# Russian Foes of Putin to US Liberals: "STOP Making Putin Out to Be a Mastermind!!!!" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 12, 2017, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297 "2017-12-12T17:35:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/1 "2017-12-12T17:35:38Z")
Cite? > **[Why Putin’s Foes Deplore U.S. Fixation on Election Meddling (Published 2017)](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/23/world/europe/russia-vladimir-putin-liberals.html)** > > “Enough already!” one critic of President Vladimir V. Putin said, worried that the accusations were helping the Kremlin polish the president’s image as a master strategist. Think about this. SUPPOSE that Vladimir Putin turns on CNN in his office, or looks at a translated copy of the Washington Post, or sees a subtitled tirade from Stephen Colbert or Rachel Maddow. All of them are saying, “Vladimir Putin rigged the US elections! He controls the Trump White House! That sneaky, diabolical genius is secretly pulling the strings and ruling the world!” How do you think Putin reacts? By groaning to his aide, “Oh no, Sergei, they have seen through my plan and all is lost”? Maybe. But I suspect he chuckles, and thinks, “Perfect. Everyone sees ME as an evil genius, while regarding the Americans as bumblers who can’t even run their own elections.” Folks, Putin is not a genius, evil or otherwise. He’s just the latest in a long series of dim, cruel KGB thugs. He’s not a chess master! He’s not a puppeteer. He’s just a tinhorn dictator presiding over a dangerous but decaying country that can’t even crush weaker neighbors like Georgia or the Ukraine! Did he have hackers playing silly tricks and planting bogus stories on social media? Sure, and Americans undoubtedly play similar tricks on our enemies. It’s not a big deal and never has been. By treating Putin as a master manipulator, American liberals are BOOSTING his power and prestige all over the world. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/2 "2017-12-12T17:37:43Z")
Being a mastermind is relative. You don’t have to be a great genius to be smarter than the puppet you’re controlling. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/3 "2017-12-12T17:46:00Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > … > > Folks, Putin is not a genius, evil or otherwise. … But compared to our leader, Putin really is a genius. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/4 "2017-12-12T17:48:39Z")
Particularly when one considers his aim is just to stir up as much shit as possible, which is a lot easier than actual manipulation. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/5 "2017-12-12T17:55:43Z")
I don’t really care about the US election. The world is a bit bigger than that. The US just needs to fix whatever it needs to fix. Putin is exactly what a society needs as it transitions from whatever went before into a proto-democracy and early stage capitalist economy. There’s several decades of this to go before the organs of state of the Russian Federation mature into something stable. In a sense he’s been fortunate in that the USA/CIA has given his army something to engage with in Ukraine. And Syria has validated the navy and airfore. So that’s smart. Powerful oligarchs are unavoidable at this stage - exactly the same in early Victorian England, who paid for Downton Abbey, etc. I like Putin; he sees the whole game, he reads the game and he plays almost everyone really very well - Angela Merkel has his number though, that’s for sure. I even like his humour. His is obv. brutal and murderous but it’s pragmatism in a brutal, murderous climate. It’s a long, long road ahead but the Russian Federation is stable - thank goodness, and Putin has the lunatic fringes in check. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/6 "2017-12-12T18:46:18Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Putin is exactly what a society needs as it transitions from whatever went before into a proto-democracy and early stage capitalist economy. There’s several decades of this to go before the organs of state of the Russian Federation mature into something stable. Yeah, being dictator for life with all of the previous control that the party members of the old Soviet Union had but with lots of money is certainly a big step up and putting them on the path to ‘proto-democracy’. 😛 > [@](#): > > I like Putin; No? Really? I’m shocked! ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/7 "2017-12-12T20:08:35Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Did he have hackers playing silly tricks and planting bogus stories on social media? Sure, and Americans undoubtedly play similar tricks on our enemies. Cite? Also: So you agree that Russia’s our enemy? > [@](#): > > It’s not a big deal and never has been. And you think it’s no big deal that our enemy interfered in our presidential elections? > [@](#): > > By treating Putin as a master manipulator, American liberals are BOOSTING his power and prestige all over the world. No, you have it backwards. By successfully manipulating the American elections, Putin boosted his _own_ power and prestige. Trying to blame American liberals for wanting to get to the bottom of Putin’s actions rather than just quietly go along with it … is certainly convenient for the many Republicans who are benefiting from it but it does nothing to hide Putin’s obvious success. