# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [October 29, 2022, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972 "2022-10-29T17:49:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 334
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6782 "2024-01-24T19:12:40Z")
From most likely to least likely, my guesses on what really happened: 1. Ukrainian missile took down a supply plane that was NOT carrying POWs; Russia claims it had POWs for propaganda purposes 2. Mechanical problems took down a plane that was NOT carrying POWs 3. Mechanical problems took down a plane that WAS carrying POWs for some weird reason 4. Ukrainian missile took down a plane that WAS carrying POWs ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6783 "2024-01-24T20:52:29Z")
1. Russian air defense take out, yet again, one of their own. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6784 "2024-01-24T22:41:57Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > Why would Russia shoot it down (if they did)? Waste of a good airplane. I lost track of all the good Russian planes they shot down. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6785 "2024-01-24T22:52:00Z")
How about the possibility that it was a way for Russia to execute a bunch of POWs, while still trying to reclaim their own? There are certainly some elements within the Russian military who wouldn’t blink at sacrificing a plane, for the sake of killing a bunch of Ukrainians. ---
**Author:** ![Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fiendish_astronaut/32/3295_2.png) [@Fiendish\_Astronaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiendish_Astronaut)\ **Post date:** [January 24, 2024, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6786 "2024-01-24T22:58:36Z")
> **[Russia risked lives in downed plane, Volodymyr Zelensky says](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-68083739)** > > Volodymyr Zelensky accuses Russia after a deadly plane crash claimed the lives of Ukrainian PoWs. > Ukraine’s military intelligence said it had not been told to ensure safe airspace as on previous occasions. > > Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky said later it was “obvious that the Russians are playing with the lives of Ukrainian prisoners, with the feelings of their relatives and with the emotions of our society”. > > Mr Zelensky - who has now cancelled a planned regional trip linked to his birthday on Thursday - stressed in a video address that Ukraine would be insisting on an international investigation. > > The earlier comments by Ukraine’s military intelligence were seen as a tacit acknowledgement that it shot the plane down, although it stressed it had no reliable information about who was on board. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2024, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6787 "2024-01-25T03:13:53Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > 1. Russian air defense take out, yet again, one of their own. I think this is more likely than @TroutMan’s item #4 (Ukrainian missile took down a plane that WAS carrying POWs). ---
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2024, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6788 "2024-01-25T03:43:24Z")
Ukraine’s take on it is that (unlike previous such flights) Russia failed to notify them that it had PoWs on it (presumably deliberately) so UKR shot at it as they would any military plane in a time of war. ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2024, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6789 "2024-01-25T05:09:01Z")
Geolocation and on-ground witnesses say aircraft was departing. POWs (if any) would have been off the plane. Russian list of POW names is highly suspect. At least 26 had been previously released in other exchanges. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2024, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6790 "2024-01-25T05:27:58Z")
My thought was that the POWs, knowing what they were in for when they got to Russia, got loose and crashed the plane themselves. It would be a much better fate than a Russian prison. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2024, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6791 "2024-01-25T11:18:30Z")
> [@smithsb](#): > > Geolocation and on-ground witnesses say aircraft was departing. Departing…from where to where? > [@DWMarch](#): > > My thought was that the POWs, knowing what they were in for when they got to Russia, got loose and crashed the plane themselves. It would be a much better fate than a Russian prison. This doesn’t explain the cloud of smoke in the plane’s flight path well before the crash, seen in **[this video at 0:21](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ylaxRg3f-Y)**. > **[Russia Vectored A 100-Ton Cargo Plane To Belgorod, 20 Miles From Ukraine. So...](https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2024/01/24/russia-vectored-a-100-ton-cargo-plane-to-belgorod-20-miles-from-ukraine-so-of-course-ukraine-shot-it-down/?sh=178f1dde2a47)** > > Why the Russians thought they safely could fly lumbering Ilyushin Il-76 cargo planes into the city of Belgorod—just 20 miles from the border with Ukraine—is a mystery. From the article, addressing Russia’s claims that Ukrainian POWs were onboard: > That might be a lie. A video from the crash site does not depict a lot of bodies. And a list of prisoners the Russians claimed were on the Il-76 [reportedly includes](https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1750174417672397104) names of Ukrainian POWs Russia _already_ exchanged. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2024, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6792 "2024-01-25T23:14:23Z")
An interesting question is how often IL-76s fly into Belgorod? Tactical transports routinely fly into harm’s way. There may be a couple dozen flights a week delivering materiel. And this one got unlucky. Or msybe they never fly through there and this was a one-off. An unlucky one-off. Which would in turn raise the question of what one-off mission was it performing either on the way in or out or both? I know I have no answers. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6793 "2024-01-27T01:22:22Z")
A whole lot of Russian oil is currently sitting in tankers off the coast of South Korea. Seems there is disagreement between Russia and the Indian Oil Corp about what currency should be used to pay for it. 3.2 million barrels. That’s a fair amount. [https://www.reuters.com/markets/commodities/russia-struggles-sell-pacific-oil-14-tankers-stuck-sources-data-2024-01-26/](https://www.reuters.com/markets/commodities/russia-struggles-sell-pacific-oil-14-tankers-stuck-sources-data-2024-01-26/) ---
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6794 "2024-01-27T02:19:12Z")
> **[What does Ukraine’s million-drone army mean for the future of war?](https://www.newscientist.com/article/2413260-what-does-ukraines-million-drone-army-mean-for-the-future-of-war/)** > > In 2024, Ukraine will have more drones than soldiers in its armed forces, and the aerial vehicles and the artificial intelligences that can control them are changing the way war is waged ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6795 "2024-01-27T02:22:01Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > 3.2 million barrels. That’s a fair amount. Enough to run the USA for about 3 hours. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6796 "2024-01-27T02:36:50Z")
It’s about $250 million dollars. enough for one oligarch’s yacht. time’s are getting tough. ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6797 "2024-01-27T04:41:27Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Seems there is disagreement between Russia and the Indian Oil Corp about what currency should be used to pay for it Does Russia not want to accept rubles?? ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6802 "2024-01-27T18:21:59Z")
> [@Folly](#): > > Does Russia not want to accept rubles Absolutely not. Russia can have as many rubles as they want. They need foreign currency to import things. It’s different for the US, Europe, and some others (Japan, UK, etc.), because the dollar and euro can be used to buy things anywhere in the world, but the ruble, not so much. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6803 "2024-01-27T18:35:52Z")
> [@Folly](#): > > Does Russia not want to accept rubles?? Actually, Putin is insisting on payment for oil and gas in Rubles. [cite.](https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/23/business/putin-russian-oil-gas-rubles.html) ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6804 "2024-01-27T18:43:54Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Actually, Putin is insisting on payment for oil and gas in Rubles. I understand that this was only for “Unfriendly countries” as defined by Putin, and was for the purpose of propping up the currency in 2022. India (specifically the Indian Oil Corp) was not on this list, being one of the few “friendly” countries that Russia has left. I’m not sure what the current currency negotiations are between Russia and India that have led to this situation with dozens of oil tankers parked in port. ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2024, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/6805 "2024-01-27T18:51:24Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Putin is insisting on payment for oil and gas in Rubles. [cite](https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/23/business/putin-russian-oil-gas-rubles.html) The key quote from that article is > “If you’re invoiced in rubles, you’ve got to go out and buy rubles,” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=333) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=335)