# Safety of paternoster elevators? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 26, 2014, 8:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680 "2014-06-26T08:45:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/21 "2014-06-26T15:35:14Z")
> [@Busy\_Scissors](#): > > Anyone ever ridden in a [paternoster elevator](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternoster)? No, but I’ve ridden a chair lift. Similar thing, a continuous belt that never stops moving, and on some of them the chairs are open with no bar or belt to stop people falling out. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/22 "2014-06-26T15:38:38Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I wouldn’t have thought so, no. The one I saw had about a 12 inch or so overhang, and it looked like the thing could pretty much stop on a dime. I’m not sure how the floor flap ones work, though. I have to assume these safety features are not merely decorative. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/23 "2014-06-26T15:41:28Z")
[Here’s a story of one](http://www.radio.cz/en/section/special/paternosters-lift-czech-bodies-and-spirits) where the safety equipment works properly: > [@](#): > > Neither Jyrkinen nor Sedlak nor Kabele can recall any serious paternoster injuries in Prague in recent years. But in 2005, a tourist visiting Lucerna panicked as she reached the top of the line. As the compartment pulled away from the fourth floor, she got a limb caught in the narrowing gap between the bottom of the cabin and the ceiling of the top floor, triggering the machine to come to an immediate halt. The tourist was unharmed, but the paternoster was out of commission for 3 months. ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/24 "2014-06-26T15:52:52Z")
The paternoster at De Montfort wouldn’t continue if something impeded its access to the next floor. If you had put a brick in the entrance, the lift would have stopped. My pregnant belly caused jolts so that I had to move out of the way. If your leg were in the way, the lift would have stopped. There was no way it couldn’t have stopped - it wouldn’t be able to actually move. It wouldn’t recquire any system other than “thing is in the way” to stop it from continuing upwards. Your leg would have been really badly broken, probably, but not chopped off a la loads of action movies. Breaking a leg is still quite a big deal, hence no more paternosters. That, and I expect some people did waste everyone’s time by putting a brick in the way. ---
**Author:** ![CC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f1d935/32.png) [@CC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CC)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/25 "2014-06-26T16:31:52Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > A parking garage/rental car place in Seattle had one of those. Never saw anybody use it, but I always wanted to try it. Years ago, I cashiered at a parking lot that had one. I think it was extremely useful, as the car hikers had to go up and down several floors to park and to retrieve the cars. I don’t know how the task could have been done without it. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/26 "2014-06-26T16:54:26Z")
There was one in the main lecture theater block ([Roger Stevens Building](https://www.flickr.com/photos/richboxfrenzy/3597318289/)) at the University of Leeds when I was there in the '70s and '80s. I don’t know if it is still there. I have ridden it, including going round the top and round the bottom, many times. I never heard of any major problems with it, although I seem to recall being in it when it got stuck once, and having to jump down a few feet. ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/27 "2014-06-26T17:20:26Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > [I’ve ridden a belt manlift elevator](http://www.humphrey-manlift.com/store.asp?pid=27319). It’s much the same as a paternoster except for the absence of the compartment. There are some safety concerns and most places restrict their use to employees only, no contractors or visitors allowed. I use to ride those as a contractor. I hate them. I once was going down and didn’t realize I was at the bottom floor until I fell off at the bottom. There’s an emergency stop cord that runs the length of the lift and I accidentally hit that, which stopped it. I don’t know what would happen going up and not getting off on the top floor. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/28 "2014-06-26T17:24:33Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > The paternoster at De Montfort wouldn’t continue if something impeded its access to the next floor. If you had put a brick in the entrance, the lift would have stopped. My pregnant belly caused jolts so that I had to move out of the way. > > If your leg were in the way, the lift would have stopped. There was no way it couldn’t have stopped - it wouldn’t be able to actually move. It wouldn’t recquire any system other than “thing is in the way” to stop it from continuing upwards. I can’t understand how this is possible - if the machine has sufficient power to lift people, it has power to dismember them. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/29 "2014-06-26T17:25:34Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > The one I saw had about a 12 inch or so overhang, and it looked like the thing could pretty much stop on a dime. I’m not sure how the floor flap ones work, though. I have to assume these safety features are not merely decorative. Are the safety features a retrofit? Because I’m just trying to imagine how safety was even on the drawing board when these things were invented. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/30 "2014-06-26T17:41:19Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Are the safety features a retrofit? Because I’m just trying to imagine how safety was even on the drawing board when these things were invented. According to the piece I linked to earlier in this thread, [here it is again](http://www.theelevatormuseum.org/f/f_1.htm), apparently they were designed with safety features, yes. At least that’s what the quoted newspaper article from what I gather is contemporaneous with its invention in 1884 says. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/31 "2014-06-26T17:48:22Z")