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/8 "2017-12-12T20:23:22Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > Cite? > > Also: So you agree that Russia’s our enemy? > > And you think it’s no big deal that our enemy interfered in our presidential elections? > > No, you have it backwards. By successfully manipulating the American elections, Putin boosted his _own_ power and prestige. > > Trying to blame American liberals for wanting to get to the bottom of Putin’s actions rather than just quietly go along with it … is certainly convenient for the many Republicans who are benefiting from it but it does nothing to hide Putin’s obvious success. Pathetic. You think you’ve “got” me??? Of COURSE I think Russia is our enemy. In fact, I thought so 5 years ago when a clown named Obama scoffed at Mitt Romney for asserting that fact at the debates. The Democrats used to pretend that Russia was our friend, and that Dubya was responsible for all our problems- that’s why they created the big RESET button. Putin is no mastermind and he didn’t make Trump president. Millions of foolish American voters did that. Putin played a few feeble games to sow discontent. Liberals want to pretend those feeble games are the reason Hillary lost. ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/9 "2017-12-12T21:07:56Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Pathetic. You think you’ve “got” me??? I think _you’ve_ got nothing. In particular, I don’t think you have any cites for your assertion that Americans have interfered in Russia’s elections. > [@astorian](#): > > Of COURSE I think Russia is our enemy. In fact, I thought so 5 years ago when a clown named Obama scoffed at Mitt Romney for asserting that fact at the debates. But … you don’t think it’s cause for concern that our enemy interfered in our elections? > [@astorian](#): > > Putin is no mastermind and he didn’t make Trump president. Millions of foolish American voters did that. Putin played a few feeble games to sow discontent. Liberals want to pretend those feeble games are the reason Hillary lost. Be specific. Cite, please. Which particular “feeble games” did Putin - our enemy - play with our elections and why do you think it isn’t important? ---
**Author:** ![Merneith](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/57b2e6/32.png) [@Merneith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merneith)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/10 "2017-12-12T21:55:37Z")
In related news, Politifact has declared that Donald Trump’s attempt to dismiss the entire Russia thing as “Fake News” is its **Lie of the Year 2017**. > **[2017 Lie of the Year: Russian election action is a hoax](https://www.politifact.com/article/2017/dec/12/2017-lie-year-russian-election-interference-made-s/)** > > A mountain of evidence points to a single fact: Russia meddled in the U.S. presidential election of 2016. In both classi > [@Politifact Lie of the Year article](#): > > A mountain of evidence points to a single fact: Russia meddled in the U.S. presidential election of 2016. > > In both classified and public reports, U.S. intelligence agencies have said Russian President Vladimir Putin ordered actions to interfere with the election. Those actions included the cyber-theft of private data, the placement of propaganda against particular candidates, and an overall effort to undermine public faith in the U.S. democratic process. > > Members of Congress, both Democrats and Republicans, have held open and closed door hearings to probe Russia’s actions. The congressional investigations are ongoing. > > Facebook, Google and Twitter have investigated their own networks, and their executives have concluded — in some cases after initial foot-dragging — that Russia used the online platforms in attempts to influence the election. > > After all this, one man keeps saying it didn’t even happen. > > “This Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story. It’s an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should’ve won,” said President Donald Trump in an interview with NBC’s Lester Holt in May. > > \ > > Trump continually asserts that Russia’s meddling in the 2016 election is fake news, a hoax or a made-up story, even though there is widespread, bipartisan evidence to the contrary. > > When the nation’s commander-in-chief refuses to acknowledge a threat to U.S. democracy, it makes it all the more difficult to address the problem. For this reason, we name Trump’s claim that the Russia interference is a hoax as our Lie of the Year for 2017. I can’t help pointing out that **astorian** is just repeating Donald’s Big Lie when he (astorion) claims that talks of Putin’s manipulation is the product of crazy liberals trying to find an excuse for Hillary’s loss. And you know … in light of the fact that everyone (except Donald) who has seen the evidence agrees that Putin interfered in American elections by manipulating our free journalism and free speech traditions, the OP’s article about “Russians who respect America’s journalism so much that they want Americans to stop talking about Putin’s manipulation of American journalism” doesn’t really pass the smell test. I also can’t help remembering that the NYT was one of the groups who couldn’t stop talking about the “shadow” hanging over Hillary because of the stupid emails and Benghazi swiftboating. In other words: it would be foolish to assume that the Russians have stopped trying to manipulate American journalism. We should be deeply suspicious of calls from Russia asking us to drop the subject. Poitifacts’ article concludes: > [@Politifact article linked above](#): > > Investigations should go forward until all the facts come out about Russia’s role in the election, said Benjamin Wittes, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution and editor in chief of Lawfare, a national security blog. > > “It’s possible that the president obstructed justice. It’s also possible the president behaved wildly inappropriately without obstructing justice,” Wittes said. “And it’s important to find out exactly what happened.” > > “Once you say, we don’t mind foreign governments interfering with your elections, then you’re on your way to yielding up significant aspects of sovereignty,” he added. “It’s an important line to defend.” Emphasis mine. The Russian investigation is a matter of America’s national security. Who benefits from discrediting the investigation? