# Same sex marriage to be signed into law by end of the week in the UK **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 15, 2013, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572 "2013-07-15T17:13:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/1 "2013-07-15T17:13:53Z")
[The bill has just sailed through the House of Lords](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10180552/Gay-marriage-clears-the-House-of-Lords.html), which means after a perfunctory debate tomorrow in the Commons (which has already voted heavily in favour), the bill is expected to be put before the Queen for her signature by the end of the week. We’ve done it at last. Just wanted to put a little ‘woop’ out there. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/2 "2013-07-15T17:28:43Z")
Woop, indeed! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/3 "2013-07-15T17:39:48Z")
Absolutely awesome. I was doing some research the other day that involved miscegenation laws and was talking to someone who is in his 70s. He said he was astonished to look back and realize that Loving v. Virginia was within his lifetime (the US Supreme Court case that declared bans on interracial marriage to be unconstitutional). My hope is that when I’m his age, I’ll look back and be amazed SSM was banned for a large chunk of my lifetime, and that younger people will say “How could they even have justified such a ban?” ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/4 "2013-07-15T18:01:29Z")
_Assented to_ not signed into law. I am certain that this bill is significantly more unimportant that the Scottish Militia Bill. ---
**Author:** ![DMark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@DMark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DMark)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/5 "2013-07-15T18:03:38Z")
Damn…if this had happened back in my younger years, perhaps I would be a member of the Royal Family now! Still - better late than never! So, now we just wait until a real member of the Royal Family marries a same sex partner…won’t that be a moment to remember! Congrats to the UK! ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/6 "2013-07-15T18:06:27Z")
Does this mean that the Church of England is required to perform same-sex marriages as well, or is this purely in the secular realm? ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/7 "2013-07-15T18:39:51Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Does this mean that the Church of England is required to perform same-sex marriages as well, or is this purely in the secular realm? The CoE is specifically _not_ permitted to perform SSM under the legislation. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/8 "2013-07-15T19:16:57Z")
Good, that “separate but equal” stuff blows goats. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/9 "2013-07-15T21:13:49Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > Good, that “separate but equal” stuff blows goats. Well according to opponents, blowing goats is what is the next step. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/10 "2013-07-15T22:52:36Z")
Note the Marriage (Same-Sex Couples) Bill only applies in [England & Wales](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same-sex_marriage_in_England_and_Wales#Same-sex_marriage_bill_in_Scotland), the Scottish government is preparing it’s own bill and Northern Ireland is sticking with civil partnerships. ---
**Author:** ![ctnguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@ctnguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ctnguy)\ **Post date:** [July 15, 2013, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/11 "2013-07-15T23:57:37Z")
A nitpick regarding the title: the bill will be submitted to Her Majesty this week, but from what I’ve been hearing in the media the Assent probably won’t be granted until after the summer recess. Not that it matters particularly, since it won’t come into effect until sometime in 2014 anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Silophant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a698b9/32.png) [@Silophant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silophant)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2013, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/12 "2013-07-16T00:21:27Z")
> [@PaulParkhead](#): > > The CoE is specifically _not_ permitted to perform SSM under the legislation. Why is this? The law that recently passed in Minnesota, and, by my understanding, most other American laws as well, have provisions specifically excusing churches from having to perform SSM, but any more liberal churches that want to certainly can. ---
**Author:** ![PaulParkhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@PaulParkhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PaulParkhead)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2013, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/13 "2013-07-16T01:53:44Z")
> [@Silophant](#): > > Why is this? The law that recently passed in Minnesota, and, by my understanding, most other American laws as well, have provisions specifically excusing churches from having to perform SSM, but any more liberal churches that want to certainly can. It’s because the CoE is the established church. They pretty much have to marry anyone who asks to be married. So as a sop to the CoE, they get to avoid the issue by being prohibited from solemnising SSMs. Other churches may do gay marriages if they wish, or not if they prefer. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2013, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/14 "2013-07-16T06:54:31Z")
> [@alphaboi867](#): > > Note the Marriage (Same-Sex Couples) Bill only applies in [England & Wales](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same-sex_marriage_in_England_and_Wales#Same-sex_marriage_bill_in_Scotland), the Scottish government is preparing it’s own bill and Northern Ireland is sticking with civil partnerships. Yes, good point, should have been specific. Northern Ireland is waaaay too wrapped up in religion to consider it. I’m surprised Alex Salmond didn’t push it through parliament sooner so he could show how much cooler Scotland is than England. ---
**Author:** ![rosetta\_stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8c91f0/32.png) [@rosetta\_stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rosetta_stone)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2013, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/15 "2013-07-16T07:00:53Z")
> [@SanVito](#): > > [The bill has just sailed through the House of Lords](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10180552/Gay-marriage-clears-the-House-of-Lords.html), which means after a perfunctory debate tomorrow in the Commons (which has already voted heavily in favour), the bill is expected to be put before the Queen for her signature by the end of the week. > > We’ve done it at last. Just wanted to put a little ‘woop’ out there. 🙂 good news. Nice to see equality applied in some countries. ---
