# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 328
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6605 "2022-07-15T13:29:38Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > I admit I was deeply intrigued to see where that one was going in the context of this thread… They ate too much moldy grain? 😊 Meanwhile, Russia’s senseless and brutal targeting never ends. > ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6606 "2022-07-15T13:34:56Z")
Are they hitting every target they have every day with their current supply of HIMARS? (No). So why wouldn’t more help? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6607 "2022-07-15T14:28:18Z")
Is Ukraine shooting at any targets in Russia? If not, is it for lack of range? Or is it for political reasons? I suspect/think I heard the latter, but I’d just like to be clear. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6608 "2022-07-15T15:06:44Z")
I’ve seen a few reports of ammunition dumps and supplies blowing up just inside Russia’s border. I posted video of a drone attack a few weeks ago. Some construction workers were commenting about it. AFAIK HIMARS haven’t been used inside Russia. The other attacks haven’t been formally acknowledged by Ukraine. A British Aid worker died in custody. I looked around and haven’t found any organizations that Paul Urey is affiliated with. He should have received proper care regardless. > **[Separatists In Ukraine Say Captive Briton Paul Urey Has Died In Custody](https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-russia-paul-urey-report-died-detention/31945004.html)** > > A representative of Russia-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine said on July 15 that Briton Paul Urey, who was captured by forces fighting against pro-Kyiv troops in Ukraine, has died in detention. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6609 "2022-07-15T15:21:27Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Is Ukraine shooting at any targets in Russia? If not, is it for lack of range? Or is it for political reasons? I suspect/think I heard the latter, but I’d just like to be clear. Ukraine has hit inside Russia with drones and special forces raids. I’m not sure if they’ve used anything else. The US has requested they not hit Russia with HIMARS to avoid escalation. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6610 "2022-07-15T16:34:39Z")
M270s are now in Ukraine. Ukrainian Minister of Defence: > [![](https://www.forces.net/sites/default/files/styles/cover_image/public/A%20M270%20MLRS%20operated%20at%20Kirkcudbright%20Training%20Area%20in%20Scotland%20221020%20CREDIT%20BFBS.jpg?itok=05rHWsrW) ](https://www.forces.net/sites/default/files/styles/cover_image/public/A%20M270%20MLRS%20operated%20at%20Kirkcudbright%20Training%20Area%20in%20Scotland%20221020%20CREDIT%20BFBS.jpg?itok=05rHWsrW) ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6611 "2022-07-15T16:55:28Z")
Russian recruitment billboard for Wagner mercenaries. [https://nitter.it/pic/orig/enc/bWVkaWEvRlhzWWVZNFZFQUVDOFByLmpwZw==](https://nitter.it/pic/orig/enc/bWVkaWEvRlhzWWVZNFZFQUVDOFByLmpwZw==) I’m not sure what the figure in the middle is carrying, but it looks suspiciously like a compact washing machine. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6612 "2022-07-15T17:34:45Z")
I haven’t heard or personally figured this out yet, but are all the NATO MLRS systems being provided to Ukraine (HIMARS, M270) armed with the conventional 6-pack of lighter guided missiles (like the M30 or M31) or the bigger (and longer-ranged) unitary ATACMS missiles? ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6613 "2022-07-15T17:46:38Z")
I don’t think the Ukrainians have access to long-range ATACMS yet, but that may change in time. > ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2022, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6614 "2022-07-15T18:59:55Z")
ATACMS were withheld out of fear Ukraine might strike deep into Russia proper, Russia would blame the US, etc. Ukraine has now shown they’re ok working within the constraints the US wants, so longer range munitions are more likely now. Would be nice to threaten bases in Crimea. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6615 "2022-07-16T01:01:50Z")
Reports and photos show Ukrainian troops training with M777A2 howitzers. These are capable of firing the GPS enable Excalibur 155mm shells. NY Times reports the 1,000 precision shells in the latest aid shipment are Excalibur, not the less precise M1156 fuzed standard rounds. Also M270 MLRS have arrived in Ukraine and are in use. Latest fires activity shows a dramatic drop in Russian artillery activity - lots of ammunition storage has prematurely detonated. > **[Ukraine Situation Report: Ukrainian Troops Training With Howitzers Optimized...](https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/ukraine-situation-report-howitzers-optimized-for-guided-artillery-rounds-now-in-service)** > > Having the M777A2 howitzer means Ukraine can more easily and effectively employ Excalibur guided-artillery shells in the heat of combat. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6616 "2022-07-16T02:05:40Z")