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/11 "2017-12-12T22:07:32Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Being a mastermind is relative. You don’t have to be a great genius to be smarter than the puppet you’re controlling. Exactly. Nobody here is saying Putin is a genius. We’re saying he’s smarter than Donald Trump. That’s not a big deal. I’m no genius but I’m smarter than Donald Trump. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/12 "2017-12-12T22:31:40Z")
We’re also saying that Putin’s smarter than a substantial percentage of the american populace - or at least he was smart enough (or well-trained enough) to realize that social media is a propaganda gold mine that can easily influence, galvanize, or neutralize people of many different ideological stripes. And yes, I’d go so far as to say that it’s extremely clear that the flood of fake news on social media threw the election to Trump. It’s not like he won by much; that close to the line even a small push in his favor would mean that he would have lost without the push. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/13 "2017-12-12T23:09:58Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > And you think it’s no big deal that our enemy interfered in our presidential elections? It’s a bit like being “shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!” Everyone is vaguely aware that everyone spies on everyone else. Yes, countries get a bit uppity when they catch someone in the act, but it’s kind of tacitly accepted as part of the game of international politics. It seems that messing with others’ elections is along those same lines. I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised to learn that Russia, and the USSR before that, did some meddling in every US election going back several decades, or that we’ve done the same to them, and many other countries throughout the world. ---
**Author:** ![pdhenry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pdhenry/32/5561_2.png) [@pdhenry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pdhenry)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/14 "2017-12-12T23:11:42Z")
> [@Merneith](#): > > I think _you’ve_ got nothing. In particular, I don’t think you have any cites for your assertion that Americans have interfered in Russia’s elections. Does it have to be _ **Russian** _ elections? I read the claim being that we interfere with (some, any) elections. Are you claiming that has never occurred? [http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-us-intervention-foreign-elections-20161213-story.html](http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-us-intervention-foreign-elections-20161213-story.html) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/15 "2017-12-12T23:18:17Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > It’s a bit like being “shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here!” > > Everyone is vaguely aware that everyone spies on everyone else. Yes, countries get a bit uppity when they catch someone in the act, but it’s kind of tacitly accepted as part of the game of international politics. It seems that messing with others’ elections is along those same lines. > > I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised to learn that Russia, and the USSR before that, did some meddling in every US election going back several decades, or that we’ve done the same to them, and many other countries throughout the world. But this is another attempt to divert public attention from the real issue. It’s no big deal that a foreign power tried to influence an American election. The big deal is that an American presidential campaign (and probably an American presidential candidate) accepted the assistance of a foreign power in winning an election. What Russia did wrong is a trivial issue and I’d have no problem dismissing it. What Trump did wrong is a serious issue and needs to be fully investigated and made public. ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/16 "2017-12-12T23:22:29Z")