**Author:** ![Malden\_Capell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malden_capell/32/5274_2.png) [@Malden\_Capell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malden_Capell)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2013, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/16 "2013-07-16T21:29:47Z")
Very glad! Not least because we’ve been having large groups of pros and antis outside my office playing very, very loud music (on loop) for days on end. This should put an end to it! ---
**Author:** ![ctnguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@ctnguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ctnguy)\ **Post date:** [July 16, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/17 "2013-07-16T21:34:26Z")
As expected, [the Commons have accepted the Lords’ amendments](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23338279), so the bill now goes to Her Majesty for the Royal Assent. ---
**Author:** ![Malden\_Capell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malden_capell/32/5274_2.png) [@Malden\_Capell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malden_Capell)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2013, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/18 "2013-07-17T14:25:48Z")
It has just been announced that the Queen has signed Her Assent to the Bill. La Reine le veult! ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2013, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/19 "2013-07-17T15:14:32Z")
> [@Silophant](#): > > Why is this? The law that recently passed in Minnesota, and, by my understanding, most other American laws as well, have provisions specifically excusing churches from having to perform SSM, but any more liberal churches that want to certainly can. To quote the BBC in more detail: > [@](#): > > **Why are the Anglican Churches not included?** > Ministers had already stated that legislation allowing same-sex marriages in England and Wales would not compel any religious organisation to conduct such marriages. Culture Secretary Maria Miller said the Church of England and the (Anglican) Church in Wales had stated their strong opposition to same-sex marriages. But they are not the only religious organisations to have done so. The legal ban may have the effect of protecting the Church of England from legal claims that as the Established Church it is bound to marry anyone who requests it. > > **What assurances have been provided for religious organisations?** > > Mrs Miller has promised a “quadruple lock” for religious groups who oppose gay marriage, involving: > > - No religious organisation or individual minister being compelled to marry same-sex couples or to permit this to happen on their premises > - Making it unlawful for religious organisations or their ministers to marry same-sex couples unless their organisation’s governing body has expressly opted in to provisions for doing so > - Amending the 2010 Equality Act to ensure no discrimination claim can be brought against religious organisations or individual ministers for refusing to marry a same-sex couple > - The legislation explicitly stating that it will be illegal for the Church of England and the Church in Wales to marry same-sex couples > > **What has this got to do with the Church of England’s status as the official state church?** > The Church of England is the established church in England - its own Canon Law is part of the law of the land. One of its canons states that marriage is in its nature a union of “one man and one woman”. This will remain in force, says the government. The Church had warned that, had Parliament changed the definition of marriage, this could have called into question the “status and effect of the canonical provisions that set out the Church’s doctrine of marriage as being between one man and one woman”. The government would thus have been overlooking “the implications of what is proposed for the position of the established Church”. > > **Could the legalisation of gay marriage have led to the disestablishment of the Church?** > > The Church had warned that it could. If the legal position ended up so that same-sex marriage could no longer be limited to civil ceremonies, it says, “the whole range of rights and duties that exist in relation to marriage and the Church of England would have to be re-examined”. “The ultimate outcome for both Church and State would be quite uncertain,” it says. > > **Where do other Churches and religions stand on the issue?** > > The vice-president of the Catholic Bishops’ Conference of England and Wales, Archbishop Peter Smith, had said in response to the government’s consultation: “In the interest of upholding the uniqueness of marriage as a civil institution for the common good of society, we strongly urge the government not to proceed with legislative proposals which will enable all couples, regardless of their gender, to have a civil marriage ceremony.” > > Following the government’s initial announcement of its outline plans on 11 December, the archbishop, along with Archbishop Vincent Nichols, the leader of the Roman Catholic Church in England and Wales, said opponents of gay marriage should lobby MPs “clearly, calmly and forcefully, and without impugning the motives of others”. > > The Muslim Council of Great Britain has said it is against the proposals, calling them “unnecessary and unhelpful”. > > Among Jews, The Liberal and Reform synagogues support gay marriage while the United synagogue opposes it. Chief Rabbi Lord Sacks, meanwhile, has yet to comment on the proposals. > > Lord Singh, head of the Network of Sikh Organisations, has said gay marriage would “dilute” the definition of marriage in religious scriptures. > > Quakers have campaigned in favour of same-sex marriage and will allow ceremonies to take place on their premises. What I find amazing is that the Lords’ amendments actually pushed the bill a little further, dealing with ensuring that pension schemes appropriately address SSM arrangements, providing for a review of whether humanist weddings are legal (which they are not currently IIRC) and allowing transexuals to remain legally married (i.e. if a man married to a woman undergoes an MTF change, the marriage would continue to be legally recognized even though it was now between two women). The Lords has a reputation for being stuffy and reactionary but actually they frequently are a progressive force where the Commons are more cautious. In addition, note that while the majority of the opposition in the Commons was from the Conservatives, Cameron and a minority of Tories supported the bills (as did the Lib Dems and Labour). ---
**Author:** ![ctnguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@ctnguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ctnguy)\ **Post date:** [July 17, 2013, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572/20 "2013-07-17T15:32:53Z")
> [@ctnguy](#): > > A nitpick regarding the title: the bill will be submitted to Her Majesty this week, but from what I’ve been hearing in the media the Assent probably won’t be granted until after the summer recess. Clearly, and happily, I was wrong about this. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/same-sex-marriage-to-be-signed-into-law-by-end-of-the-week-in-the-uk/663572.md?page=2)