# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [October 29, 2022, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972 "2022-10-29T17:49:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 333
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6762 "2024-01-23T14:35:14Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Separately, military lasers that work at the frequencies human eyes are sensitive to are already illegal under the various treaties of war. Also, it’s not so hard to create [optical notch filters](https://alluxa.com/optical-filters/ultra-series-optical-filters-and-coatings/notch-filters/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI9IWexd3zgwMV1jbUAR3LVgNcEAAYASAAEgLnc_D_BwE) that will block most of the most common laser frequencies, with minimal impact on the image quality. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6763 "2024-01-23T14:40:57Z")
I hesitated to post this article. It’s unusually negative. But the CNN reporters were on the front lines with Ukrainian troops. The supply shortages for basic artillery are more severe than generally acknowledged. I know the UK and other countries are increasing aid. There’s still shortages with the US cut backs. Meanwhile Russia is getting N Korean supplies. It may get worse as the election draws nearer. [https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/23/europe/ukraine-weapons-avdiivka-russian-assault-intl-cmd/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2024/01/23/europe/ukraine-weapons-avdiivka-russian-assault-intl-cmd/index.html) > [@](#): > > Reliant on the kit they have, not the Western hardware they crave, they know that each lost chance to fire back at Russians may cost Ukrainian lives. > > A few days later, a supply truck chewed through the mud of a field around the nearby town of Marinka, bringing much-needed shells to a gun position. > > But the cannon – a US-supplied M777 howitzer – is silent for much of the day, rationed to around 20 shells a day, 30 on a “good day” the gunners said. Last summer, supporting Ukraine’s failed counteroffensive, the gun crew would fire at least twice as many foreign rounds, many American-made, at the Russians, they said > And in an artillery position 90 minutes north of Avdiivka, around the town of Bakhmut, that CNN visited, the ammunition compartment of a US-supplied Paladin howitzer sat cavernously empty. The crew had no shells to fire at all. > A delivery later in the day brought four shells but nothing that would do the Russians much harm: they were only smoke shells. > > “Every shell that is suitable for the Paladin we use,” the gun commander “Skyba” told CNN, “It’s better than no shells.” > > “10 to 1” is the difference between Russian and Ukrainian artillery supplies, the artillery commander in Ukraine’s 93rd mechanized Brigade told CNN. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6764 "2024-01-23T16:01:31Z")
The CIA has been trying to encourage Russians to send secrets to the US. I hope it works if it shortens the war, but you’d have to be braver than me to take this chance. > **[New CIA video appeals to Russians disillusioned with Moscow elite](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/new-cia-video-appeals-russians-disillusioned-moscow-elite-rcna135179)** > > The video's narrator contemplates his 35th birthday, the legacy of his father, who served as a Russian paratrooper, and whether he has “the courage to stand against this betrayal.” ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6765 "2024-01-23T17:22:02Z")
Russia tries a new tactic against any sort of criticism (never mind spying) > **[Critics of Ukraine war could have property seized under new Russian law](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/jan/22/critics-ukraine-war-could-property-seized-new-russian-law)** > > Draft legislation allowing for confiscation of valuables has been backed by main political parties ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6766 "2024-01-23T17:26:34Z")
I’m sure these brave women who are peacefully protesting will count as critics eventually. > **['Send back our husbands' - Russian women in rare protest](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-68056939)** > > A group of Russian women are making rare public demands for reservists to return from the front line. ---
**Author:** ![Kelevra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/97f17d/32.png) [@Kelevra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kelevra)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6767 "2024-01-23T19:33:48Z")
I see casualty estimates on twitter and they vary a lot probably based on weather conditions (mud) affecting the pace of operations. Apparently things have stepped up a bit with the frozen ground. Ukraine is claiming 22 tanks, 59 AFVs, and 51 artillery destroyed in 1 day! That’s about 4 times what has been reported per day over the previous week. > ---
**Author:** ![DesertDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desertdog/32/11503_2.png) [@DesertDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DesertDog)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6768 "2024-01-23T19:38:28Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Oddly, drone cameras (and especially commercial drone cameras) generally work at the same frequencies eyeballs do, since that’s where the Sun’s illumination is strongest. Yes, some cameras go farther into UV or IR than eyeballs do. Often, so do the lasers. After a Black Rock Ranger was [blinded in 2014](https://journal.burningman.org/2015/03/black-rock-city/tales-from-the-playa/theres-a-black-dot-in-the-middle-of-everything-i-see/) I did some research. Green lasers work by doubling the frequency of an IR laser. Good pointer lasers filter out the IR frequency emitting only the green at safe(ish) levels. Cheap-ass lasers, likely the one she was hit with, don’t bother and the IR component is stronger than the one you can see. As a consequence, the Burning Man organization has banned hand held lasers and vehicle mounted one are inspected that they are above eye level and cannot go below horizontal. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6769 "2024-01-23T19:40:23Z")
Yeah. I think it’s naïve to expect much compliance with that Geneva Convention stuff in the modern world with most forces being irregulars or buying non-military gear and pressing it into battle. One can hope though. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2024, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6770 "2024-01-23T19:44:07Z")
