# Russia/US UNSC Deal Reached - what it it means for masterful US President and Sec of State legacy. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 14, 2013, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852 "2013-09-14T17:20:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 49
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2014, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/961 "2014-05-01T13:22:44Z")
[http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/us-officials-say-syria-is-using-remaining-chemical-weapons-stockpile-as-leverage/2014/04/30/1dd68c8a-d0a8-11e3-9e25-188ebe1fa93b\_story.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/us-officials-say-syria-is-using-remaining-chemical-weapons-stockpile-as-leverage/2014/04/30/1dd68c8a-d0a8-11e3-9e25-188ebe1fa93b_story.html) > [@](#): > > The months-long effort to dismantle Syria’s chemical weapons program has ground to a halt because Syria is holding on to 27 tons of sarin precursor chemicals as leverage in a dispute with the international community over the future of facilities used to store the deadly agents, according to U.S. officials. Masterful! Just the way John Kerry planned it! ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2014, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/962 "2014-05-02T03:00:53Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > [http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/us-officials-say-syria-is-using-remaining-chemical-weapons-stockpile-as-leverage/2014/04/30/1dd68c8a-d0a8-11e3-9e25-188ebe1fa93b\_story.html](http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/us-officials-say-syria-is-using-remaining-chemical-weapons-stockpile-as-leverage/2014/04/30/1dd68c8a-d0a8-11e3-9e25-188ebe1fa93b_story.html) > > Masterful! Just the way John Kerry planned it! If you say so. From your link: > [@](#): > > U.S. officials said Russia, Syria’s principal arms supplier, continues to put pressure on Damascus to turn over the remaining sarin, making the effort one of the few remaining areas in which Moscow and Washington are collaborating. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2014, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/963 "2014-05-02T04:59:36Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > If you say so. > From your link: > [@](#): > > U.S. officials said Russia, Syria’s principal arms supplier, continues to put pressure on Damascus to turn over the remaining sarin, making the effort one of the few remaining areas in which Moscow and Washington are collaborating. yah, they’re collaborating the hell out of it. Assad is Putin’s personal sock monkey and he’s somehow not cooperating. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2014, 7:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/964 "2014-05-03T07:59:54Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > So back on September 9, 2013, the Americans said that they wanted Syria to turn over all of its chemical weapons within a week. That would have been September 16, 2013. > > Syria agreed to turn over all of its chemical weapons. They agreed to have this completed by February 6, 2014. > > It’s now April 17, 2014. There are still chemical weapons in Syria. The date for completing the removal has been moved back multiple times. The current Syrian promise is it’ll be done by the end of April. And it’s now May. Are all of the chemical weapons out of Syria? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2014, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/965 "2014-05-03T12:38:43Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > And it’s now May. Are all of the chemical weapons out of Syria? The actual deadline is June 3O and there is only 8% left. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2014, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/966 "2014-05-03T13:15:47Z")
June 30 what? So the United Nations made a mistake when they [declared](http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=47663#.U2TrgPldV8E) that Syria missed the deadline for removing all CW out of the country? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2014, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/967 "2014-05-03T19:12:16Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > The actual deadline is June 3O and there is only 8% left. As opposed to the previous actual deadline of April 30 and the target figure of 0%. Okay, I’ll be back in July and I’ll ask the same question. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/968 "2014-06-24T01:33:27Z")
> [@](#): > > > [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > > > As opposed to the previous actual deadline of April 30 and the target figure of 0%. > > > > Okay, I’ll be back in July and I’ll ask the same question. I don’t have to wait for you: > [@](#): > > Syria has removed 100 percent of declared chemicals -team chief > NICOSIA | Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:18am EDT > > NICOSIA (Reuters) - The head of the international team of weapons experts charged with overseeing the elimination of Syria’s chemical stockpile told Reuters on Monday that Syria had removed all its declared arsenal from its territory. [http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN0EY1DH20140623?feedType=RSS&irpc=932](http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN0EY1DH20140623?feedType=RSS&irpc=932) Who is upset that ISI(S/L) won’t be getting their hands on any CW from the arsenal that Syria used to have. Rachel Maddow is on this great achievement. Good for her ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/969 "2014-06-24T02:32:28Z")
Syria has removed 100 percent of declared chemicals. Who in here believe Assad gave up all his chemical weapons? Add to that from the same article: " she expected work would start within three months on a process to destroy 12 production sites and tunnels linked to Syria’s chemical weapons program. " So Assad has had all this time to hide the weapons he didn’t declare along with reconstituting his production facilities somewhere else. Or just buy more some from Putin. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/970 "2014-06-24T04:57:02Z")
