# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 406
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8165 "2022-09-18T18:00:57Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > But remember, this is an area replete with Russian partisans (people who want Donbas to be in Russia). Their strength and community-support has diminished since this little donnybrook, but the people in the area are not all in favor of Ukraine reclaiming the territory. Probably more than 50%, but that other less-than-50% could be troublesome. I think a lot of the question is, how many of those people are still Russian partisans after they’ve actually been occupied by a Russian army behaving, by most accounts, like a classic invading force of previous centuries instead of like the rescuers Putin tried to claim them to be? I very much doubt the number is zero; but it might be a whole lot fewer than before the invasion. Impossible to tell from where I’m sitting, of course. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8166 "2022-09-18T18:14:00Z")
> [@Bootb](#): > > That’s a bowdlerized version of what Marine Sergeant Major Dan Daly said during the Battle of Belleau Wood. FYI he is one of nineteen _double_ recipients of the [Medal of Honor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Daly). His first was during the Boxer Rebellion in China some fifteen years before his second in Haiti. Belleau Wood he only got a Navy Cross. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8167 "2022-09-18T18:18:14Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > I very much doubt the number is zero; but it might be a whole lot fewer than before the invasion. It’s almost certainly fewer. Some no doubt changed their mind when they saw the indiscriminate thuggery of the Russian occupiers. There was an interview a few weeks ago, for example, with a mayor of an eastern town. He’d previously wanted his area to secede and join Russia. Then he saw firsthand what that meant, and took up arms for Ukraine. I’d need to go find the article to confirm the details, but that’s the gist. Then there are those whose loyalty did not change, who were happy to work with the Russians to cement their gains. Many of them have now fled from the Ukrainian advance, fearing reprisal for their collaboration with the invaders. Either way, there are undoubtedly fewer Russian loyalists on the ground in territory recaptured by Ukraine’s forces. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8168 "2022-09-18T18:57:48Z")
Ukraine captures a top of the line Russian T-90M tank in perfect condition near Kharkiv, and throws a little shade announcing it. > ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8169 "2022-09-18T20:02:05Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Ukraine captures a top of the line Russian T-90M tank in perfect condition near Kharkiv, and throws a little shade announcing it. The Pentagon: “Say, remember all that help we’ve given you? Here’s what you can do in return. . . .” ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8170 "2022-09-18T20:41:18Z")
> [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](#): > > I didn’t realise before that the Mexican government looks like its been taken over by a demagogue who is pro-Russian. The mx. López Obrador government is **very** left leaning … so no big surprises, here. They - just like Venezuela and Bolivia - support Russia ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8171 "2022-09-18T21:03:53Z")
> [@Al128](#): > > The mx. López Obrador government is **very** left leaning … so no big surprises, here. They - just like Venezuela and Bolivia - support Russia AFAIK, the support for Russia was there before the invasion, after the invasion those left leaning countries abstained when voting to condemn Russia, not a repudiation, but not really being supportive of Russia or the USA. > **[Increasingly isolated, Putin finds a few allies in Latin America](https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2022-03-05/la-fg-ukraine-latin-america-response)** > > Venezuela, Cuba and Nicaragua — all long-standing allies of Russia — have voiced support for the Russian leader. > Still, when it came to the United Nations General Assembly vote this week calling on Russia to immediately withdraw its troops, the three countries stopped short of offering Putin their full support. > > Nicaragua and Cuba abstained. Venezuela could not vote because it had not paid its member dues. > > Experts said Nicaragua and Cuba made a calculation that they had too much to lose by joining Russia, Belarus, Syria, North Korea and Eritrea as the only countries to vote against the resolution. Cuba in particular did not want to “burn all its bridges” with the United States, said Vladimir Rouvinski, a political scientist at Icesi University in Colombia. > > During the administration of President Obama, the countries restored diplomatic relations. Cuba would like the United States to ease sanctions that limit remittances to the island. > > Still, Jennie Lincoln, a senior advisor on Latin America at the Carter Center think tank, called the abstentions “a kick in the shins to the U.S.” and “a way of expressing their anti-imperialist view of the West.” > > Apart from abstentions from El Salvador and Bolivia — also places where anti-U.S. sentiment runs high — the rest of Latin America supported the U.N. resolution. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8172 "2022-09-18T21:04:16Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Where should the Ukr. really start worrying about partisans? Donbas? Or is the anti-Russian sentiment enough that collaborators will be pointed out as soon as they roll into town? I strongly suspect, as others have already indicated, that support for Russian rule in the Donbas will have dropped precipitously during the last few months chafing under Russian occupation. Expect to see more lines forming at the Russian border as more collaborators flee from retribution as Ukraine forces advance like we saw happen during the Kharkiv offensive. I doubt partisans will be much of a concern for Ukraine. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8173 "2022-09-18T21:25:51Z")
The same is likely true in Crimea. There have been lots of videos and reports of long lines of cars leaving Crimea. Those aren’t Ukrainians - they are Russians who relocated to Crimea after 2014, or current Russian workers and tourists who are getting out of Dodge. If the war turns to Crimea and it looks like Ukraine is winning, I would expect a mass exodus of Russians if they can get out. If the Ukrainians take back Kherson and then start moving on the rest of the Donbas and Crimea, that will be the point of maximum risk of a tactical nuke being deployed by Putin, IMO. Hopefully it won’t hapen, but that will be the moment when Putin’s back is against the wall - perhaps literally if he loses Crimea as well. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8174 "2022-09-18T21:44:40Z")
