# Russia invades Ukraine {2022-02-24} (Part 2) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ukraine-invasion, breaking-news\ **Created:** [October 29, 2022, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972 "2022-10-29T17:49:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 358
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2024, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7273 "2024-06-21T00:39:48Z")
> [@Sauron](#): > > Speculation was that Russia wouldn’t be able to replace its artillery tubes in a timely manner, particularly given the volume of artillery fire they routinely employ. Right, but some of those 11,000 containers they got from North Korea might contain replacements. ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2024, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7274 "2024-06-21T18:30:22Z")
Speaking of replacing hardware, it looks like the Russian Spring Offensive is largely unsupported infantry because they don’t want to lose hard-to-replace armored vehicles. > **[Even Sneaking Through Water Pipes Isn’t Helping Russian Troops Capture Chasiv...](https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2024/06/20/even-sneaking-through-water-pipes-isnt-helping-russian-troops-capture-chasiv-yar/)** > > After 10 weeks, the Russian assault on the town has ground to a halt. Apparently losing hundreds of troops in one operation is better than risking a few IFVs that might have increased the likelihood of a local breakthrough. It’s like the Russians have learned the wrong lessons from the history of human wave attacks. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2024, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7275 "2024-06-22T00:27:40Z")
> [@gnoitall](#): > > It’s like the Russians have learned the wrong lessons from the history of human wave attacks. Have they? They have plenty of humans after all. Armored vehicles, not so much. And they’re more useful in breakout situations anyway. It’s callous, cruel, and ultimately self-defeating from a societal standpoint, but Putin is going to be dead in a handful of years either way. He needs wins NOW. ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2024, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7276 "2024-06-22T00:43:52Z")
Plus which, massive artillery bombardments and human waves — albeit supported by tanks — served them well after Stalingrad. (I seem to recall an adage about the victors “refighting the last war.”) ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2024, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7277 "2024-06-22T00:50:39Z")
This is how they always win wars, this is what they’ve learned. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7278 "2024-06-23T00:52:42Z")
Canada announces military package for Ukraine: > **[Canada announces $60M for F-16 supplies and equipment for Ukraine ahead of...](https://www.ctvnews.ca/mobile/politics/canada-announces-60m-for-f-16-supplies-and-equipment-for-ukraine-ahead-of-nato-meeting-1.6768416)** > > Defence Minister Bill Blair says Canada will send Ukraine $60 million to support its F-16 fighter aircraft. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7279 "2024-06-23T02:06:37Z")
> [@OttoDaFe](#): > > Plus which, massive artillery bombardments and human waves — albeit supported by tanks — served them well after Stalingrad. Especially after Operation Uranus got in the German rear. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7280 "2024-06-23T03:50:16Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Especially after Operation Uranus got in the German rear. Headline for that: Operation (Up) Uranus Push Bottles Up German Rear. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7281 "2024-06-23T10:33:11Z")
**Moderating** @Ludovic and @dtilque Enough, drop this immediately. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2024, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7282 "2024-06-23T22:00:07Z")
A gift link suggesting (somewhat obvious) reasons bilateral agreements and even Canadian support could be important. [https://econ.st/4bctrGB](https://econ.st/4bctrGB) _Mr Putin now asserts that the Western system poses an existential threat to the sovereignty of Russia and the values it should hold. He speaks of two sharply contrasting visions of the future: either the Western system continues to exist and Russia is strategically defeated, or the Western system is replaced and Russia continues to exist. He is convinced that Russia has reached a historical crossroads in its post-Soviet development and that dismantling the existing global order and building a new one is fundamental to Russia’s greater-power aspirations. His revolutionary push is motivated by both internal power-preservation aims and external power-expansion aims._ _His revolution values Russian advantage and gain of power over the West more than coexistence, mutual security, crisis avoidance and stability with the West. His security vision requires a Europe without NATO, and without organisations that uphold the fundamental principles of freedom, democracy and the rule of law. That vision also involves Russian co-operation with other countries to curb American power in the Arctic, Euro-Atlantic and Indo-Pacific regions._ ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2024, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7283 "2024-06-26T00:41:16Z")
This Youtube is fairly new and shows Russia may be losing the war of attrition- [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/y7HJmDhcQQo/maxresdefault.jpg "Russia is Running Out of EVERYTHING (Planes, Ships, Soldiers, Tanks...") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7HJmDhcQQo) ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2024, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7284 "2024-06-26T00:53:19Z")
