# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [October 29, 2022, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972 "2022-10-29T17:49:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 300
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2023, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6092 "2023-10-01T22:48:04Z")
The change in Europe’s attitude is refreshing. I remember Chancellor Merkel’s chummy relationship with Putin. Europe was becoming dependent on Russian natural gas. It’s disturbing the EU didn’t realize the monster that they were dealing with. Link [‘No turning back’: how the Ukraine war has profoundly changed the EU | European Union | The Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/sep/30/ukraine-russia-war-changed-eu) > [@](#): > > Indeed, in the immediate aftermath of the Russian invasion, Josep Borrell, the EU foreign and security chief, argued the EU had grown up, “making more progress in a week toward the objective of being a global security player than it had in the previous decade”. The example of the brave Ukrainian resistance sprang the EU into a newfound sense of purpose. > “Russia’s war had awakened a slumbering giant,” he claimed. Measures that were unthinkable just a few days earlier, such as barring leading Russian banks from the Swift international financial messaging system and freezing the Russian central bank’s assets, were imposed at an unprecedented pace. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2023, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6093 "2023-10-02T02:30:06Z")
Ukrainian tank commander driving a captured Russian T72 tank calls the Russian tank factory to complain about the shitty design. > **[A Ukrainian Officer’s Captured Russian Tank Wasn’t Working. So He Called Tech...](https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2023/10/01/a-ukrainian-officers-captured-russian-tank-wasnt-working-so-he-called-tech-support-in-russia/)** > > When a Ukrainian tanker with the callsign 'Kochevnik' ran into problems with his captured Russian T-72B3, he called Uralvagonzavod tech support in Russia. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2023, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6094 "2023-10-02T05:02:45Z")
The manufacture laughed and hung up when the commander said it was a captured tank and he is Ukrainian. How could the guy not recognize a Ukrainian dialect? Or does Russia have too many Donbas conscripts now? ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2023, 9:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6095 "2023-10-02T09:58:18Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > How could the guy not recognize a Ukrainian dialect? I’m genuinely ignorant in languages. Are the accents very similar or dissimilar? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2023, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6096 "2023-10-02T10:37:05Z")
It’s entirely possible the tank commander grew up speaking both languages and speaks both without a notable accent. Or perhaps he’s a Ukrainian whose first language is Russian and whose family spoke with a Russian accent so that’s the one he has. There are a number of possibilities. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2023, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6097 "2023-10-02T12:49:09Z")
But for humorous _chutzpah_ you just can’t beat it. Ukrainians are definitely winning the personality war overall. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2023, 8:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6098 "2023-10-03T08:51:27Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > > [@aceplace57](#): > > > > How many ways could this go horribly wrong? Targeting British training camps could be considered a attact on NATO. > > The US DoD is actively considering / planning to add US trainers on the ground in Ukraine. And that’s how it begins. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2023, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6099 "2023-10-03T12:00:06Z")
The U.S. says it doesn’t have much money left for Ukraine at the current time, and given the looming government shutdown, it raises questions about how much more will be sent in the future. > **[White House warns only enough Ukraine funding for 'urgent battlefield needs'](https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/white-house-warns-ukraine-funding-urgent-battlefield/story?id=103665808)** > > The White House warned Monday that the U.S. only has enough money to meet Ukraine's "urgent battlefield needs" in the short term. ---
**Author:** ![Toxgoddess](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f08c70/32.png) [@Toxgoddess](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toxgoddess)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2023, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6100 "2023-10-03T18:10:29Z")
Russia’s fleet in the Black Sea is in trouble. [Ukrainians are actively pushing them out of Sevastopol.](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/not-enough-bears-russia-s-black-sea-fleet-is-pulling-out-of-crimea/ar-AA1hDoHG?ocid=hpmsn&cvid=ee724e2a47154e949ad9554cb9a8bee1&ei=91#image=1). If the Ukrainians can pull it off, this is a huge blow to Russian operations in the Crimea. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2023, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6101 "2023-10-03T23:21:18Z")
I’m seeing the dominoes… Once the Black Sea fleet is gone, the Crimean bridge is easy pickings, and the land connection is also already seriously threatened by Ukraine. Once both connections to Russia are gone, Crimea has to return to Ukrainian hands quickly. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2023, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6102 "2023-10-04T16:11:05Z")
This is _incredibly_ upsetting: > **[Machinery from New York-based company used to build Russian weapons used in...](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/machinery-from-new-york-based-company-used-to-build-russian-weapons-used-in-war-on-ukraine)** > > After Russia invaded Ukraine last year, the U.S. and Europe imposed strict sanctions against the Russian government. But as Russian manufacturers work to replace tanks destroyed on the battlefield, they are doing it with the help of a machine part... Not least because the head of the company sounds like a towering piece of racist shit. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2023, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6103 "2023-10-04T19:20:24Z")
