# Sally Forth: Men are helpless idjits. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 10, 2003, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766 "2003-01-10T17:11:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/41 "2003-01-10T22:33:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Incubus \* > \*\* > What I was trying to say is that if they reversed the roles, they probably couldn’t get away with it because people seem to get more incensed when women are victims of sexism than when men are, when I see sexism bad for _both_ sexes. > \*\* Let’s be very clear here. You are saying that the kind of cleaning commercials you are talking about with domestically competant wife/mom and domestically incompetant husband/dad portray men in an unacceptably sexist way but _not_ women, right? Because for the second time that sure _looks_ like it’s what your saying, but a lot of people have just claimed on your behalf that the first time around you didn’t mean that at all. So do you think that these commercials present both men and women in an unacceptably sexist light, or are men the _only_ “victims of sexism” in these ads? ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/42 "2003-01-10T22:59:56Z")
Ha, I saw that cartoon. I was reading the comics and I sort of browsed Sally Forth and she was all “blah, blah, why do men always…” and I immediately said to myself: “What the hell am I doing reading Sally Forth? It sucks.” Not as bad as “Cathy” though. It’s especially ironic since last year I had to MAKE my girlfriend go to the doctor when she had stomach pains that wouldn’t go away. Turned out she had acute appendicitis and needed immediate surgery. [And I BETTER not hear any “acute angina” jokes.] ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/43 "2003-01-10T23:21:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Green Bean \* > \*\*Bwahaha! _Please_ tell me you meant Bill Watterson?! The idea of a comic strip by ADA Jack McCoy is just too painful to contemplate. But Sam Waterston does look like a comic strip with those beady eyes and huge eyebrows. \*\* I was hoping he meant Sam Kinison. Now there was someone who could counter male-bash humor! ---
**Author:** ![Incubus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c68b51/32.png) [@Incubus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Incubus)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/44 "2003-01-10T23:35:42Z")
Lamia, the point I am making is that they couldn’t get away with it being the other way around. Too un-PC to show in this day and age. But yes, I do agree that they are sexist to both men and women. But hey, its just a commercial. You vote with your dollars, not principles. ---
**Author:** ![Badtz\_Maru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e36b37/32.png) [@Badtz\_Maru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Badtz_Maru)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/45 "2003-01-10T23:43:02Z")
What’s sexist about portraying women who see themselves as caretakers of their family? It’s not like the ads say it’s wrong for women to work outside the home, nor do they imply that the woman in the ad doesn’t. In a lot of families, there is a division of labor. For whatever reason, it seems the women do most of the shopping in a lot of families (go to the grocery store and see how women outnumber men). Advertisers are targeting their market, that’s all. If it was the other way around, the ads would show a man doing laundry, cleaning house, and cooking dinner. I do get tired of how frequently fathers are shown as incompetent nitwits in American media. I’ve heard that people from other countries find the way men are portrayed in American television strange. Even when it comes time to thank our parents, this stereotype remains…compare Mothers Day cards to Fathers Day cards. Almost all Mothers Day cards have sincere words of thanks, a poetic phrase or two, while the Fathers Day cards are almost all ‘humorous’ and often make thinly-veiled jabs at their recipients fathering skills. ---
**Author:** ![Sivalensis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@Sivalensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sivalensis)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/46 "2003-01-10T23:44:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lamia \* > \*\*Let’s be very clear here. You are saying that the kind of cleaning commercials you are talking about with domestically competant wife/mom and domestically incompetant husband/dad portray men in an unacceptably sexist way but _not_ women, right? Because for the second time that sure _looks_ like it’s what your saying, but a lot of people have just claimed on your behalf that the first time around you didn’t mean that at all. So do you think that these commercials present both men and women in an unacceptably sexist light, or are men the _only_ “victims of sexism” in these ads? \*\* Ok now, I’m a woman, and I believe in equality and I’m against sexism, but isn’t this a bit much? Sorry Lamia, but I think you’re reading WAY too much into this. This is how I read it: scenario one (the op’s comic): The man shows he’s totally incompetant, being lazy or didn’t want to appear weak by going to the doctor. The woman is patronizing by showing how superior she is to him because she knows to go to the doctor when she feels ill. She refuses to see him as an individual: rather, she groups him with all men (I have one at home). scenario two: The woman shows she’s helpless and incompetant by thinking she can wait it out and it’ll go away. The man is patronizing by showing how superior he is to her because he’s all wise and knows to go to the doctor when he feels ill. So in scenario two, if the man says the same thing as the woman did (I have one at home) and if he showed himself to be so much wiser and seeming superior, then there would be a hell of a lot more uproar. That’s the point that was trying to be made I think. Not that one was worse on a sexism scale, but simply that if it were scenario two, the uproar would be a lot louder (sexism against women, since it’s been more of a problem in the past, has very loud and angry denouncers). Sexism against men just isn’t as badly protested. I hope this was coherent. ---
**Author:** ![Sivalensis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c4cdca/32.png) [@Sivalensis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sivalensis)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/47 "2003-01-10T23:45:12Z")
ok so while I was writing all that, incubus wrote two sentences that explained it all that much better 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/48 "2003-01-10T23:58:10Z")
