# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 285
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5745 "2022-05-16T13:52:21Z")
Related to the side subject: Pro-Russian Hackers were foiled when they tried to disrupt voting for Eurovision. > **[Eurovision 2022: Russian vote hacking attempt foiled, police say](https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-61463364)** > > Italian police say pro-Russian hackers targeted the contest, which was won by Ukraine. **More importantly** : Sweden is going to request membership in NATO. Well played Putin, you were right about NATO expansion, of course, you caused it. > **[As it happened: Biggest-ever US aid package for Ukraine approved - BBC News](https://www.bbc.com/news/live/world-europe-61461805)** > > The Senate backs $40bn of military, economic and humanitarian support as Russian attacks continue. ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5746 "2022-05-16T13:59:35Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > Sweden is going to request membership in NATO. Well played Putin, you were right about NATO expansion, of course, you caused it. According to an article from Politico today, Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov states that “It is a pity that common sense is being sacrificed for some phantom ideas about what should be done in the current situation.” It is as thought the entire Russian government (for various reasons) is completely deluded. We all know this but it’s amazing how everything that they say is significantly divorced from reality and common sense. > **[Russia will not ‘put up with’ Finland, Sweden’s NATO bid, minister says](https://www.politico.eu/article/russia-threaten-finland-sweden-nato-ambition-consequence/)** > > ‘It is a pity that common sense is being sacrificed for some phantom ideas about what should be done in the current situation,’ Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov says. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5747 "2022-05-16T15:28:25Z")
The control of people’s history and thinking begins very early. The Russians have barely seized control and they immediately go after the school administrators and principals. I find it especially unnerving because Russia and Ukraine had been so closely linked. The textbooks wouldn’t have been unusually critical of Russia. > **[This is what the 'Russification' of Ukraine's education system looks like in...](https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/16/europe/russia-ukraine-education-intl-cmd/index.html)** > > When masked Russian soldiers ransacked Nina's home in northeastern Ukraine at 6 a.m. one day in late April, they were not searching for weapons. Instead, they were looking for her Ukrainian textbooks. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5748 "2022-05-16T20:12:26Z")
Anyone heard anything recently about Rand Paul blocking approval of the $40B humanitarian and military aid package for Ukraine? ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5749 "2022-05-16T20:43:23Z")
Just that he’s apparently “concerned” by it. I imagine he’s more concerned about Putin revealing whatever Kompromat he has on Paul. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5750 "2022-05-16T21:06:27Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Just that he’s apparently “concerned” by it. I imagine he’s more concerned about Putin revealing whatever Kompromat he has on Paul. Paul did a similar thing, earlier: > **[Rand Paul throws fresh wrench in Senate's push for quick Russia trade sanctions](https://www.politico.com/news/2022/03/24/rand-paul-russia-trade-sanctions-00020093)** > > The Kentucky Republican is preventing the bipartisan House-passed bill from getting a speedy Senate vote while President Joe Biden is in Europe. To quote him: > [@](#): > > “If you don’t define what human-rights abuses are, you set up something so wide open that you could have abuse of a president who’s allowed to sanction anyone in the world for anything they feel like,” Paul said in a brief interview. > > Paul’s concerns reflect those of the eight Republicans who voted against the legislation in the House. They argued that the broad Magnitsky-related provisions could empower Biden to sanction individuals or entities who deny access to abortions, for example. Minus knowing what his objection is, I’d expect it to be something similar - a semi-reasonable objection to sloppy language. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5751 "2022-05-16T21:46:21Z")
Looks like some of the Azovostal defenders have gotten out. Hopefully they can get the remainder out, somehow. > **[Ukrainian force begins evacuating from last Mariupol stronghold](https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/ukraine-counter-attacks-russian-forces-east-2022-05-16/)** > > Troops holed up in the last Ukrainian stronghold in the besieged port of Mariupol began evacuating on Monday, appearing to cede control of the once prosperous city to Russia after months of bombardment. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5752 "2022-05-16T23:34:37Z")
The bizarre similarities between Hitler and Putin just keep appearing. Hopefully Putin will lead his troops into collapse just like Hitler. AFAIK Putin has no real military training? > [@](#): > > The Russian president is helping determine the movement of forces in the Donbas, they added, where last week the invaders suffered a bloody defeat as they tried on multiple occasions to cross a strategic river in the east of [Ukraine](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ukraine). > **[Putin involved in war ‘at level of colonel or brigadier’, say western sources](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/16/putin-involved-russia-ukraine-war-western-sources)** > > President helping determine movement of Russian soldiers, say sources, as head of UK armed forces says Ukraine is winning ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5753 "2022-05-16T23:44:19Z")
Putin’s cool with Finland/Sweden joining NATO as long as there’s no military buildup. HA [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/wcA_kSDIOfA/maxresdefault.jpg "Putin Says Russia Has No Problem With Sweden or Finland") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcA_kSDIOfA) ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5754 "2022-05-16T23:52:22Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Just that he’s apparently “concerned” by it. I imagine he’s more concerned about Putin revealing whatever Kompromat he has on Paul. Paul has elements of old-fashioned isolationism in his thinking. There’s no need to reach for conspiracy theories to explain his behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5755 "2022-05-16T23:55:06Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > AFAIK Putin has no real military training? He was career KGB, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5756 "2022-05-17T00:01:09Z")
