# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [October 29, 2022, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972 "2022-10-29T17:49:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 254
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5165 "2023-07-17T17:45:33Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > He’s just lying Goes without saying, really. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5166 "2023-07-17T17:46:06Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > It really doesn’t make sense that this would have been charges placed by a human, because a human placing charges would have prioritized the rail bridge, not the automobile bridge. It pretty much had to have been some sort of not-quite-smart-enough long-range weapon. Missile strikes on the bridge at Kherson did not destroy the bridge spans, only punching holes in the bridge surface, making it impassable to vehicles. You’re right that the railway bridge might be a better target from a logistics point of view, which might make manually-placed demolition charges or maritime drone seem less likely. That might therefore suggest vehicle bomb. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5167 "2023-07-17T17:53:53Z")
The seagoing drones are the most logical weapon. Lower spans were targeted because of the limited explosive power. Reaching the upper/higher rail spans wasn’t practical. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5168 "2023-07-17T18:06:26Z")
For the site of last year’s explosion, height would be an issue: [![](https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/69ac1dd46198c35c70f2be3173a23094) ](https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/69ac1dd46198c35c70f2be3173a23094) However, at the location of the recent explosion, there does not appear to be a height difference: [![](https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/a6d55eee392485dd61fb1b930c9c615a) ](https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/a6d55eee392485dd61fb1b930c9c615a) ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5169 "2023-07-17T18:08:50Z")
Ukraine have said they did it with maritime drones: > [@](#): > > The Kerch Bridge was struck by “naval drones,” the Ukrainian Minister of Digital Transformation Mykhailo Fedorov said on Telegram on Monday. > > “Today the Crimean bridge was blown up by naval drones,” Fedorov said. > **[July 17, 2023 - Russia-Ukraine news](https://edition.cnn.com/europe/live-news/russia-ukraine-war-news-07-17-23#h_95356e7ba1a55800d1c3150dbbb15f28)** > > Russia said traffic has resumed in one lane of the Kerch Bridge, which links the annexed Crimea Peninsula to the Russian mainland, after Ukraine claimed responsibility for an attack Monday. President Vladimir Putin called the incident a "terrorist... ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5170 "2023-07-17T18:17:20Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > [https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1680986951481012224](https://twitter.com/NOELreports/status/1680986951481012224) whats up with his right hand? … sits there like a piece of ham … > [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](#): > > However, at the location of the recent explosion, there does not appear to be a height difference: I think that depends on what section of the bridge you are … ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5171 "2023-07-17T18:24:17Z")
> [@Al128](#): > > I think that depends on what section of the bridge you are … Both sections of the bridge are much higher over the maritime navigation channel between Tuzla Island and Crimea. The traffic portion climbs to the additional height quite steeply, while the railway of course climbs much more slowly over a longer distance. This results in the rail bridge being significantly higher than the traffic bridge in some places. This strike occurred between Tuzla and the Russian mainland, where both bridges are much less elevated since they need not accommodate maritime traffic. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5172 "2023-07-17T18:34:09Z")
Could be related: > ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5173 "2023-07-17T19:03:28Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > Meanwhile Putin has declared it a terrorist attack with no logic from a military point of view. Yeah right, Vlad: [![](https://images.unian.net/photos/2018_12/1544298719-6501.png?0.5854844429325392) ](https://images.unian.net/photos/2018_12/1544298719-6501.png?0.5854844429325392) [![](https://img.pravda.com/images/doc/a/d/add4710-opera--------2023-03-27-212406-gur.gov.ua.png) ](https://img.pravda.com/images/doc/a/d/add4710-opera--------2023-03-27-212406-gur.gov.ua.png) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2023, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5174 "2023-07-17T23:13:40Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > Meanwhile Putin has declared it a terrorist attack with no logic from a military point of view. Putin feels that better military targets are Ukraine schools and hospitals. The sooner this madman is defenestrated the better. ---
**Author:** ![Digger11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/838e76/32.png) [@Digger11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Digger11)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5175 "2023-07-18T04:56:00Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > It really doesn’t make sense that this would have been charges placed by a human, because a human placing charges would have prioritized the rail bridge, not the automobile bridge. It pretty much had to have been some sort of not-quite-smart-enough long-range weapon. In what world do all military decision makers have perfect judgment regarding strategic targets? ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5176 "2023-07-18T13:43:56Z")
I’m thankful the US and NATO got this wake up call now. There was far too much complacency there wouldn’t be another prolonged war. [https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/18/politics/ukraine-critical-ammo-shortage-us-nato-grapple/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2023/07/18/politics/ukraine-critical-ammo-shortage-us-nato-grapple/index.html) > [@](#): > > Army spokesperson Ellen Lovett told CNN last week that “the Army’s production ramp up of 155mm artillery ammunition continues as planned. We have already nearly doubled monthly production and contracts are in place to rapidly increase production over the next year and a half.” > > Lovett added that the Army’s plans to significantly increase production of other key systems going to Ukraine, including GMLRS, Javelin anti-tank and Stinger anti-aircraft missiles, “are also on contract and underway.” > > The initiative has underscored to US officials just how long it takes to significantly ramp up production, including the expansion of existing plants and the building of new ones, and how the US should have taken meaningful action in this space far earlier to prevent ammunition stockpiles from dwindling to dangerously low levels. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5177 "2023-07-18T14:49:37Z")