I don’t know if anybody remembers from earlier in the thread when I was wondering aloud about remote control tanks, and whether they would be useful on the battlefield. Opening the link just posted by smithsb, in the article it mentions M113s arriving in Ukraine, and it’s a link. If you open the link, it’s not about Ukraine at all. It opens this: > **[Army Tests Uncrewed M113 Armed With Laser-Guided Rocket Launcher](https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/army-tests-uncrewed-m113-armed-with-laser-guided-rocket-launcher)** > > Outfitting surplus M113s with autonomous brains and weapons could be a cost-effective route to fielding robotic combat vehicles. Looks like the US has been working on the concept diligently for years. I find it a little unsettling that instead of going full remote control to be used by infantry in the area like I was thinking, they are also working on autonomous, unmanned AI control. Apparently a prototype just showed up in the wild for the first time. Yikes. ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6617 "2022-07-16T05:02:34Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > Latest fires activity shows a dramatic drop in Russian artillery activity - lots of ammunition storage has prematurely detonated. I wonder if we should send a sympathy card to Russia, what with all that ammunition spontaneously blowing itself up. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 5:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6618 "2022-07-16T05:10:53Z")
Britain is training fresh Ukrainian troops and Russia has a large recruitment drive. Imho The Ukrainians will receive broader and more useful training. 34,000 fresh Russian troops is still a lot to deploy. Site: [Russian Volunteer Units and Battalions | Institute for the Study of War](https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-volunteer-units-and-battalions) > [@](#): > > **The Russian Federation has launched a large-scale drive to form volunteer battalions in the 85 “federal subjects” (or regions) that comprise the federation.** Recruiting for some volunteer battalions began in June but has intensified in July, with new volunteer units being reported daily. The battalions apparently will consist of roughly 400 men each aged between 18 and 60. They will belong to various branches of service including motorized rifle, tank, and naval infantry, but also signals and logistics. Recruits are not required to have prior military service and will undergo only 30 days of training before deployment to Ukraine. > > **This recruitment effort will likely be expensive if it comes close to meeting its targets.** It appears that the Russian Ministry of Defense will pay the volunteers’ salaries while the “federal subjects” will pay their enlistment bonuses. Salaries generally start at roughly $3,000 per month per soldier or about $1.2 million per month per 400-man unit. Enlistment bonuses offered by at least some units appear to be roughly a month’s salary. If the effort generates 85 battalions each of 400 men it would bring an additional 34,000 volunteers into the fight at the cost of about $102 million per month in salary alone. Considering that the 30 days of training the volunteers will receive before entering combat will not produce combat-ready soldiers, that price is very high. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6619 "2022-07-16T05:46:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Recruits are not required to have prior military service and will undergo only 30 days of training before deployment to Ukraine. It’s real cannon fodder stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6620 "2022-07-16T05:59:19Z")
HOW LONG WAS BASIC TRAINING FOR THE VIETNAM WAR? > [@](#): > > Although I underwent the usual eight weeks of “Basic” in 1984 — followed by 13 weeks of advanced training in my MOS (military occupational specialty [sic]) in 1985, I checked with a fellow editor who had been with the U.S. Army in Vietnam, to make sure whether it was any different then. His response was as follows: > > “Basic Training was eight weeks, in some cases nine. From there you went to Advanced Individual Training. AIT for an infantryman (11B) was eight weeks, though in my case, it was nine weeks. By two weeks into Basic you had not even gotten your hands on your rifle yet. > > “From the day I enlisted (September 26, 1966) to the day I set foot in Vietnam (March 26, 1967), it was exactly six months. I’ve known a few guys who got there a few weeks short of six months, but not many. Anybody sent into combat with only two weeks of training would last about three minutes (if that) into his first fire fight. But far worse, he’d get half the guys around him killed.” > > David Zabecki, Major General, U.S. Army (retired) > **[How Long was Basic Training for the Vietnam War?](https://www.historynet.com/long-basic-training-vietnam-war/)** > > How long was Basic Training during the Vietnam War? Were draftees ever sent to Vietnam with only 2 weeks of training? A friend of mine insists that some ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6621 "2022-07-16T06:29:19Z")
Age up to 60? That’s insane. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6622 "2022-07-16T07:06:08Z")
> [@](#): > > “But far worse, he’d get half the guys around him killed.” Not exactly a bug but more like a feature, considering part of the point is to saturate the battlefield and make it more difficult for Ukraine to accurately identify and attack targets of legitimate value. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6623 "2022-07-16T07:31:36Z")
I haven’t seen any reports about the number of weeks training the Ukrainian troops will get in the Uk. I’d hope they understand the value of investing enough training that the troops are effective on the battlefield. Survivability is crucial for morale of the soldiers and the country. No family wants to see their children turned into cannon fodder. The Russians can waste men because their country isn’t being shelled into oblivion. Their propaganda will reassure the families their children fought well and died heroically. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2022, 11:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/6624 "2022-07-16T11:29:58Z")
I apologize if this has been asked and answered already-how mobile are those vehicles? I was under the impression Ukraine was relying on firing then quickly moving to a new location. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=327) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=329)