Russia is a little shorter on drone operator cadets. A drone base and training center is an important target. > **[Ukraine says it destroyed Russian drone base](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c511ny02qjwo)** > > The warehouse seen in satellite images was used to launch Iranian-made Shahed drones and train people, Kyiv said. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2024, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7285 "2024-06-26T11:15:04Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > This Youtube is fairly new and shows Russia may be losing the war of attrition- Interesting if true. But if your goal isn’t conquest, but merely vandalism, a lot of that lost capital equipment is irrelevant to your ongoing ability to vandalize. Yes, it represents a loss of blood and treasure that Russia the people and nation would be better off today had that stuff not been lost. IOW, had Putin never started his misbegotten adventure. But IMO that’s not highly relevant to ending the current meatgrinder vandalistic stalemate. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2024, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7286 "2024-06-26T11:59:08Z")
Yeah. That video also failed to mention the biggest advantage, that being artillery and artillery shells. That’s where Russia’s greatest advantage is, and it seems like there’s no shortage in that area. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2024, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7287 "2024-06-26T13:10:02Z")
I dunno… They’re already resorting to importing artillery from North Korea. Now, granted, North Korea’s artillery arm is very disproportionately large, but still, when you’re replying on the likes of North Korea to prop you up… ---
**Author:** ![smithsb](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smithsb/32/12107_2.png) [@smithsb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smithsb)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2024, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7288 "2024-06-26T13:31:37Z")
Besides Russian air defenses, Ukraine has been emphasizing destroying enemy artillery (that’s because of the Russian advantage initially). Russia has been unable to match losses with production (the bottleneck is barrels - alloys, heat treatment, lack of forges). Similar to western industry, their precision manufacturing facilities were made dormant then sold off for scrap. Western artillery shipments and refurbishment of Ukraine’s Soviet era arsenal are turning the tide WITH ENOUGH AMMO (see US house morons/European complacency). Western ammo is more reliable, longer ranged and accurate. The stalemate on the ground comes from lack of air dominance by either side, entrenched defenses, and limited mobility. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2024, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7289 "2024-06-27T00:31:48Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > They’re already resorting to importing artillery from North Korea. Now they’re importing soldiers from North Korea > **[Pyongyang Says It Will Send Troops to Ukraine Within a Month](https://www.kyivpost.com/post/34893)** > > The June 19 defense pact signed between Russia and North Korea included a promise to provide military assistance to one another – within days Pyongyang said it was sending troops to Ukraine. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2024, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7290 "2024-06-27T01:26:27Z")
> [@Sauron](#): > > After months of essentially stalemate fighting in eastern Ukraine, it looked like this war was going to bog down into a long-lasting meatgrinder. Ukraine’s recent success in degrading air defenses in Crimea, along with the capability of F-16s to provide ground support and SEAD […] Are the F-16s now in the air being used by Ukraine for combat operations? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2024, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7291 "2024-06-27T03:00:51Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Now they’re importing soldiers from North Korea They could probably be enticed to surrender and defect to South Korea. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2024, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972/7292 "2024-06-27T09:33:32Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Now they’re importing soldiers from North Korea > > [Pyongyang Says It Will Send Troops to Ukraine Within a Month](https://www.kyivpost.com/post/34893) Not sure whether that’s a good thing or a bad thing for Russia. I recall a few years ago a North Korean soldier somehow managed to cross the DMZ to the south. He was found to be in not-so-good health, including being afflicted with intestinal worms: > **[Oh Chong-song | Health](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oh_Chong-song#Health)** > > While Oh was in surgery for his gunshot wounds, doctors found large parasitic worms in his digestive tract, one of which was 27 centimetres (11 in) long. The parasites were Ascaris lumbricoides worms. Oh was treated by surgeon Lee Guk-jong at the Ajou University Hospital's intensive care. Oh was later transferred to a military hospital. The surgery and treatment of Oh cost the South Korean government 65 million won ($60,800). South Korea's Channel A reported that an unnamed So If that guy was a fair representation of what NK’s military has to offer, then I don’t think they’re going be a terribly effective fighting force in Ukraine. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=357) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-invades-ukraine-2022-02-24-part-2/973972.md?page=359)