# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 1) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [February 24, 2022, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037 "2022-02-24T08:30:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 83
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1641 "2022-03-08T20:00:47Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Have you ever seen a painter with his shirt off while he paints? Sure! His name was Pablo Picasso. šŸ˜‰ [![](https://ridiculouslyinteresting.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/shirtless-picasso-13.jpg?w=315&h=215) ](https://ridiculouslyinteresting.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/shirtless-picasso-13.jpg?w=315&h=215) [![](https://i.huffpost.com/gen/2811120/thumbs/o-PABLO-PICASSO-570.jpg) ](https://i.huffpost.com/gen/2811120/thumbs/o-PABLO-PICASSO-570.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1642 "2022-03-08T20:01:01Z")
I believe Poland is giving them to the US so that they can say that itā€™s the US, not Poland, that is providing jets to Ukrainian fighters. Kind of silly, since everyone knows where these jets will be going, but itā€™s probably the kind of public maneuvering that Polish politicians say they need right now. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1643 "2022-03-08T20:01:05Z")
> [@Morgyn](#): > > Their practically brand-new, secure cryptophone system, guaranteed to work under all conditions, requires 3G/4G to communicate. Which isnā€™t available where they are operating because theyā€™ve destroyed the cell phone towers. so far nobody had been able to answer how they would access the Ukr. cellphone networks ā€¦ would they hack into the systems (doubtful) ā€¦ or would they just hit the next mall and buy 800 SIMS from T-Mobile ā€¦ or would the russian embassy corner the SIM market weeks before an invation (nudge-nudge) **SERIOUS Question: anybody any idea how that whole setup is supposed to work (had it worked) in foreign countries???** ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1644 "2022-03-08T20:02:59Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > And why a US base in Germany and not directly from Poland? It gives Poland cover so Russia canā€™t claim Poland is acting unilaterally in itā€™s ā€œattackā€ on Russia. Thatā€™s also why Poland wants other countries with Russian craft to follow suit. The US also probably wants to scrub the planes of any NATO tech they donā€™t want the Russians to get their hands on. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1645 "2022-03-08T20:06:10Z")
> [@Al128](#): > > SERIOUS Question: anybody any idea how that whole setup is supposed to work (had it worked) in foreign countries??? Unserious answer: All I know is that those roaming charges have the potential to cripple the Russian budget worse than all the sanctions put together. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1646 "2022-03-08T20:16:01Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > ETA: As per Little Nemoā€™s post, Crimea would be the one flat-out annexation. Makes sense. This, the Russian people might see as the most tangible prize. We could even call this thing something like the ā€œCrimean War.ā€ Crimean War II, non-elected bugaboo? ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1647 "2022-03-08T20:32:45Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > Unserious answer: All I know is that those roaming charges have the potential to cripple the Russian budget worse than all the sanctions put together. dont be silly ā€¦ What are Ukrainians going to do? ā€¦ impound russian tanks over this? ---
**Author:** ![Chez\_Guevara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/aeb1de/32.png) [@Chez\_Guevara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chez_Guevara)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1648 "2022-03-08T21:02:30Z")
VP allegedly painted ā€˜Pattern on Frosty Windowā€™ back in 2009 for a charitable auction. It fetched Ā£750,000 ($982,000). ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1649 "2022-03-08T21:05:55Z")
TIME Person of the Year: the Ukraine tractor farmer guy? > ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1650 "2022-03-08T21:08:38Z")
One would think a tracked AFV wouldnā€™t roll so easily. OTOH it _is_ moving backwards and visibility for a tank driver would be nil. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1651 "2022-03-08T21:16:12Z")
From the Guardian Live Blogā€¦ McDonaldā€™s,Coke, PepsiCo, and Starbucks are temporarily closing in Russia. This should get the publicā€™s attention. State media canā€™t hide this from them. This is mostly a PR win in a state that controls the media. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1652 "2022-03-08T21:16:36Z")
Hereā€™s a list of documented Russian equipment losses: > **[Attack On Europe: Documenting Russian Equipment Losses During The 2022...](https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html)** > > By Stijn MitzerĀ  andĀ  Jakub Janovsky Ā  in collaboration withĀ  Joost Oliemans,Ā  Kemal ,Ā  Dan ,Ā andĀ  naalsio26 Ā  Ā  This list only includes de... It doesnā€™t say how many of the captured vehicles were taken by the Ukraine tractor guy, but, with the quantity of such videos, itā€™s probably a significant portion. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1653 "2022-03-08T21:23:11Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > From the Guardian Live Blogā€¦ > McDonalds,Coke, PepsiCo, and Starbucks are temporarily closing in Russia. Excellent news. Every single company in the west should follow suit. We ALL have to be in this. I think the public campaign got Coke and Pepsi on board. ANY company that is doing business in Russia now needs to be identified and publicly shamed into joining the civilized world. If the only thing they will listen to is profit, profit, profit, then the public should take steps to make them see where their profit comes from. