10,000 tons. Most navies don’t have ships that big anymore.
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [April 14, 2022, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4502 "2022-04-14T00:05:22Z")
If a nation has a Navy of note at all, they probably have a 10,000 ton ship.
But I’ll agree, most nations don’t bother with Navies of note anymore.
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### Author:  [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)
#### Post date: [April 14, 2022, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4503 "2022-04-14T00:07:45Z")
It looks like there may only be three larger fighting surface ships in the Russian navy - one aircraft carrier and two battlecruisers. There are two other cruisers in the same Slava class as the Moskva. None of these ships are in the Black Sea.
> **[List of active Russian Navy ships](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_Russian_Navy_ships)**
>
> Pages for logged out editors learn more
>
>
>
> This list of active Russian Navy ships presents a picture which can never be fully agreed upon in the absence of greater data availability and a consistent standard for which ships are considered operational or not. The Soviet Navy, and the Russian Navy which inherited its traditions, had a different attitude to operational status than many Western navies. Ships went to sea less, and maintained capability for operations while staying in harbor...
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### Author:  [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)
#### Post date: [April 14, 2022, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/4504 "2022-04-14T00:12:52Z")
Calling the _Admiral Kuznetsov_ a “fighting” ship is a bit of a stretch.
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