> [@dougrb](#): > > I use to ride those as a contractor. I hate them. I once was going down and didn’t realize I was at the bottom floor until I fell off at the bottom. There’s an emergency stop cord that runs the length of the lift and I accidentally hit that, which stopped it. I don’t know what would happen going up and not getting off on the top floor. In the ones I’ve ridden terrible injuries would occur if you panicked and failed to get off at the top. That’s the primary safety risk, because getting on is easy as pie, but getting off of one is more nerve racking. Remember, these go up through big old holes cut in the floor and it’s a pretty long step to solid footing. If you’re at the top and hesitate suddenly you’re five or six feet off the cement and rising. The second big safety risk is idiots using them as freight elevators. I’ve heard stories about contractors riding up one carrying a stepladder. ---
**Author:** ![dougrb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/76d3ee/32.png) [@dougrb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dougrb)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/32 "2014-06-26T18:31:46Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > Remember, these go up through big old holes cut in the floor and it’s a pretty long step to solid footing. Not only that, but you are stepping backwards. Did I mention I hated those things? > [@Bill\_Door](#): > > The second big safety risk is idiots using them as freight elevators. I’ve heard stories about contractors riding up one carrying a stepladder. At the plant I was at carrying anything was strictly verboten, but that didn’t stop it from happening. ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/33 "2014-06-26T19:18:03Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > In the ones I’ve ridden terrible injuries would occur if you panicked and failed to get off at the top. That’s the primary safety risk, because getting on is easy as pie, but getting off of one is more nerve racking. Remember, these go up through big old holes cut in the floor and it’s a pretty long step to solid footing. If you’re at the top and hesitate suddenly you’re five or six feet off the cement and rising. I do not know what you were riding, but absolutely none of that was true of the Paternoster I used to ride in Leeds. It was perfectly safe to ride over the top or round the bottom, which people frequently did, and the gap to step on or off was no more than about half an inch. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/34 "2014-06-26T19:19:53Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > According to the piece I linked to earlier in this thread, [here it is again](http://www.theelevatormuseum.org/f/f_1.htm), apparently they were designed with safety features, yes. At least that’s what the quoted newspaper article from what I gather is contemporaneous with its invention in 1884 says. Thanks. I do wonder how Victorian-designed safety features can really be considered safe in a modern context though. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Bredin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@John\_Bredin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Bredin)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/35 "2014-06-26T19:31:22Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > I do not know what you were riding, but absolutely none of that was true of the Paternoster I used to ride in Leeds. It was perfectly safe to ride over the top or round the bottom, which people frequently did, and the gap to step on or off was no more than about half an inch. **Bill Door** was talking about manlifts, as seen in the link in his earlier post, not paternosters. ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/36 "2014-06-26T19:41:30Z")
Geez, those are mega-safe compared to those you see in movies\* set in factories which are just vertical conveyor belts with grab bars/steps. - One of the _In Like Flint_ movies had one, e.g… ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/37 "2014-06-26T19:45:02Z")
> [@ftg](#): > > Geez, those are mega-safe compared to those you see in movies\* set in factories which are just vertical conveyor belts with grab bars/steps. > > - One of the _In Like Flint_ movies had one, e.g… They’re not just in movies; see link in [Bill Door’s post (#17).](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17496159&postcount=17) ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/38 "2014-06-26T19:59:51Z")
The man lift has a stop/start control rope. The first guy stopped the thing, got on and stopped it to get off. The other two guys in the video jumped on while its moving. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/39 "2014-06-26T20:29:32Z")
> [@Machine\_Elf](#): > > They’re not just in movies; see link in [Bill Door’s post (#17).](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=17496159&postcount=17) Or [Donkey Kong](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9N4tQ_9ako). ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [June 26, 2014, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680/40 "2014-06-26T21:01:42Z")
My eye doctor in Prague has one of these in his building. In fact, it might even be the one in the OPs linked picture. I haven’t been there in several years. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/safety-of-paternoster-elevators/691680.md?page=3)