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1654 "2022-03-08T21:24:44Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > Is it just me that only sees that one sentence statement no matter where I look? And why a US base in Germany and not directly from Poland? Because Poland, which borders Russia, can honestly say they gave no fighter jets to Ukraine. Rather, they are simply exchanging their old MiG-29s for some newer F-16s. Theyā€™re just upgrading their air force and standardizing on a single fighter jet to go along with their existing fleet of F-16s. And for a bargain price? Why, who could turn down such a deal? Itā€™s just good business. The Polish government is looking out for the taxpayer. If the USA were to then give their newly acquired MiG-29s to Ukraine, well, Poland canā€™t control that, can they? Those are the USAā€™s property. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1655 "2022-03-08T21:31:06Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > If the USA were to then give their newly acquired MiG-29s to Ukraine, well, Poland canā€™t control that, can they? Those are the USAā€™s property. We think they might have just fallen off the back of a truck that happened to be driving through Ukraine. What can you do?? ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1656 "2022-03-08T21:31:09Z")
. . [**top this!!!**](https://i.postimg.cc/B6QrsB0f/image.png) ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1657 "2022-03-08T21:35:05Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > From the Guardian Live Blogā€¦ > McDonalds,Coke, PepsiCo, and Starbucks are temporarily closing in Russia. some are gaming the system: UNILEVER no more exports and imports to russia ā€¦ (thats weasel-BS for: **ā€œWe will still sell our stuff that we produce in russia, there - hence making a profitā€** ) ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1658 "2022-03-08T21:54:39Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Sure! His name was Pablo Picasso. šŸ˜‰ Aww man, nobody needed to see that! > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I believe Poland is giving them to the US so that they can say that itā€™s the US, not Poland, that is providing jets to Ukrainian fighters. Kind of silly, since everyone knows where these jets will be going, but itā€™s probably the kind of public maneuvering that Polish politicians say they need right now. Iā€™m sure itā€™s something like that, and I donā€™t blame Poland for not wanting to bear the brunt of Putinā€™s anger. Cynical me wonders if part of it was getting Germany to put a little skin into the game, rather than looking like just a US/Poland thing. > [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > The US also probably wants to scrub the planes of any NATO tech they donā€™t want the Russians to get their hands on. Not sure how much tech is involved in old Russian aircraft or what Poland used these particular planes for. Knowledge of any particular type of fast movers are beyond my guessing powers. I do know that some Russian aircraft were/are less reliant on electronics and used more hydraulics. > [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > Hereā€™s a list of documented Russian equipment losses: > > [Attack On Europe: Documenting Russian Equipment Losses During The Russian Invasion Of Ukraine - Oryx](https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html) I hope those numbers are correct, but I always notch down reported numbers during a hot war. The old fog of war thing: things get double counted, things thought destroyed are not, blurry videos and amateur commentary are counted as fact. Iā€™m not sure that even the Russians know what their losses are accurately. > [@RickJay](#): > > If the USA were to then give their newly acquired MiG-29s to Ukraine, well, Poland canā€™t control that, can they? Those are the USAā€™s property. Except that really fools nobody, certainly not Putin. I still think itā€™s a way to put the US at the forefront of the conflict, otherwise any NATO country could have ā€œlost the locationā€ of the MiGs. > **[US dismisses Polish plan to provide fighter jets to be sent to Ukraine](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/08/poland-mig-29-jets-us-ukraine)** > > Pentagon says plan for Poles to give Soviet-era jets to US ā€˜not tenableā€™ as Ukraine cities await promised Russian ceasefire > Poland is thought to have 28 of the Soviet-era warplanes, and has been in negotiation with the Biden administration on a three-way deal to supply Ukraine with air power, on condition that the MiGs would be replaced by newer US jets. > > _The deal has the effect of sharing the risk of Russian retaliation with the US, which will decide how and when to hand them to the Ukrainian air force._ And apparently Iā€™m wrong, the article doesnā€™t mention Germany in reprisals at all. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1659 "2022-03-08T21:56:04Z")
Has anyone found any articles about Ukraine pilots? Their training and experience? I know a famous Ukrainian acrobatic pilot died early in the war. I wish he had been used training pilots. Finding a secure airstrip is going to be a big concern. Bombed out planes arenā€™t very useful. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2022, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037/1660 "2022-03-08T22:00:40Z")
> [@mordecaiB](#): > > I hope those numbers are correct, but I always notch down reported numbers during a hot war. That link actually has photos or videos for each item in the list. Itā€™s possible thereā€™s some double-counting, but the photos generally seem pretty clear and have details that distinguish them from each other. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=82) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-1/960037.md?page=84)