Well, I won’t say this has been or definitely is a complete victory. But I have to admit I didn’t think we’d even get this far. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/971 "2014-06-24T06:30:24Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Syria has removed 100 percent of declared chemicals. Who in here believe Assad gave up all his chemical weapons? > > Add to that from the same article: " she expected work would start within three months on a process to destroy 12 production sites and tunnels linked to Syria’s chemical weapons program. " > > So Assad has had all this time to hide the weapons he didn’t declare along with reconstituting his production facilities somewhere else. Or just buy more some from Putin. Do you have intelligence that leaves no doubt that the Assad regime is concealing some of the most lethal weapons ever devised from OPCW inspectors? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 6:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/972 "2014-06-24T06:37:24Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Well, I won’t say this has been or definitely is a complete victory. But I have to admit I didn’t think we’d even get this far. Thank you. But what do you mean by ‘complete victory’? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 7:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/973 "2014-06-24T07:01:22Z")
I wonder if Assad feels weaker or stronger today for several reasons: (1) Iraqi Shiite militias that have been fighting on Assad’s behalf (perhaps 20,000) have gone back to Iraq to fight ISIS there. (2) ISIS is bringing US supplied weapons across the vanishing border of Iraq and Syria. To be used against him. They also have a billion dollar boost in cash from looted banks in Iraq. Plus they may have taken Iraq’s biggest oil refinery and could use it to fuel their vehicals to be used in the asssuit on Danascus. (3) Assad has no chemical weapons to keep secure as an excuse that his regime cannot be allowed to fall. Eight months ago that to the west and Israel that was a justifiable concern. How do you transfer the responsibility of safeguarding a CW arsenal if the regime in control is taken down along with its military chain of command? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/974 "2014-06-24T08:24:18Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Thank you. But what do you mean by ‘complete victory’? As others have said, I still have concerns that Assad may have chemical weapons he didn’t declare or may plan on rebuilding his stock of them. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/975 "2014-06-24T16:52:50Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > Do you have intelligence that leaves no doubt that the Assad regime is concealing some of the most lethal weapons ever devised from OPCW inspectors? do you have any intelligence at all regarding the whereabouts of the weapons in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/976 "2014-06-24T17:17:25Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > do you have any intelligence at all regarding the whereabouts of the weapons in the first place? OPCW is the best source of intelligence at this point but there is also no intelligence from any country coming forward disputing that there is any CW left behind in Syria You are basing your conclusion on nothing at all. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2014, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/977 "2014-06-24T18:05:08Z")
> [@NotfooledbyW](#): > > OPCW is the best source of intelligence at this point but there is also no intelligence from any country coming forward disputing that there is any CW left behind in Syria > > You are basing your conclusion on nothing at all. OPCW intelligence is whatever Assad told them. Your conclusion is based on Assad’s word. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/978 "2014-06-25T00:27:28Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > OPCW intelligence is whatever Assad told them. Your conclusion is based on Assad’s word. But there is a possibility that Assad has ordered the entire arsenal destroyed. On the other hand there is not even the slightest possibility that you know anything about the existence of concealed CW one way or the other. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/979 "2014-06-25T00:50:45Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > June 30 what? So the United Nations made a mistake when they [declared](http://www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=47663#.U2TrgPldV8E) that Syria missed the deadline for removing all CW out of the country? From Ravenman’s link: (“She added that every effort must be made to achieve the 30 June 2014 deadline set by OPCW Executive Council Decisions and the UN Security Council, by which time the full arsenal is to be destroyed.”) Its common to set several interim deadlines to monitor progress toward the final deadline in this case that always was June 30. ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852/980 "2014-06-25T01:18:15Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Indeed. Presumably he learned his lesson about “red lines”. It’s easy not to get involved-- don’t get involved and don’t make idle threats. Why? 1300 Tons of CW have been removed from a war zone with blood thirsty killer terrorists establishing their caliphate right there. A master stroke by Obama to use the threat of force to disarm a tyrant of CW without sactificing the lives of our troops. Had Bush been wise enough to disarm Iraq through international law just think how many people would not be dead. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852.md?page=48) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russia-us-unsc-deal-reached-what-it-it-means-for-masterful-us-president-and-sec-of-state-legacy/668852.md?page=50)