Could anything be less worth getting your panties in a bunch than _Sally forth_? I mean could a comic strip get any blander? At least _The Family Circus_ is sometimes surreal, especially if you make up your own _disfunctional Family Circus_ style captions. Fortunately S.F. has been voted off the Phoenix Republic comics page but homeboy Bil Keane will be there until he dies at least. FWIW the only comic I can remember being as bland as the OP topic was _Winky Ryatt_. Anyone remember that? ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2003, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/49 "2003-01-11T00:08:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Padeye \* > \*\*Could anything be less worth getting your panties in a bunch than _Sally forth_? \*\* How does this work? Does every OP in the pit mean that someone is “getting their panties in a bunch”? Is Green Bean getting her panties in a bunch over a pickle (could anything be less worth…and will you tell her so?) Is OpalCat getting her panties in a bunch over a stupid Pop Up Ad (and will you tell her so?) Is Joel getting his panties in a bunch over Viagra knock off ads (and will you tell him so?) etc… ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2003, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/50 "2003-01-11T00:24:29Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Feynn \* > \*\*I read a few weeks worth of the strip and can now give it my semi professional critique… > > It sucks some serious ass. The whole “men are dumb” schtick is old and lame and should just be put down. > > Sam Waterson… we need you man. \*\* > [@](#): > > And when they grab you with those metal claws, you can’t break free… because they’re made of metal, and robots are strong. Now, for only $4 a month, you can achieve peace of mind in a world full of grime and robots, with Old Glory Insurance. So, don’t cower under your afghan any longer. Make a choice. Old Glory Insurance. For when the metal ones decide to come for you - and they will. ---
**Author:** ![Tamex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ccd318/32.png) [@Tamex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamex)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2003, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/51 "2003-01-11T06:12:05Z")
Sally Forth’s husband is often portrayed as a helpless idjit. This is by no means new territory for the strip. However, this series actually reminded me of the SDMB. Wasn’t there a thread a while ago where someone wanted advice on how to convince their co-worker to see the doctor? The man was complaining of stomach pain (among other things), and all his co-workers were saying, “See a doctor!” and he utterly refused. A few days later, the OP came back to announce that the man was dead. So, if Sally’s boss ends up dead, imagine the lesson that would teach all you silly men out there :rolleyes:. I’m a woman, and I hate going to the doctor. I bet that if the Pill were non-prescription, you’d have a harder time getting women to see the doctor regularly, too. For more interesting entertainment, watch for the “88” on Sally’s husband’s sweatshirt. (For those of you who don’t know, “88” is skinhead slang for “Heil Hitler” and the cause of a big recall at Target this summer. When the “88” appeared on Sally’s husband’s sweatshirt this fall, it spawned an amazingly long and detailed thread on rec.arts.comics.strips. Usually, we only get threads like that on whether it was deceitful or just stupid of Deanna in “For Better or For Worse” (a pharmacist, BTW) to switch birth control pill brands just before their honeymoon without telling Mike. “Sally Forth” rarely sparks such controversy.) ---
**Author:** ![blowero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@blowero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/blowero)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2003, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/52 "2003-01-11T08:35:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by beagledave \* > How does this work? Does every OP in the pit mean that someone is “getting their panties in a bunch”? Perhaps there’s some sort of Godwin-style general principle at work here. Something like: anyone posting a rant in the BBQ Pit will invariably be accused of getting his/her panties in a bunch after _n_ posts? > [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Padeye_ > FWIW the only comic I can remember being as bland as the OP topic was Winky Ryatt. Anyone remember that? I vote for Marmaduke. That rascal, always getting in trouble, yuk, yuk.:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![ratty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ccd318/32.png) [@ratty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratty)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2003, 9:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/53 "2003-01-11T09:26:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Arden Ranger \* > \*\*Heh. My first thought upon seeing the thread title was “What a bizarre battle cry.” > > Of course, it’s probably just me. \*\* Will you marry me? I just almost wet myself laughing at this. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2003, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/54 "2003-01-11T18:16:38Z")
Yeah, men are less likely to see a doctor everytime they have an ache or pain. It would be a good thing for women to goad them into going. We might live longer. The comic strip is condescending, but has more than a grain of truth. Men have a way of understimating the extent that women keep us alive. ---
**Author:** ![Michael\_Ellis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/977dab/32.png) [@Michael\_Ellis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael_Ellis)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2003, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/55 "2003-01-11T21:01:24Z")
[Hijack] I’m writing a novel where one of the characters is named Sally Forth. [/Hijack] Carry on. ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2003, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/56 "2003-01-12T02:45:17Z")
I can’t even jump into a pit rant the right way. Okay, _Sally Forth_ is worth getting your panties in a bunch over it’s incredible badness but IMHO not for it’s political statements. Now let me get my panties out of my ass and get some dinner. ---
**Author:** ![Mac\_Guffin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2bfe46/32.png) [@Mac\_Guffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mac_Guffin)\ **Post date:** [January 13, 2003, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766/57 "2003-01-13T01:07:37Z")
You keep your dinner in your ASS? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sally-forth-men-are-helpless-idjits/147766.md?page=2)