> [@pdhenry](#): > > Does it have to be _ **Russian** _ elections? I read the claim being that we interfere with (some, any) elections. Are you claiming that has never occurred? > > [http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-us-intervention-foreign-elections-20161213-story.html](http://beta.latimes.com/nation/la-na-us-intervention-foreign-elections-20161213-story.html) [Wikipedia offers this](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foreign_electoral_intervention#Russian_election_(U.S.,_1996)): > [@](#): > > The first Russian president Boris Yeltsin won his second term in 1996 Presidential elections thanks to the extensive assistance provided by the team of media and PR experts from the US.[25] According to the cover story in the Time magazine,[26] these were Steven Moore, Joe Shumate, Felix Braynin, George Gorton and Richard Dresner, who worked in Russia four months and received $250 thousand, plus payment of all costs and unlimited budget to conduct surveys and other activities. Simultaneously the US administration ensured a US$10.2 billion IMF loan to Russia[27] as it was drowning in the economic and social disaster, to keep the national economy and pro-Western liberal government afloat. And to re-iterate my point: > [@](#): > > A 2016 study by Dov Levin found that, among 938 global elections examined,[a] the United States and Russia\*\* combined had involved themselves in about one out of nine (117), with the majority of those (68%) being through covert, rather than overt, actions. The same study found that “on average, an electoral intervention in favor of one side contesting the election will increase its vote share by about 3 percent,” an effect large enough to have potentially changed the results in seven out of 14 U.S. presidential elections occurring after 1960.[2][c][d] According to the study, the U.S. intervened in 81 foreign elections between 1946 and 2000, while the Soviet Union or Russia intervened in 36. Again, I’m ‘shocked, shocked I tell you!’ ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/17 "2017-12-12T23:26:14Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > But this is another attempt to divert public attention from the real issue. It’s no big deal that a foreign power tried to influence an American election. The big deal is that an American presidential campaign (and probably an American presidential candidate) accepted the assistance of a foreign power in winning an election. > > What Russia did wrong is a trivial issue and I’d have no problem dismissing it. What Trump did wrong is a serious issue and needs to be fully investigated and made public. I don’t really know what “accepted the assistance of” means. The big hubub was over whether Trump had “colluded” with Russia. That word “[collusion](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%205-y&geo=US&q=collusion)”, remember? That’s what Meuller is supposed to be investigating. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2017, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/18 "2017-12-12T23:35:02Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I don’t really know what “accepted the assistance of” means. The big hubub was over whether Trump had “colluded” with Russia. That word “[collusion](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%205-y&geo=US&q=collusion)”, remember? That’s what Meuller is supposed to be investigating. Well, it might be that he’s investigating someone in the Oval Office for \*obstruction of justice \*with respect to the collusion. Sort of like a shoplifter shooting at a cop so he won’t get arrested for shoplifting. Not real smart. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/19 "2017-12-13T03:57:15Z")
Oooooh, so POLITICO says Russian trickery is a huge deal!!! That changes EVERYTHING. If POLITICO, a completely neutral, unbiased group concerned only with facts says so, the case is closed. ---
**Author:** ![Ale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@Ale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ale)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2017, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297/20 "2017-12-13T05:37:53Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Cite? > > [https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/23/world/europe/russia-vladimir-putin-liberals.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/23/world/europe/russia-vladimir-putin-liberals.html) > > Think about this. SUPPOSE that Vladimir Putin turns on CNN in his office, or looks at a translated copy of the Washington Post, or sees a subtitled tirade from Stephen Colbert or Rachel Maddow. All of them are saying, “Vladimir Putin rigged the US elections! He controls the Trump White House! That sneaky, diabolical genius is secretly pulling the strings and ruling the world!” > > How do you think Putin reacts? By groaning to his aide, “Oh no, Sergei, they have seen through my plan and all is lost”? > > Maybe. But I suspect he chuckles, and thinks, “Perfect. Everyone sees ME as an evil genius, while regarding the Americans as bumblers who can’t even run their own elections.” > Folks, Putin is not a genius, evil or otherwise. He’s just the latest in a long series of dim, cruel KGB thugs. He’s not a chess master! He’s not a puppeteer. He’s just a tinhorn dictator presiding over a dangerous but decaying country that can’t even crush weaker neighbors like Georgia or the Ukraine! > > Did he have hackers playing silly tricks and planting bogus stories on social media? Sure, and Americans undoubtedly play similar tricks on our enemies. It’s not a big deal and never has been. > > By treating Putin as a master manipulator, American liberals are BOOSTING his power and prestige all over the world. The same applies, IMHO, to how Nazism and white supremacy are being treated by the left in the US by painting them as an existential threat. Obscure creeps with a handful of followers have been unwittingly elevated to a (anti) heroic proportions. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/russian-foes-of-putin-to-us-liberals-stop-making-putin-out-to-be-a-mastermind/804297.md?page=2)