Why is there cloth all over the outside of that tank? Are they trying to protect it from bug splatter or rocks being kicked up? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8175 "2022-09-18T21:49:51Z")
They’re gift-wrapping it before sending it state-side. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8176 "2022-09-18T21:53:05Z")
They forgot the bows and ribbons. It’s not a real present without bows and ribbons. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8177 "2022-09-18T21:58:21Z")
It’s a camouflage material called Nakidka that’s intended to reduce the chances of detection by infrared, thermal and radar imaging. > **[Nakidka](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakidka)** > > Nakidka is a Russian radar-absorbent material (RAM) camouflage that "eliminates the use of precision-guided weapons" Nakidka reduces the infrared, thermal, and radar band signatures of an object. It can be mounted on armored fighting vehicles, field fortifications, command posts, permanent air and vehicle sheds, and ammunition and fuel depots by infantry with no special equipment. > According to NII Stali (Scientific Research Institute of Steel), which designed Nakidka, it reduces the chances of d... ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8178 "2022-09-18T22:56:10Z")
Famous Russian singer comes out as against the war. Alla Pugacheva “enjoys an iconic status across the former Soviet Union as the most successful Soviet performer in terms of record sales and popularity” (Wikipedia). > ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2022, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8179 "2022-09-18T23:38:39Z")
Armenia is disatisfied with the lack of assistance in its Azerbaijan conflict from its CSTO (“Russia’s NATO”) ally, Russia. > [@](#): > > But in a sign of potential challenges, a senior Armenian official expressed unhappiness with the response of a Russian-led military alliance to Yerevan’s request for help, Interfax news agency reported. > > Armenia asked the Moscow-led Collective Security Treaty Organisation (CSTO) to intervene, but so far it has just sent a fact-finding team to the region. > > “We are very dissatisfied, of course. The expectations we had were not justified,” parliamentary speaker Alen Simonyan told national television, likening the CSTO to a pistol that did not shoot bullets, Interfax said. > > Noting Armenia also had a treaty on mutual assistance with Russia, he said “we expect more tangible steps from our Russian partners, not just statements or half words.” [https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/putin-says-russia-able-mediate-azeri-armenian-conflict-yerevan-unhappy-with-2022-09-16/](https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/putin-says-russia-able-mediate-azeri-armenian-conflict-yerevan-unhappy-with-2022-09-16/) There have been protests in Armenia calling for the country to leave the CSTO. > ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2022, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8180 "2022-09-19T00:54:22Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fc9M2u4XoAcW824.jpg](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fc9M2u4XoAcW824.jpg) [![](https://c.tenor.com/t2J6nzxt2VQAAAAC/put-it-in-h-the-simpsons.gif) ](https://c.tenor.com/t2J6nzxt2VQAAAAC/put-it-in-h-the-simpsons.gif) ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2022, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8181 "2022-09-19T01:20:19Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > I strongly suspect, as others have already indicated, that support for Russian rule in the Donbas will have dropped precipitously during the last few months chafing under Russian occupation. don’t the russians have a special gift for winning hearts wherever they walk the earth??? 😉 > [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > If the war turns to Crimea and it looks like Ukraine is winning, I would expect a mass exodus of Russians if they can get out. the Ukr. have proved their smartness over and over … they will def. leave a corridor open for russians to evacuate … remember every russian in Ukr. could later be “used” as … _has called for russian help and invasion as his fundamental rights are being violated…_ … also a couple of 10.000s (or 100.000s?) of russians heading home to mother russia are def. a destabilizing element as they would need to go somewhere … so a doble-win for Ukr. if they can get rid of them peacefully > [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > [https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/putin-says-russia-able-mediate-azeri-armenian-conflict-yerevan-unhappy-with-2022-09-16/](https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/putin-says-russia-able-mediate-azeri-armenian-conflict-yerevan-unhappy-with-2022-09-16/) > > There have been protests in Armenia calling for the country to leave the CSTO. at this stage, everything that does de-stabilize russia / is a headache to Putin is good news, I guess … ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2022, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8182 "2022-09-19T01:52:57Z")
[https://twitter.com/WarMonitor3/status/1571633553397678081?cxt=HHwWgoDUtfqYyM8rAAAA](https://twitter.com/WarMonitor3/status/1571633553397678081?cxt=HHwWgoDUtfqYyM8rAAAA) . that is a highly interesting synthesis: > ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2022, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8183 "2022-09-19T01:55:42Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > Famous Russian singer comes out as against the war. Alla Pugacheva “enjoys an iconic status across the former Soviet Union as the most successful Soviet performer in terms of record sales and popularity” I hope she has lefty Russia. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2022, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8184 "2022-09-19T02:13:13Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > Armenia is disatisfied with the lack of assistance in its Azerbaijan conflict from its CSTO (“Russia’s NATO”) ally, Russia. It’s not as if they should not have noticed that was not much help [back in 2020](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_Nagorno-Karabakh_war) either. (This is also by the way why NATO requires entrants to have any border issues at least nominally settled – so that nobody can then seek to Article 5 a conflict that was standing but just paused) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=405) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=407)