# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 432
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 10:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8687 "2022-09-28T10:34:21Z")
.withdrawn … ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8688 "2022-09-28T11:48:59Z")
> I think every Russian military asset outside the Russian borders would be a target. National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan said that the results for Russia would be “catastrophic” if they used nuclear or chemical weapons. He also said that Russia had been informed what the consequences would be, although he would not reveal them publicly. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8689 "2022-09-28T12:06:27Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > I think every Russian military asset outside the Russian borders would be a target. National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan said that the results for Russia would be “catastrophic” if they used nuclear or chemical weapons. He also said that Russia had been informed what the consequences would be, although he would not reveal them publicly. I don’t see how that (NATO troops in Ukraine) would be of any benefit. If Putin had already used one nuke to kill Ukrainian troops, why wouldn’t he use a second one to kill the NATO troops? From his perspective a dead enemy is a dead enemy. I can see the argument for a conventional invasion of Russia proper with an explicitly stated goal of regime change. It’ll probably lead to MAD, but if Russia uses a nuke we’re pretty much there already. By limiting an attack to kicking Russia out of Ukraine using conventional NATO troops, at that point we’re just telling Putin “you can nuke us but we won’t hit you back.” ETA. And even more importantly, from Putin’s perspective, is this. A dead Putin is a dead Putin. He doesn’t care whether he dies via a NATO nuke, a bullet in the head from one of his own generals, or at the hands of an executioner at The Hague. He’ll be dead either way. A conventional defeat limited to just Ukraine is just as likely to lead to a dead Putin (via internal revolution), so why would he care that NATO limits themselves in such a manner? ETA 2. Which means that the way to go is to convince those Russians whose hands are on the red buttons that their interests are not the same as Putin’s. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8690 "2022-09-28T12:21:05Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > If Putin had already used one nuke to kill Ukrainian troops, why wouldn’t he use a second one to kill the NATO troops? Because then he has purposefully killed NATO troops, and NATO responding (either conventionally or nuclearly) becomes basically a necessity. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8691 "2022-09-28T12:41:37Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Seems like they didn’t even bother getting some idiot to mark the да boxes: There’s video of someone “counting” the ballots. It’s a bit grainy at first, but later you can clearly see the ballots are blank. But it’s even better - _she’s not even looking at the ballots as she “counts”._ [https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/xq2ty1/russians\_counting\_blank\_ballots\_without\_even/](https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/comments/xq2ty1/russians_counting_blank_ballots_without_even/) > [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > ETA 2. Which means that the way to go is to convince those Russians whose hands are on the red buttons that their interests are not the same as Putin’s. Yeah, if Putin nukes something, then there’s no point in worrying any more about “what might Putin do?” He’s already done the worst thing he could do. After that, all plans should be centered around, “Convince everyone else in Russia to get rid of Putin”. ---
**Author:** ![CaveMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cavemike/32/16379_2.png) [@CaveMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaveMike)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8692 "2022-09-28T13:07:18Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > There’s video of someone “counting” the ballots. It’s a bit grainy at first, but later you can clearly see the ballots are blank. > > But it’s even better - _she’s not even looking at the ballots as she “counts”._ It looks like the counting/sorting of the ballots is on the table behind her and then the sorted ballots are stacked on the front table. She is showing the pre-sorted ballots to the camera so she doesn’t have to look at them. Obviously the election is still a sham… ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8693 "2022-09-28T13:16:57Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > There’s video of someone “counting” the ballots. It’s a bit grainy at first, but later you can clearly see the ballots are blank. > > But it’s even better - _she’s not even looking at the ballots as she “counts”._ See, that’s the difference between counting ballots and counting votes. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8694 "2022-09-28T17:14:03Z")
This is is an amazing spectacle: One of Russia’s top news panel shows, generally spouting whatever the Kremlin line of the day is. But now, one of the hosts of the show has been drafted, and this is what occurred: > First point: These people are _awful_. They have been the hawkiest of the war hawks, but now suddenly the Donbas is a ‘meat grinder’. The femle co-host (the biggest hawk of them all) says that the host should never have been drafted because Russia has enough pedophiles and other undesirables to make up the draft. Another says that there are plenty of ‘ethnic minorities’ that should be drafted first. Then they start calling each other names. Many Russians really aren’t like us. The fact that this show is immensely popular is a sad indictment of modern Russian culture. A while ago they were calling for nukes to be dropped all over Europe to teach them a lesson. Now they are calling each other cowards on national TV. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8695 "2022-09-28T17:15:42Z")
I find it hard to believe this is not some kind of send-up. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8696 "2022-09-28T17:18:15Z")
This was a parody - the translations are not correct. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8697 "2022-09-28T17:20:21Z")
If so, sorry about that. I don’t speak Russian. What are they actually saying? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8698 "2022-09-28T17:21:26Z")
I don’t either – I saw on twitter. I’ll hunt down a link. It’s very funny but too outlandish to be real. EDIT: Look at the Tweeter’s page: [https://twitter.com/R82938886](https://twitter.com/R82938886) Slogan is “Not real, but real enough”. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8699 "2022-09-28T17:23:17Z")
Always read the blurb beneath a Twitter user’s handle: “Not real, but real enough” ---
**Author:** ![duality72](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duality72/32/3910_2.png) [@duality72](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duality72)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8700 "2022-09-28T17:29:22Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > But it’s even better - _she’s not even looking at the ballots as she “counts”._ That’s quite a piece of Da-Da performance art. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8701 "2022-09-28T17:38:12Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Many Russians really aren’t like us. The fact that this show is immensely popular is a sad indictment of modern Russian culture. Ahem. Fox News. And I think one purpose of this parody/false news piece is to make us think “Many Russians really aren’t like us” Congratulations for being conned. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8702 "2022-09-28T18:20:46Z")
> ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8703 "2022-09-28T18:30:39Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > This is is an amazing spectacle If you want to see clips of Solovyov’s show with correct subtitles, you want to follow Julia Davis on Twitter. The real thing is only very slightly less ridiculous than that parody. I think this is the same clip. The hosts are in full ‘The Tzar’s orders are perfect; the Boyars are to blame for how they carry them out’ mode: > > > Julia Davis @JuliaDavisNews ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8704 "2022-09-28T18:33:39Z")
18 more HIMARS to deliver missiles is desirable from Ukraine’s perspective. My concern, though, with doubling the number of HIMARS would be they’ll burn through missiles twice as fast. As we know, the number of missiles is finite and ultimately production won’t keep pace with their use. [Are There Enough Guided Rockets For HIMARS To Keep Up With Ukraine War Demand? (thedrive.com)](https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/are-there-enough-guided-rockets-for-himars-to-keep-up-with-ukraine-war-demand) I had heard there were plans to ramp up production of the rockets, but I’m not sure what the timeline or status for that is. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8705 "2022-09-28T18:39:16Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > If you want to see clips of Solovyov’s show with correct subtitles, you want to follow Julia Davis on Twitter. The real thing is only very slightly less ridiculous than that parody. I’ve been watching that show for weeks, probably from her Twitter. And yes, it’s always a shitshow. Crazy enough that I didn’t catch that this one was a parody. But thanks for the link. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2022, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/8706 "2022-09-28T19:05:15Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Crazy enough that I didn’t catch that this one was a parody. Poe’s Law: it’s not just for social topic extremism any more. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=431) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=433)