# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z") **Posts on this page:** 20 **Page:** 251
### Author: ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat) #### Post date: [April 25, 2022, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5065 "2022-04-25T21:37:43Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Indeed. It would be exceptionally hard to convince millions of Russians that the western goods and travel that they enjoyed a few years ago never actually existed. I have to imagine that Putin is pretty worried about bringing the boys back home. Especially if there isn’t any money to pay them. ---
### Author: ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat) #### Post date: [April 25, 2022, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5066 "2022-04-25T21:49:22Z")
> [@Sauron](#): > > a large portion of the population of both is accustomed to (frankly) getting crapped on by their authoritarian governments. That population is now mostly 60+ years old. I’m personally hoping that, as they see things going back to the old times and get re-familiarized with what it was **actually** like (as opposed to their nostalgia for that era) and see their children and grand-children starting to be bullied and intimidated by the government and police - to ignore that they’re not getting paid, to serve the thugs in some way, to roll over on each other, etc. - the elderly will tell the younger generation that they should push back and not accept it. I don’t know if that will happen. ---
### Author: ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A) #### Post date: [April 25, 2022, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5067 "2022-04-25T23:07:47Z")
Only incidental to the war, but I didn’t want to start a new thread for it. > **[Russian salvage ship Kommuna](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_salvage_ship_Kommuna)** > > Kommuna is a submarine salvage ship in service with the Russian Navy's Black Sea Fleet and the world's oldest active duty naval vessel. A double-hulled catamaran, she was laid down at the Putilov Factory (now the Kirov Factory) in St. Petersburg in November 1912 as Volkhov. The ship was launched the following year, and commissioned on 14 July 1915. She was renamed Kommuna on 31 December 1922. Kommuna has served in the Russian Imperial, Soviet, and Russian Federation navies through the Russ Th... > _ **Kommuna** _ is a submarine [salvage ship](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salvage_ship) in service with the [Russian Navy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Navy)’s [Black Sea Fleet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_Fleet). A double-hulled [catamaran](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catamaran), she was [laid down](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keel_laying) at the Putilov Factory (now the [Kirov Factory](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirov_Factory)) in [St. Petersburg](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Petersburg) in November 1912 as _ **Volkhov** _ . The ship was [launched](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ceremonial_ship_launching) the following year, and [commissioned](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_commissioning) on 14 July 1915. > > \ > > In April 2022, during the [Russian invasion of Ukraine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_Russian_invasion_of_Ukraine), the ship was deployed after the [sinking of the guided missile cruiser _Moskva_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinking_of_the_Moskva).[[4]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_salvage_ship_Kommuna#cite_note-4) The _Moskva_ sank 80 miles (130 km) off the coast from Odessa in 45 to 50 metres (148 to 164 ft) of water.[[5]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_salvage_ship_Kommuna#cite_note-5)[[6]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_salvage_ship_Kommuna#cite_note-6) The size of the _Moskva_ , which sank in one piece, makes bringing it to the surface impractical. _Kommuna_ will reportedly assist in recovering weapons, bodies, and other sensitive material that foreign powers might be interested in. ---
### Author: ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus) #### Post date: [April 25, 2022, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5068 "2022-04-25T23:15:27Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > I have to imagine that Putin is pretty worried about bringing the boys back home. Well, come on all of you, big strong men Uncle Vlad needs your help again He’s got himself in a terrible fuss Way down yonder in Donbas So put down your books and pick up a gun We’re gonna have a whole lotta fun And it’s one, two, three What are we fighting for? Don’t ask me, upon my soul Next stop is Mariupol; And it’s five, six, seven Open up the pearly gates Well there ain’t no time to wonder why Whoopee! we’re all gonna die Well, come on generals, let’s move fast; Your big chance has come at last Now you can go out and get those ~~reds~~ Ukrainian nazis 'Cause the only good ~~commie~~ Ukrainian nazi is the one that’s dead And you know that peace can only be won When we’ve blown 'em all to kingdom come Come on mothers throughout the land Pack your boys off to a neighboring land Come on fathers, and don’t hesitate To send your sons off before it’s too late And you can be the first ones in your block To have your boy come home in a box ---
### Author: ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale) #### Post date: [April 25, 2022, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5069 "2022-04-25T23:51:09Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Assuming Russia takes the East and keeps Crimea, could they actually pull off a naval blockade? … What applies re: US naval presence in the Black Sea. Sure, Russia would decry it. But if Russia clearly pulls its troops back to the east, couldn’t the US - or other nations - send ships to allow trade to Odessa/Ukraine? And wouldn’t you assume a hell of a lot of the weaponry pouring into Ukraine is piling up East of Odessa? ---
### Author: ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5070 "2022-04-26T01:17:55Z")
Recent news claims more Russian aircraft and armored vehicles destroyed; I think this more than anything will decide the war. The Kremlin probably doesn’t give a damn how many men it loses, and presumably shells and bombs are cheap. But if Ukraine can continue to destroy expensive war machines faster than Russia could hope to replace them, at some point the war will become unsustainable for Russia. ---
