# San Fran might rename 44 schools **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [December 15, 2020, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110 "2020-12-15T17:05:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/101 "2020-12-16T18:42:52Z")
This is parody, right? Your link says that Biden said that “defund the police” was a bad idea. Eta: my bad, I was looking at the snipped quote. Went back to the original and it all made a lot more sense! ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/102 "2020-12-16T18:44:42Z")
Nvm… ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/103 "2020-12-16T18:46:06Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > So let’s not idolize any of them. I would be fine not naming things after them. But it is Ok to name the School after my Great Grandfather then? Look, naming things after people dont mean they were perfect. No Mortal being is. It is just a way of honoring them for their accomplishments, while ignoring their foibles. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/104 "2020-12-16T18:47:10Z")
I don’t know your grandpa. Did he hold slaves, or talk about how black people were subhuman? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/105 "2020-12-16T18:49:27Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Lincoln didn’t own slaves, but if a black kid asks “how is it appropriate for me to go to a school named after a man who would be horrified to see me in the same room as the white kids because he doesn’t consider me human?” I don’t have a good answer. Do you? Lincoln didnt consider black people human? True, in his early days he didnt consider them equal to whites, but his attitude changed. And he treated them as equals, with respect. > **[Lincoln & Race: The Great Emancipator didn't advocate racial equality....](https://www.nprillinois.org/statehouse/2004-02-01/lincoln-race-the-great-emancipator-didnt-advocate-racial-equality-but-was-he-a-racist)** > > Was Abraham Lincoln, the “Great Emancipator,” a racist?In recent years, some writers and scholars have argued that he was. They have reduced the… ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/106 "2020-12-16T18:53:52Z")
True, but by 1863, when meeting Frederick Douglass, his attitude had changed. [http://www.asjournal.org/53-2009/abraham-lincolns-attitudes-on-slavery-and-race/](http://www.asjournal.org/53-2009/abraham-lincolns-attitudes-on-slavery-and-race/) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/107 "2020-12-16T18:54:33Z")
Not, it is not. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/108 "2020-12-16T18:55:22Z")
Are you seriously arguing that 88 is never used as code for heil Hitler? ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/109 "2020-12-16T18:56:38Z")
What are the limits of context? Historical? Geographical? Cultural? If Bob the racist is raised in a family with racist ideas and lives in a community where racism is tolerated, is his guilt less than Sue the racist who was raised in a more enlightened environment? Where do we draw the line? It seems to me that we need to spend the effort to understand history not simply by solely glorifying or demonizing those who made it. By putting a name on a building or placing a statue in a town square, we rarely tell the whole story and often misrepresent difficult truth by elevating sanitizing myth. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/110 "2020-12-16T18:57:28Z")
He didnt own slaves, but you see, all we really know is that: He donated the land for the school, and he fought for the Union repairing railroads. He was known for his cursing, that is about it. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/111 "2020-12-16T18:58:53Z")
I dont have any great objection to a school being named after him, but if people who attend the school did, or if they just came up with a better name, I’d be all for it. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/112 "2020-12-16T18:59:59Z")
another neo Nazi code is 14 words which stands for **We must secure the existence of our people and a future for white children** ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/113 "2020-12-16T19:02:09Z")
You didnt say “Among a small group of slope headed semi-illiterate red necked racists, 88 is sometimes a code for Heil Hitler”. 88 is generally “code” for the keys on a piano 99.99% of the time. Just like after 4chan whoosed all the SJW a few racist picked up the upside down OK sign. However, the Ok sign means- OK 99.99% of the time. Let us not let a tiny handful of racists determine how we use our language. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/114 "2020-12-16T19:03:40Z")
🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄 ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/115 "2020-12-16T19:05:09Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > And 88 is not an evil number, but some people do use it to mean “heil Hitler”. Does Germany remove the number 88 from public discourse? If 88 branches of McDonald’s close down, will the German media cover up the story to avoid saying the number 88? If not, wtf are you talking about? From earlier. It would be nice if you made an effort to debate the posts in the thread rather than strawmen you make up. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/116 "2020-12-16T19:09:54Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > while ignoring their foibles Foibles? Racism isn’t a foible. Also, let’s not ignore faults, in any context, when we recognize accomplishments. I’d be fine not naming anything after your grandfather. Most of our grandparents probably had huge faults without having the notable accomplishments of the people we are talking about. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/117 "2020-12-16T19:11:32Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Racism isn’t a foible. You are right-Racism _isn’t_ a foible- today. But a hundred & fifty years ago, it was. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/118 "2020-12-16T19:12:15Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > You are right-Racism _isn’t_ a foible- today. But a hundred & fifty years ago, it was Exactly the kind of historical whitewashing we want to avoid, thank you for the demonstration ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/119 "2020-12-16T19:17:47Z")
It’s not “whitewashing” is is the simple fact that was is considered wrong today, wasnt wrong yesterday. We now look down on smokers, but it was a common vice just 50 years ago, and it’s not rare today. Just about everyone was racist 100 years ago. Holding what was normal & common then against them is “presentism”= judging people of the past by todays standards. And presentism is just as wrong as racism. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2020, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110/120 "2020-12-16T19:18:38Z")
I still don’t see where he said it, but whatever. I also never saw Obama say it. Seems pretty O/T for this thread, though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/san-fran-might-rename-44-schools/928110.md?page=7)