As an aside, in non-military settings (where you’re not trying to deliberately cause damage), non-visible lasers are more dangerous than visible ones. If you can see the light, you’ll quickly blink, which (depending on the laser power) might be enough to prevent damage. But if you can’t see it, you’ll continue to look at the light until it burns your retina. ---
**Author:** ![Al128](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/al128/32/16541_2.png) [@Al128](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Al128)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6771 "2024-01-24T01:18:44Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Yeah. I think it’s naïve to expect much compliance with that Geneva Convention stuff in the modern world with most forces being irregulars or buying non-military gear and pressing it into battle. > > One can hope though. [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/k-_VVsv4eQM/maxresdefault.jpg) ](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/k-_VVsv4eQM/maxresdefault.jpg) [![](https://external-preview.redd.it/k5gMyrKE9pA73gNTHtx1gUv6-9I4k72ymR3ngjt6_S4.png?format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5e66b5cf0ddc98ce9ac8a9de675fcb918db62d86) ](https://external-preview.redd.it/k5gMyrKE9pA73gNTHtx1gUv6-9I4k72ymR3ngjt6_S4.png?format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5e66b5cf0ddc98ce9ac8a9de675fcb918db62d86) screenshot of a police helicopter monitoring social unrest in Santiago, Chile 2019 ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6772 "2024-01-24T04:21:58Z")
Anybody who wants to protest the war in Russia simply needs to agree with Putin. Put up signs that support him even if every last Russian man is killed in the process. Honk the SOS signal if you agree. Make pictures of Putin with wings as the Patron Saint of victory. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6773 "2024-01-24T10:29:46Z")
> **[Russian jet crashes carrying Ukrainian PoWs - Moscow](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-68080529)** > > A Russian transport plane with 65 Ukrainians onboard crashes in a region bordering Ukraine, says Russia. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6774 "2024-01-24T13:13:39Z")
Now Russia is accusing Ukraine of shooting it down. > **[Russia accuses Ukraine of shooting down military plane carrying 65 Ukrainian...](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/russia-military-plane-crash-ukraine-prisoners-of-war-belgorod-rcna135411)** > > The flight was transporting the captured troops to Belgorod ahead of a prisoner exchange at the border, the Kremlin said. Ukraine cautioned against sharing “unverified information.” ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6775 "2024-01-24T13:18:48Z")
Ukrainian sources on twitter claim it had just returned to Russia from Iran and was carrying S-300 missiles, and the POW claim is just Russian disinformation. No idea which is true, but I will say that I wouldn’t have expected Russia to move POWs around on airplanes. ---
**Author:** ![Toxylon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f05b48/32.png) [@Toxylon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Toxylon)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6776 "2024-01-24T15:03:29Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > I wouldn’t have expected Russia to move POWs around on airplanes. This. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6777 "2024-01-24T17:33:41Z")
Why would Russia shoot it down (if they did)? Waste of a good airplane. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6778 "2024-01-24T17:36:25Z")
Probably just crashed because the mechanics sold off a key part on the black market. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6779 "2024-01-24T17:36:28Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Why would Russia shoot it down (if they did)? Waste of a good airplane. “good airplane” Objection! Assumes facts not in evidence! As for why, well, Russia probably wouldn’t be adverse to staging a false flag for propaganda purposes. “Look at those monstrous Ukrainians! They shot down their own people!” ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6780 "2024-01-24T17:55:06Z")
Killing your own POWs is always a risk of war. But you can’t let hostage-taking deter the effective prosecution of war. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6781 "2024-01-24T18:27:17Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > As for why, well, Russia probably wouldn’t be adverse to staging a false flag for propaganda purposes. “Look at those monstrous Ukrainians! They shot down their own people!” Deliberately crashing a transport aircraft would make for a rather expensive false flag operation. The video briefly pans over and shows a smoke cloud that appears to be on the earlier flight path. It’s consistent with a missile hit; it’s also consistent with an engine failure (which in turn would be consistent with Russian maintenance sensibilities), but it would be highly unlikely for an engine failure to bring down a four-engine plane. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=332) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=334)