### Author: ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5071 "2022-04-26T02:10:41Z")
I suspect some people assumed the Russians would stay permanently. Getting in good with the new overlords seemed like a smart move. [Ukrainian law enforcers search for collaborators who helped Russians](https://kyivindependent.com/national/ukrainian-law-enforcers-search-for-collaborators-who-helped-russians/) > [@](#): > > The Russian soldiers that occupied settlements in Kyiv Oblast killed over a thousand civilians. > > Many people were hunted down systematically for being local political leaders, Donbas combat veterans, Territorial Defense joinees or other people of interest to the Russians. > > To find them, Russian forces carried lists with people’s names and addresses. But they also made use of local informants. These collaborators helped Russian forces either track down targets, locate wealthy homes to loot or get information about Ukrainian military positions. > > Now, a hunt for alleged collaborators is underway in recaptured parts of the country. The Security Service of Ukraine (SBU) is working with the national and local police, Territorial Defense units and the State Emergency Service to find suspected collaborators and prosecute them for treason. > > “These facts do exist and we are working on them,” Oleksandr Omelyanenko, the chief of police in the Kyiv Oblast’s Buchanskyi District told the Kyiv Independent. > > On April 7, SBU spokesman Artyom Dehtyarenko announced that 33 alleged collaborators have been identified in Kyiv Oblast. On April 15, he said that over 300 alleged collaborators were arrested in total. The SBU has since announced more arrests. ---
### Author: ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5072 "2022-04-26T02:20:56Z")
I expect not all of them survived to be arrested. I imagine some of the survivors are… _angry_ at those collaborators. Very, very angry. ---
### Author: ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5073 "2022-04-26T04:33:58Z")
The next day or so could be important on the battlefield. The Russian invaders have advanced a bit further to the south of the city of Izyum. It looks like they are pushing in a gap between the town of Barvinkove to the west and a forested area to the east. This 10 km-wide open-spaced gap is more suitable terrain for their tanks and armoured vehicles, and with less risk of ambush by infantry anti-tank weapons from the flanks. The invading forces are now about five miles or so from the last remaining rail line to the easternmost area of Ukrainian control in the Donbas. At the same time, the Ukrainians have made an advance to the northwest of Izyum, threatening supply lines to the city and the forces to its south. [![](https://i.imgur.com/nlPny0G.png) ](https://i.imgur.com/nlPny0G.png) Map: [liveuamap.com](http://liveuamap.com) ---
### Author: ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5074 "2022-04-26T05:45:14Z")
Ranges of some infantry anti-tank weapons in Ukrainian use: NLAW (UK): 1,000 m Javelin (US): 2,500 m Stugna (Ukraine): 5,000 m The Stugna/Skif appears to have been very successful. Video of Stugna taking out four tanks/armoured vehicles in a row: > > Video of a Stugna destroying tank at 4.5 km range: > ---
### Author: ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5075 "2022-04-26T09:02:19Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > I have to imagine that Putin is pretty worried about bringing the boys back home. Especially if there isn’t any money to pay them. Less of an issue every day. Especially with regard to the senior officers. ---
### Author: ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5076 "2022-04-26T13:05:58Z")
This is weird. > [https://nitter.eu/pic/media%2FFRM8n6rXEAAZao1.png%3Fname%3Dsmall](https://nitter.eu/pic/media%2FFRM8n6rXEAAZao1.png%3Fname%3Dsmall) The order to include SIM cards in the assassin’s gear was clearly misinterpreted and instead copies of the game The SIMS was included. > > > Sergej Sumlenny @sumlenny [https://nitter.eu/pic/media%2FFRPGjdYWYAAFFLR.jpg%3Fname%3Dsmall](https://nitter.eu/pic/media%2FFRPGjdYWYAAFFLR.jpg%3Fname%3Dsmall) ---
### Author: ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5077 "2022-04-26T13:11:49Z")
One assumes they were supposed to buy SIM cards. At this point I can’t tell what’s real and what’s parody any more. Also: > [@](#): > > valiant Russian Air Defence units shot a jug of motor oil out of the sky 😵‍💫 ---
### Author: ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5078 "2022-04-26T13:14:45Z")
Maybe the rumors of intransigence in the Russian security services have some validity. ---
### Author: ![74westy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/74westy/32/3950_2.png) [@74westy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/74westy) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5079 "2022-04-26T13:53:48Z")
Stupid Russian idea of the day? ---
### Author: ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5080 "2022-04-26T13:56:18Z")
The Onion apparently took over U.S. politics a few years back; now it seems to be expanding worldwide. ---
### Author: ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5081 "2022-04-26T15:01:21Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > valiant Russian Air Defence units shot a jug of motor oil out of the sky Here’s the image for that: [![](https://i.imgur.com/ImBbKfS.png) ](https://i.imgur.com/ImBbKfS.png) While this particular bit of debris was misidentified, other photos indicate that the Russians did appear to have shot down a Bayraktar drone over Russian territory. It was likely returning from attacking the oil depots in Bryansk a couple of days ago. Still, a small loss for the Ukrainians in what was otherwise an operational success. ---
### Author: ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5082 "2022-04-26T15:08:02Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > It was likely returning from attacking the oil depots in Bryansk a couple of days ago. So, in addition to attacking it, it also raided it for supplies? That’s an advanced drone! ---
### Author: ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5083 "2022-04-26T15:40:14Z")
Sound like that story going around a few years ago where a cafe in China wanted to translate its name into English so went to an online translation site and made up a sign, _504 Gateway Timeout_. ---
### Author: ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight) #### Post date: [April 26, 2022, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5084 "2022-04-26T15:54:44Z")
Transnistria in the news again. Yesterday: > > Today: > > This bridge is the only road crossing to southwestern Ukraine within Ukrainian territory. There is speculation that Russian and Transnistrian separatist forces might attack this area from the north, possibly combined with an amphibious attack from the sea. [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FRRITizXMAIuF76?format=jpg&name=900x900](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FRRITizXMAIuF76?format=jpg&name=900x900) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=250) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=252)