Trouble in Putin’s paradise? It can’t be true?😂 Site: [Russian Offensive Campaign Assessment, May 16 | Institute for the Study of War](https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-may-16) > [@](#): > > **Frictions between Russian occupation administrations and pro-Russian collaborators is growing in occupied areas of Ukraine.** The Zaporizhia Oblast Military Administration reported that Russian forces are having serious conflicts with collaborators due to interpersonal power conflicts.[4] A well-known collaborator in Zaporizhia accused the Russian-installed governor of the area of stealing his 10,000 ruble compensation. Advisor to the Mayor of Mariupol Petro Andryshchenko additionally claimed that relatives of those mobilized into the forces of the Donetsk People’s Republic (DNR) are holding a mass protest against mobilization in Donetsk City. While ISW cannot independently verify these claims, such discontent amongst occupation elements suggests a general lack of planning by Russian authorities in occupied areas, now compounded by increasingly evident Russian losses. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5757 "2022-05-17T00:13:39Z")
> [@Morgyn](#): > > He was career KGB, IIRC. Hmm, Putin may have taken some basic military training. Learn who to salute and weapons training. Nothing that qualifies him to lead troops. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5758 "2022-05-17T00:40:38Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The bizarre similarities between Hitler and Putin just keep appearing. At least Hitler was an actual soldier who served in a war. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5759 "2022-05-17T02:52:38Z")
The entire Mariupol garrison is surrendering? I’m very suspicious of Russian agreements. I hope these men are really returned to Ukraine. It does seem like a good deal. The Russians can finally close the books on Mariupol. They’ve expended too many lives and resources against that steel plant. It sounds like Ukraine high command had trouble getting the Azov regiment to surrender. Guardian blog > [@](#): > > The General Staff of Ukraine’s Armed Forces said that the soldiers defending the steel plant had fulfilled their combat mission. > “The supreme military command ordered the commanders of the units stationed at Azovstal to save the lives of the personnel,” the General Staff said in a statement on its Facebook account. “Efforts to rescue defenders who remain on the territory of Azovstal continue.” > > In a statement, the Azov regiment said that it was fulfilling orders to save the lives of its troops. > [@](#): > > In order to save lives, the entire Mariupol garrison is implementing the approved decision of the supreme military command and hopes for the support of the Ukrainian people,” the Azov regiment said in a social media post. > > It said its troops in Mariupol, on the Sea of Azov in the south-east, had held out for 82 days, buying time for the rest of Ukraine to battle Russian forces and secure western arms needed to withstand Russia’s assault. > > Since Russia launched its invasion in February, Mariupol’s devastation has become a symbol both of Ukraine’s ability to withstand Russia’s invasion and of Russia’s willingness to devastate Ukrainian cities that hold out. > > The evacuation came hours after Russia said it had agreed to evacuate wounded Ukrainian soldiers to a medical facility in Novoazovsk. > > “An agreement has been reached on the removal of the wounded,” Russia’s defence ministry said. “A humanitarian corridor has been opened through which wounded Ukrainian servicemen are being taken to a medical facility in Novoazovsk.” ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5760 "2022-05-17T03:15:45Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I hope these men are really returned to Ukraine. Your quote says that they are going to a facility in Novoazovsk, a town in Donetsk oblast, which is still Ukrainian territory, albeit currently under Russian control. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5761 "2022-05-17T03:25:27Z")
The civilian evacuation a couple weeks ago was handled by the UN and Red Cross. Surrendering to the Russians must be tense. But it helps they are going to a occupied Ukraine city and not disappearing into Russia. I remember a documentary about bunkers. They have to withstand bombing by air. They are also designed to protect against land based forces outside the bunker. The Soviets did an excellent job with the steel mill bunker. Imagine NATO troops attacking that thing in the 1980’s. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5762 "2022-05-17T06:12:55Z")
The Russiian military expert [in the video I posted about earlier in the thread](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24/960037/5508), has again pierced the propaganda bubble on Russian state TV: > ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5763 "2022-05-17T09:05:32Z")
> [@velomont](#): > > According to an article from Politico today, Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov states that “It is a pity that common sense is being sacrificed for some phantom ideas about what should be done in the current situation.” > > It is as thought the entire Russian government (for various reasons) is completely deluded. We all know this but it’s amazing how everything that they say is significantly divorced from reality and common sense. It all makes perfect sense if you subscribe to the notion that the Kremlin has the right to dictate to other nations as if those other nations are subordinate vassals. Unfortunately for the Kremlin no one else is playing their game. Unfortunately for everyone else, Putin’s Russia started a war over this. Really, I get the impression that the Russian leadership (and some below that level) are absolutely convinced that they should be on top/dominate/control/command and are completely baffled that no one else is enthused about this, and don’t understand why everyone else isn’t eager to be subservient or a second class citizen under Russian control. So of the ultimate sinister manifestation of the old joke “We’re from the government and we’re here to help you”. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 9:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/5764 "2022-05-17T09:35:22Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Really, I get the impression that the Russian leadership (and some below that level) are absolutely convinced that they should be on top/dominate/control/command and are completely baffled that no one else is enthused about this, and don’t understand why everyone else isn’t eager to be subservient or a second class citizen under Russian control. I think this is accurate. Which makes it particularly satisfying – in a Schadenfreude sort of way – that Russia is losing so miserably in the Ukraine war, and their military is being exposed on the international stage as incompetent stooges with malfunctioning equipment and comically inept logistics. Putin and his henchmen must be having fits. Finland and Sweden applying to join NATO is a bonus. Ukraine might be next once they drive out the Russkies and territorial disputes are resolved. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=284) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=286)