The ISW report on the damage to the bridge: Summary: No damage to railway. Minor damage to the roadway. This is affecting primarily the civilian tourists rushing to leave Crimea, and causing large traffic jams in both routes of supply (the bridge over the strait, and the “land bridge” through the conquered areas).So this also slows military vehicles , and temporarily hinders the Russian army’s logistics. My question is -What is the role of Crimean vacations in Russian society? Are the vacationers there just doing a typical family trip to a sea shore, like Americans going to Disneyland? Or is it a cultural and political thing that Putin encourages, to show Russian ownership of Crimea ? And will Putin continue to encourage civilians to travel there, to keep his political propaganda machine going, even if it interferes with his own military needs? > **[Institute for the Study of War](https://www.understandingwar.org/backgrounder/russian-offensive-campaign-assessment-july-17-2023)** > > The July 17 attack on the Kerch Strait Bridge will likely have continuing ramifications on Russian logistics in southern Ukraine. Russian authorities accused Ukrainian special services of conducting an unmanned surface vehicle strike against the... ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5178 "2023-07-18T17:24:06Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > My question is -What is the role of Crimean vacations in Russian society? Are the vacationers there just doing a typical family trip to a sea shore, like Americans going to Disneyland? Yep. The Black Sea has for a long time been the southern summer beach destination for Russia. Odessa in particular was famous for its summer tourism. But Crimea in general was a major destination as well. Here’s a [2014 BBC article](https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-28688478) talking about how in the aftermath of the Russian takeover the tension and sanctions was tanking traditional tourism, even though nationalist Russians were deliberately vacationing there as a show of support. Russia has definitely been pushing tourism in Crimea since then, Odessa being a poor choice these days for Russians. But even subsidized tourism becomes problematic in war zones. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5179 "2023-07-18T17:54:01Z")
This morning I was half paying attention to a news clip on YouTube from yesterday, that in passing mentioned that the bridge appeared to have been attacked from the north. Ukraine, of course, has no current access to the Sea of Azov. I’m trying to read up on the attack now, but am not finding the claim I heard reported this morning repeated on other media sources. Since I didn’t catch the source, I’m going to conclude it was probably Ukrainian misinformation. Has anyone else heard or read anything about the direction of attack? ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5180 "2023-07-18T18:28:38Z")
> [@Cardigan](#): > > Has anyone else heard or read anything about the direction of attack? Well, @Walken_After_Midnight’s linked Tweet speculates that a group of small fast-moving boats SE of Snake Island may be related to the attack. > [@Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2)](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5172): > > Could be related: If there is a connection, that would imply that the Ukrainian USVs rounded the coast of Crimea and artacked the bridge from the south. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5181 "2023-07-18T21:11:56Z")
Wait, people are going to Crimea for vacations right now? I mean, I know that the peninsula isn’t exactly on the front lines, but it’s still very much a part of the war zone. Surely, the Russian state media can’t delude them into thinking the war is going that well. ---
**Author:** ![Sauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce7236/32.png) [@Sauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sauron)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2023, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5182 "2023-07-18T21:55:33Z")
**Chronos** : I dunno where the “tourist areas” of the Crimean coast are, but assuming they’re on the southern end of the peninsula, they’re roughly 150 miles from the front. So maybe to the average Russian it’s worth the relatively small risk. Unless, of course, the Kerch Strait Bridge is taken out of commission; then they’re screwed. I seem to recall photos of tourists on a beach looking at the plumes of smoke from an attack on the Saky airbase in Crimea last August. That area is on the western coast of Crimea, significantly closer to the front lines as they exist now (maybe 80-90 miles as the crow flies). But I’m with you … if I’m a Russian, I don’t care how badly I want a beach vacation in 2023. I ain’t heading to Crimea. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5183 "2023-07-19T00:20:54Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Surely, the Russian state media can’t delude them into thinking the war is going that well. “War? what war, gospodin? Haven’t you been watching the news on tv? There is no war on. There is a special denazification operation going on in some parts of so-called Ukraine, but the Crimea is in Russia.” ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2023, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/5184 "2023-07-19T00:44:08Z")
Bulgarian 155mm NATO standard HE shells?? Why yes, probably, with a small fig leaf of deniability. > **[US paying contractor to quietly supply Bulgarian 155mm shells to Ukraine](https://www.defenseone.com/threats/2023/07/us-paying-contractor-quietly-supply-bulgarian-155mm-shells-ukraine/388480/)** > > A $402 million contract suggests the former Soviet-bloc country is now producing NATO-standard artillery rounds. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=253) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=255)