# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [October 29, 2022, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972 "2022-10-29T17:49:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 194
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3949 "2023-05-13T03:46:29Z")
> [@gnoitall](#): > > Timing doesn’t feel right, unless the announcements were actually significantly after delivery. If I was in charge (thank god I’m not), _all_ announcements would be significantly after delivery. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3950 "2023-05-13T05:31:01Z")
Apparently [Wagner is now firing on Russian troops](https://twitter.com/michaeldweiss/status/1657179151990677505?s=20) in Bakhmut, according to Prigozhin, to stop them from retreating. Putin is fighting a two-front war. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3951 "2023-05-13T10:17:57Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > The deployment in Ukraine is a serious test of the Patriot system. So far it’s performing well. > > Link [https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/12/politics/russia-patriot-missiles-ukraine/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/12/politics/russia-patriot-missiles-ukraine/index.html) Better than “well”. Worth noting that the Russian missile in question was a scarce hypersonic type that the Russians don’t have many of and that is hard to intercept. The Patriot system and the Ukrainian operators performed admirably! Meanwhile, somewhere in Russia, some military commander might be falling out a window soon. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3952 "2023-05-13T10:33:32Z")
On a slight hijack, where do most of you get your war news? I generally look at BBC. or Alajazzera. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 10:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3953 "2023-05-13T10:39:14Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Better than “well”. Worth noting that the Russian missile in question was a scarce hypersonic type that the Russians don’t have many of and that is hard to intercept. The Patriot system and the Ukrainian operators performed admirably! Meanwhile, somewhere in Russia, some military commander might be falling out a window soon. The Kyiv Independent has reported (without evidence) that target of the hypersonic missile was the Patriot system itself. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3954 "2023-05-13T10:46:22Z")
> [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](#): > > The Kyiv Independent has reported (without evidence) that target of the hypersonic missile was the Patriot system itself.   The CNN article quotes two US military officials, including the Pentagon press secretary, as saying the same thing. The Patriot system emits radar signals that make its location susceptible to detection. The same article also quotes Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov as saying that the Patriot systems would “definitely” be targets. There is physical evidence that the downed missile was a scarce Kinzhal hypersonic type, which would only be used against high-value targets. It seems a good bet that what the _Kyiv Independent_ reported is accurate. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3955 "2023-05-13T11:37:47Z")
I wonder if the “hypersonic” missile really is that. We’ve seen the incredible grift within the Russian military – maybe that even extends to the weapons developers. If it’s really just a slightly faster missile, but they tell Putin it’s hypersonic, who is going to dispute it? ---
**Author:** ![Mikkel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikkel/32/13151_2.png) [@Mikkel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mikkel)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3956 "2023-05-13T12:06:20Z")
What I wonder is, would it be easier to shoot a missile down when sitting on its target? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3957 "2023-05-13T12:58:34Z")
Do you mean due to the technical capabilities of the weapon system itself, or due to the psychological effect on the operators? Technically, it’s probably easier, because something heading straight towards you won’t have much change in its angular position. In principle, you could take a zigzagging path to the target, but maneuverability is pretty limited at hypersonic speed. ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3958 "2023-05-13T13:16:01Z")
You do know that we track them and have shot them down, right? That means we know how fast they actually go. If they didn’t go as fast as Russia claimed we’d be all about laughing at them ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3959 "2023-05-13T13:28:07Z")
Maybe. Or maybe we don’t want the Russians to know that we know. Further, maybe it’s hypersonic under test conditions, but not on the battlefield. My point is that Russian tech has been demonstrated to be quite a lot less effective than advertised. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3960 "2023-05-13T14:31:18Z")
New German aid package to be announced tomorrow - some elements here: 4 more IRIS-T SLM, Anti-air systems 20 more Marder IFVs 30 more Leo1, first generation Leopard tanks, not much armor but still competent on the battlefield. 18 RCH 155 Haubitze, remote controlled 155mm self propelled howitzer. Rapid fire. More Gepard AA , anti-air 30mm cannons, radar controlled, great performance so far. 100 armored vehicles APCs 100 support vehicles Surveillance drones A lot of shells ---
**Author:** ![Mikkel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikkel/32/13151_2.png) [@Mikkel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mikkel)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3961 "2023-05-13T14:33:25Z")
I ment technically. I guess it will help your motivation too. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3962 "2023-05-13T14:40:59Z")
The Killjoy isn’t really a hypersonic missile. That term is generally used for missiles that can maneuver at hypersonic speeds. The Killjoy gets up to hypersonic speeds during the boost, but slows greatly and doesn’t maneuver at those speeds. There’s a big difference between “missile that gets to hypersonic speeds” and hypersonic glide vehicles/hypersonic cruise missiles. Current reporting doesn’t do a great job at distinguishing. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3963 "2023-05-13T15:17:17Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > More Gepard AA , anti-air 30mm cannons, radar controlled, great performance so far. 35mm cannons. edit **Updated** German contribution list thru April 2023. Interesting to note there were 100 PATRIOT missiles included with the joint German/Dutch system. > **[Fact Sheet On German Military Aid To Ukraine](https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/09/fact-sheet-on-german-military-aid-to.html)** > > By Jakub Janovsky , naalsio26 ,  Aloha , Dan and Kemal   Contrary to popular perception, Germany has delivered significant amounts of arms... ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3964 "2023-05-13T16:12:39Z")
Bad day for Russian pilots flying over Russia: > ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3965 "2023-05-13T16:40:31Z")
Heck, it’s unclear who shot them down! ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3966 "2023-05-13T16:57:51Z")
Not all good news for Ukraine today: > New footage of the colossal detonation of an ammunition depot in Khmelnitsky, Ukraine, early this morning. [pic.twitter.com/b49ItSWPQ5](https://t.co/b49ItSWPQ5) > > — Clash Report (@clashreport) [May 13, 2023](https://twitter.com/clashreport/status/1657410504254451718?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) ---
**Author:** ![SunUp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SunUp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SunUp)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3967 "2023-05-13T17:42:24Z")
This is about a battalion-sized slice of a mechanized infantry division (except that it’d be nice to have more Marders rather than APCs). Along with what’s been pledged already, if Ukraine manages to get these into the line in a hurry, they should have over a regiment of well-equipped troops to spearhead an offensive this summer. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2023, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/3968 "2023-05-13T19:20:51Z")
Russian source Izvestia has published photos of alleged Storm Shadow debris from Luhansk. I am not sufficiently knowledgeable to comment on whether the debris is actually Storm Shadow, and as the old joke goes there’s no pravda in Izvestia and no izvestia in Pravda. > [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=193) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=195)