# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [October 29, 2022, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972 "2022-10-29T17:49:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 153
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2023, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3095 "2023-03-20T23:32:15Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > One does wonder how so many potential draftees were able to leave Russia. living in a culture that has been completely impregnated with corruption for the better part of 100 years, does that to you … if you have enough money, the rules apply to the others, but not to you … (just remember that Russia-1 - channel newhost/a$$hole, whose 20 year old son is still living the high-life in London instead of stumbling over his own indestines in some trench near Bakhmut). ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3096 "2023-03-21T02:22:42Z")
Latest US drawdown (from existing US stocks determined to be in excess of needs). - Ammunition for High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems (HIMARS); Type not spec’d. - 155mm artillery rounds; no type mentioned - 25mm ammunition; Bradley IFV, most likely HEI - High-speed Anti-radiation missiles (HARMs); - 81mm and 60mm mortar systems and mortar rounds; HE mostly - AT-4 anti-armor weapon systems; - Grenade launchers, small arms, and associated ammunition; - Demolition munitions and equipment for obstacle clearing; - Mine clearing equipment; - Heavy fuel tankers; - Thermal imagery systems, optics, and laser rangefinders; - Riverine patrol boats; - Testing and diagnostic equipment to support vehicle maintenance and repair; - Spare parts and other field equipment. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 10:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3097 "2023-03-21T10:03:30Z")
Ukraine claims to have destroyed a shipment of Russian Kalibr cruise missiles at a train station in Crimea. > The Ukraine defence ministry’s main intelligence directorate said on Monday: “An explosion in Dzhankoi city in the north of temporarily occupied Crimea destroyed Russian Kalibr-KN cruise missiles as they were being transported by rail.” > **[Russian missiles destroyed in Crimea blast, Ukraine says](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/mar/21/russian-cruise-missiles-destroyed-in-crimea-blast-ukraine-says)** > > Kyiv claims cruise missiles hit in city of Dzhankoi, in attack Russian-installed official blames on drone ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3098 "2023-03-21T11:26:34Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > temporarily occupied Crimea “temporarily occupied Crimea” is a good phrase to sneak in there. Have they always called it that? ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3099 "2023-03-21T13:43:14Z")
I’m pretty sure that’s always been Ukraine’s position. Anything less would be conceding Crimea to the Russians. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3100 "2023-03-21T13:45:27Z")
No, they used to just call it Ukraine. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3101 "2023-03-21T13:48:50Z")
These are probably Gulf War era tanks? The Guardian > [@](#): > > **The US is spending up its delivery of Abrams battle tanks to [Ukraine](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ukraine) by sending a refurbished older model that can be ready faster, according to US officials.** > > The original plan was to send 31 of the newer M1A2 Abrams tanks, which could have taken a year or two to build and ship. A decision has been taken to send the older M1A1 version, which can be taken from army stocks and will be easier for Ukrainian forces to learn to use and maintain, sources told Associated Press. > > The aim is to get the 70-tonne tanks to the frontline in eight to 10 months, they said. The plan will be announced by the Pentagon soon, AP reports ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3102 "2023-03-21T13:52:20Z")
Russian ultranationalist Igor Girkin compares Bakhmut to Stalingrad: > ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3103 "2023-03-21T13:55:08Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > These are probably Gulf War era tanks? Yes, they are. > **[History of the M1 Abrams | Persian Gulf War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_M1_Abrams#Persian_Gulf_War)** > > As the Abrams entered service in the 1980s, they would operate alongside M60A3 within the United States military, and with other NATO tanks in numerous Cold War exercises. These exercises usually took place in Western Europe, especially West Germany, but also in some other countries like South Korea. During such training, Abrams crews honed their skills for use against the men and equipment of the Soviet Union. However, by 1991 the Soviet state had collapsed and the Abrams would have its trial by... They probably don’t outclass the upgraded T-72s and -90s the Russians fielded early on, but they probably stand up well to the Cold-War era gear being thrown into the fight now. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3104 "2023-03-21T14:00:16Z")