I received a national alert test on my phone along with all the TV stations. I wonder if that’s in response to the Russian version. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6104 "2023-10-05T00:41:48Z")
High Five!!! Free ammo courtesy of the Ayatollah. 😄 It’s fitting since they’re supplying drones to Russia. Link [US supplies Ukraine with a million rounds of ammunition seized from Iran | Ukraine | The Guardian](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/oct/05/us-supplies-ukraine-with-ammunition-seized-from-iran) > [@](#): > > The United States has supplied [Ukraine](https://www.theguardian.com/world/ukraine) with more than a million rounds of Iranian ammunition confiscated in the Gulf late last year. > > The transfer of the ordnance followed a civil forfeiture case pursued by the justice department to gain ownership on the grounds that the bullets were seized as they were being smuggled to Yemeni Houthi forces in violation of a UN arms embargo. > > “With this weapons transfer, the justice department’s forfeiture actions against one authoritarian regime are now directly supporting the Ukrainian people’s fight against another authoritarian regime,” the US attorney general, Merrick Garland, said on Wednesday. “We will continue to use every legal authority at our disposal to support Ukraine in their fight for freedom, democracy and the rule of law ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 9:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6105 "2023-10-05T09:50:50Z")
Slovakia has indicated that they’re growing cold to sending Ukraine any more military equipment. I think “war fatigue” is going to start kicking in more and more and I hope Zelenskyy has a good plan for the day the shipments stop arriving. > **[As Russia’s war grinds on, is global support for Ukraine waning?](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/4/is-global-support-for-ukraine-waning)** > > Experts say Kyiv is likely worried as Slovakia votes for a pro-Russia politician, Poland drops aid, and the US wavers. And Russia is building another naval base on the Black Sea. Hopefully it won’t play a factor in the war. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6106 "2023-10-05T11:38:55Z")
Each of these countries, including the US, has to begin thinking about the scenario where Ukraine finishes losing and now these other countries are on the front lines of an emboldened Russia. It will take decades plural of production to replace what has been consumed in not even 2 years of combat. And to the degree the former Warsaw Pact countries have donated originally Soviet or Russian equipment, that will have to be replaced with Western equipment. Leading to greatly increased purchase and operating costs per gizmo, plus all the costs of re-training users and maintainers, developing indigenous repair depots, buying tools, stocking parts, etc. The longer this goes on and the lower the stocks of neighboring countries (and the USA) gets the more they have to decide which future they’re protecting against. It’s easy to _say_ “Better to have Ukraine stop the Russians sooner so we don’t have to on / within our own borders using our own people.” It’s more difficult to say “… And so we will denude ourselves of our own defense capability and bet it all on Ukraine succeeding.” Regardless of any individual country’s public’s willingness to fund Ukraine, or that of the West as a collective, the practical realities of the long, slow pitifully inadequate weapons and munitions manufacturing pipeline in the West is biting some now and will bite far harder in the very foreseeable future. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6107 "2023-10-05T12:46:55Z")
You do realise the Russians are losing equipment and manpower too? [![](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F7pumU2XoAAv-gF?format=png&name=medium) ](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F7pumU2XoAAv-gF?format=png&name=medium) ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6108 "2023-10-05T13:32:29Z")
What’s the +blue numbers? At first I thought “units captured by Ukraine”, but I’m pretty sure they captured more than 12 tanks from Russian forces. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6109 "2023-10-05T13:35:58Z")
It’s the number added to the running total in the last day. Those are the numbers released daily by the Ukrainian MoD, and while they do seem to be an accurate compilation of what the MoD thinks they’ve destroyed (unlike Russian numbers which often appear to be complete fantasy), they are nonetheless official state propaganda and should be viewed with some level of skepticism. ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6110 "2023-10-05T13:43:19Z")
Or the usual exaggerations from over-enthusiastic battle reports. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2023, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6111 "2023-10-05T17:13:20Z")
> **Hijack Hidden** > > > [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](#): > > > > You do realise the Russians are losing equipment and manpower too? > > Yes of course. It is a race to the bottom of the stocks for both sides. The Russians are reconstituting some production capacity on a decently expedited basis so far since teh West is not yet willing to stop the flow of money into Russia. > > The Chinese are manufacturing stuff at a breakneck pace for their own modernization and use, and as best we here in public know little to none of their stocks have been diverted to Russia. Yet. > > NK’s non-trivial arsenal is apparently starting to be tapped too. > > The West is vastly larger & richer as an economic system. The race between the two war production systems, when measured in terms of units, not dollars vs rubles is far far more even. And the West is hobbled by very slow ramp-ups. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=299) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=301)