# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 273
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5505 "2022-05-08T14:40:30Z")
And it’s not like they would not have been involved at some point. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5506 "2022-05-08T15:24:54Z")
> [@Akaj](#): > > how about a 10-mile wide DMZ on what’s currently Russian territory, enforced by the UN? When has the UN ever actually enforced anything? _Especially_ against a sitting member of the security council? ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5507 "2022-05-08T15:32:26Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > At that point, Russia will face a stark choice: Keep sending thousands of men to Donbass be shelled to their deaths every week, or…cut losses and go home. Russia’s troops are already poorly trained and motivated cannon fodder. Russia could lose a million of them and say “there’s more where they came from”. But armored vehicles, aircraft and ships are another matter. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5508 "2022-05-08T16:06:47Z")
Military expert on Russian state TV talks about how mobilization would take some time before generated forces could be deployed to the battlefield, as well as the lack of modern military equipment in reserve: > ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5509 "2022-05-08T16:29:11Z")
Trudeau has made a [surprise visit to Ukraine](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-ukraine-visit-1.6445929) and met with Zelensky I think it’s important that western leaders keep up the support, financially, militarily, and politically. Russia has to know that the west is not going to forget about Ukraine. There are 1.4 million Canadians of Ukrainian decent in Canada. Russia is going to be an international pariah for decades at best. At worst, they will be a large North Korea. ---
**Author:** ![filmstar-en](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/50afbb/32.png) [@filmstar-en](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmstar-en)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5510 "2022-05-08T20:02:00Z")
I feel sorry for the ordinary Russians who wanted none of this. The younger ones will not have much to look forward to must be very resentful of the older generation that accept Putins propaganda. Not that their opinion counts for anything in Putin’s Russia. I don’t think it will hit home until the economy begins to contract and sanctions bite. It will take some time to ensure Europe has alternative gas and oil supplies in place. Once that happens Putin’s war chest will empty fast. But these things work both ways and the poor in Europe will see energy bills steeply rise towards the winter. So governments need to plan for this, it is a big issue. Infrastructure takes years to build. Blowing stuff up, on the other hand, is a lot simpler. The old Russian joke is that they won wars because they had the worlds best generals: their names were December and January. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5511 "2022-05-08T20:13:05Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > Russia could lose a million of them and say “there’s more where they came from”. Sadly, military standards (if they are anything like the US) call for using up the fittest young males in the country first. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5512 "2022-05-08T20:26:58Z")
I dunno if it’s true or not, but I heard long ago that your average Frenchman is shorter than average thanks to Napoleon. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5513 "2022-05-08T20:56:17Z")
Napoleon wasn’t even short. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5514 "2022-05-08T20:59:10Z")
I think the point was that thanks to Napoleon’s wars, the taller fit young men were killed, leaving the shorter men to have children. Not that Napoleon himself sired a bunch of short children… ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5515 "2022-05-08T21:24:49Z")
Tall people make bigger targets. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5516 "2022-05-08T21:42:43Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > I think the point was that thanks to Napoleon’s wars, the taller fit young men were killed, leaving the shorter men to have children. Bingo. I guess I should have said, “Napoleon’s military adventures.” ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5517 "2022-05-08T21:56:27Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > Tall people make bigger targets. 17th-19th century [grenadiers](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grenadier) were often recruited in part for their height because it was thought they were able to lob grenades farther. Which makes a certain amount of sense, but also lent them to looking great on the parade ground. Which can then extend into them becoming part of a weird military [height fetish](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potsdam_Giants). “The most beautiful girl or woman in the world would be a matter of indifference to me, but tall soldiers - they are my weakness.” -Frederick William of Prussia ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5518 "2022-05-08T22:06:43Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Trudeau has made a [surprise visit to Ukraine](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-ukraine-visit-1.6445929) and met with Zelensky > > I think it’s important that western leaders keep up the support, financially, militarily, and politically. Russia has to know that the west is not going to forget about Ukraine. > > There are 1.4 million Canadians of Ukrainian decent in Canada. > > Russia is going to be an international pariah for decades at best. At worst, they will be a large North Korea. Great to see Trudeau making the trip to confer with Zelensky. On a lighter note, Trudeau also met Patron, a mine-detector dog. He locates Russian mines and other explosives, with are then de-activated using Canadian-supplied technology. [![](https://dynaimage.cdn.cnn.com/cnn/digital-images/org/bff8c1f9-1fe8-4ff6-a54e-b0502cdded81.jpg) ](https://dynaimage.cdn.cnn.com/cnn/digital-images/org/bff8c1f9-1fe8-4ff6-a54e-b0502cdded81.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5519 "2022-05-08T22:44:40Z")
on a slight tangent (but still relevant) … I feel one distinct strength of the Ukr. is the exhibition of “high” culture (for a lack of other words/phrases). Stuff like cleaning up the bombed out suburbs of Kiev in record time, re-building blown-up railroad bridges in a couple of days or civil efforts like this: [![](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSPopAzXsAgKy82?format=jpg&name=small) ](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSPopAzXsAgKy82?format=jpg&name=small) self-service dog/cat feeding stations for pets who lost their owners I try to wrap my head around those activities without falling in the “superior culture” rut when contrasting those activities with what we have heard/seen about the russian besiegers Also, I am always looking at the background/neighborhoods of many of those circulating pics (to get a better feeling for the country and environment) … and I distinctly recall **often** thinking on how well kept many public places are/were in a country that is by no means rich (example: the beautiful red train station where 52 people were killed a month ago) [![](https://d3i6fh83elv35t.cloudfront.net/static/2022/04/GettyImages-1239836704-2-1024x683.jpg) ](https://d3i6fh83elv35t.cloudfront.net/static/2022/04/GettyImages-1239836704-2-1024x683.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2022, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5520 "2022-05-09T00:44:21Z")
I certainly hope all those visiting foreign heads of state defer to Zelensky’s security requirements. It’s got to have occurred to Russian operatives that a steady stream of dignitaries and their entourages present a security risk. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2022, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5521 "2022-05-09T00:52:38Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > It’s got to have occurred to Russian operatives that a steady stream of dignitaries and their entourages present a security risk. Not sure what you’re getting at with this. A security risk to who? Even the Russians wouldn’t be stupid enough to endanger senior visiting diplomats. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2022, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5522 "2022-05-09T00:54:50Z")
I meant a security risk to Zelensky. A known meeting time and place, with lots of strangers allowed in his immediate vicinity. ---
**Author:** ![Terminus\_Est](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terminus_est/32/3087_2.png) [@Terminus\_Est](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terminus_Est)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2022, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5523 "2022-05-09T02:08:06Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Even the Russians wouldn’t be stupid enough to endanger senior visiting diplomats. You mean like the time they bombed Kyiv while the UN Secretary-General was visiting? [https://time.com/6172095/russia-kyiv-attack-guterres/](https://time.com/6172095/russia-kyiv-attack-guterres/) ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2022, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5524 "2022-05-09T02:19:09Z")
I’m not sure what to think about that. Maybe Putin regards the UN as essentially toothless. I don’t agree – I think if the Sec-Gen has been injured or killed, there would have been serious repercussions. But perhaps Putin didn’t think so. But how about an attack that affected the US First Lady, the US Secretary of Defense and Secretary of State, the Canadian Prime Minister, or the British Prime Minister? I think that would be crossing a red line and NATO would have moved in. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=272) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=274)