The Jerusalem Post has some additional context to the good news of Russia losing a shipment of Kalibr missiles: they’re down to 7% of their original Black Sea fleet ammo levels of Kalibr missiles and other long-range precision weapons, and Ukraine judges that Russia’s naval strike capability is no longer militarily significant. They can save up for increasingly infrequent terror raids but can’t pull together a strike which can affect theater operations. > **[As Russian warship ammo destroyed, Ukraine says missile strategy failed](https://www.jpost.com/international/article-734978)** > > Throughout the Russia-Ukraine War, the Black Sea Fleet has fired Kalibrs against Ukrainian targets. As the war progressed, maritime attacks have become less frequent. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3105 "2023-03-21T14:07:31Z")
> [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > Russian ultranationalist Igor Girkin compares Bakhmut to Stalingrad: …and he seems to understand that the Russians are the Germans this time. Someone needs to send him the link to the “[Are we the baddies?](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hn1VxaMEjRU)” sketch. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3106 "2023-03-21T14:25:04Z")
[China and Japan visit opposite sides of the war.](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-65015400) I wonder how snuggly Putin and Xi are behind the scenes? I’m sure Russia needs China much more than vice versa. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3107 "2023-03-21T16:41:20Z")
I 'm pretty sure there are trade negotiations underway between Russia and China with some **VERY** favorable terms for China. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3108 "2023-03-21T17:32:23Z")
My concern is that trade in return will include, if not weapons themselves, then the components necessary for Russians to produce them. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3109 "2023-03-21T17:56:38Z")
Apparently the Chinese supplied body armor rifle cartridges without our knowing about it. I wonder if they could supply weapons without the West knowing. ---
**Author:** ![mordecaiB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mordecaib/32/7725_2.png) [@mordecaiB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mordecaiB)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2023, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3110 "2023-03-21T18:40:32Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > Ukraine claims to have destroyed a shipment of Russian Kalibr cruise missiles at a train station in Crimea. I hope this one is true. That would be one hell of a drone strike. > [@gnoitall](#): > > They probably don’t outclass the upgraded T-72s and -90s the Russians fielded early on, but they probably stand up well to the Cold-War era gear being thrown into the fight now. I think they would have outclassed the T-90s also. I really don’t think Russia can field anything that can shoot on the run like the Abrams. Add night time optics and modern tactics and Russia would be in for a big surprise. > [@Cardigan](#): > > My concern is that trade in return will include, if not weapons themselves, then the components necessary for Russians to produce them. Also, China may be the only country that can produce enough of things like artillery shells to make a difference. > [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > I wonder how snuggly Putin and Xi are behind the scenes? Probably not watching _[Winnie the Pooh: Blood and Honey](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt19623240/)_. China apparently banned the movie because protesters are using Pooh as a lookalike for Xi. You just can’t make stuff up anymore, life is already too weird. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2023, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3111 "2023-03-22T13:02:02Z")
Russian T-54/55 tanks headed for Ukraine? The T-54/55 series was designed between 1947–1958, with the earliest model tanks entering service in 1948. > > ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2023, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3112 "2023-03-22T13:31:33Z")
I’m sure the timing is coincidental, and the T-54/55 tanks were going to head to Ukraine anyway … but the optimist in me wants to believe Putin was counting on Xi to offer substantial military assistance during their meeting, and Xi declined. Once Putin realized he wasn’t going to get what he wanted, THEN the tanks were ordered out of mothballs. I know, it’s farfetched, but I like it regardless. But any way you slice it, this shows just how desperate Russia is getting for some supplies of war materiel. Plus, it probably indicates a level of concern for the amount of damage Ukraine can do with the tanks they’re receiving / will receive. Russia is gonna throw the kitchen sink at them in an effort to blunt the offensive, whenever it happens. I don’t think these T-54s will do much in that regard, but Russia is probably praying for ANY tactical help at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2023, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3113 "2023-03-22T13:37:25Z")
If it’s Stalingrad, then prepare operation Uranus! ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2023, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3114 "2023-03-22T14:45:22Z")
The Russians should just cut to the chase, and paint large bullseye targets on these T-54/55 's [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=152) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=154)