# Sandra Bland video **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 22, 2015, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859 "2015-07-22T05:50:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 90
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1781 "2015-08-17T14:19:02Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Of course you do. I’m inviting you to discuss this particular aspect of the issue; you’re free to disregard my invitation and continue your own way. > > Yes: that happens on the SDMB on days that end in ‘y’. > > Yes, for the purposes of this discussion, I absolutely concede that point. > > Well, we could drag in Maslow’s hierarchy of needs and speculate about which needs are met by which of those systems, I suppose. But you’ve already observed the willingness of many people to reject clear law in favor of repeating their own assertions about what the law is, as though repetition could transform fact. How much more unconstrained would such a rhetor be if I engaged in a discussion like that, where there are fewer, if any, objectively provable facts? > > No, I decline to speculate about the reasons for a family to support, or fail to support, one of its members. > > The standards used at the jail, in contrast, is a subject at least nominally grounded in provable assertions. (post compressed) I have been discussing this particular aspect (family support) of the Bland issue. Others have objected to my discussing this particular aspect. Such is life. I admire your tenacity in sticking to the legal aspects of the various threads that you chose to participate in. Keep up the good work. We both agree that the actions of the Bland family, and Sandra’s interpretation of those actions, may have had some effect on her fatal decision. I agree with you that stopping Bland’s vehicle, and the subsequent arrest of Bland, was lawful. If other people object to the stop or arrest, they owe it to themselves to find out which statues are applicable. If other people object to how Bland was stopped or arrested, they still need to understand the statue, plus court rulings, in order to understand how they were applied to Bland. Their choice. “We” didn’t drag the evils of family life and suburbia into this thread. **up\_the\_junction** did. Maybe **up\_the\_junction** wishes to discuss Maslow but I suspect he’s trying to avoid a dicussion that doesn’t include automatic condemnation of all police officers, all the time. IMHO, of course. I intend to speculate about the reasons for a family to support/not support one of it’s habitually troubled members. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1782 "2015-08-17T14:22:07Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I believe the Bland family is on record as not believing Sandra committed suicide, since she was starting a new job. So the family did not think she was suicidal, but apparently the jail administration should have know anyway. > > Regards, > Shodan I believe that Bland family is also on record as saying that the police murdered Sandra Bland. Let the civil suits begin. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1783 "2015-08-17T16:47:29Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Eggs-actly. Nobody knew this would be such a fateful weekend for Ms Bland. From a legal standpoint, should everyone in jail be under observation 24/7? From a moral standpoint, should family members be expected to immediately stop what they’re doing and ride to the rescue every time a troubled family member repeatedly gets into trouble? > > The Bland family knew Sandra Bland’s troubled mind better than the arresting officer or jail personal did. ? But the Bland family, in addition to reasonably not wanting to take this problem on that weekend, may have believed that she would be unable to kill herself while in “custody.” Their non action does not indicate a lack of sensitivity about her state of mind. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1784 "2015-08-17T16:51:02Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > But the Bland family, in addition to reasonably not wanting to take this problem on that weekend, may have believed that she would be unable to kill herself while in “custody.” Their non action does not indicate a lack of sensitivity about her state of mind. They denied that she was in a suicidal state of mind. Therefore, leaving her in jail probably was not based on any estimate of her suicide risk. Or, what is more likely, which is that her family is in denial about her death, and this has shaped their public statements about their daughter. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1785 "2015-08-17T17:21:45Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > ? > But the Bland family, in addition to reasonably not wanting to take this problem on that weekend, may have believed that she would be unable to kill herself while in “custody.” Their non action does not indicate a lack of sensitivity about her state of mind. You consider it reasonable. I do not. If my brother or daughter were to ever request that I bail them out of jail, that request would become my highest priority. You, and the Bland family, may have different priorities, based on your family experiences, of course. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1786 "2015-08-17T19:36:13Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > You consider it reasonable. I do not. > > If my brother or daughter were to ever request that I bail them out of jail, that request would become my highest priority. You, and the Bland family, may have different priorities, based on your family experiences, of course. I haven’t been in the situation but I reason that you can’t bail someone out a number of times without at some point failing to do it because of logistics or just teaching them a lesson. I don’t see how they fail as a family or didn’t love her because of that. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1787 "2015-08-17T19:55:45Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Just to clarify, are you saying you don’t understand why I include the Bland family’s actions in a thread concerning Bland’s arrest and subsequent personal choice of suicide or do you simply object to someone discussing any possible reason for Bland’s that do not include the usual condemnation/lie that the sheriff who arrested Bland must have murdered her? To whom are you referring with the “usual”…anyone in this thread? Granted, it’s a long thread. And it contains a lot of people arguing, often with great intensity. But have any of them posted that the arresting officer “must have murdered her”…? If not, to what are you referring with your claim that statements to that effect are “usual”? ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1788 "2015-08-17T21:40:20Z")
**BobLibDem** was nice enough to link an article in this thread. Post #11 on 07-22-2015, at 06:55 AM - For reference purposes only - > [@BobLibDem](#): > > There is a [new warning sign](http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/07/21/1404253/-Someone-put-up-a-new-warning-sign-for-motorists-in-the-town-where-Sandra-Bland-was-arrested) in the area. > [@Sherrerd](#): > > To whom are you referring with the “usual”…anyone in this thread? > > Granted, it’s a long thread. And it contains a lot of people arguing, often with great intensity. > > But have any of them posted that the arresting officer “must have murdered her”…? > > If not, to what are you referring with your claim that statements to that effect are “usual”? What was that new warning sign? SIGNAL LANE CHANGE OR SHERIFF MAY KILL YOU The blood thirsty posters who regularly condemn police officers on dailykos qualify as “the usual”. It’s not difficult to search this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1789 "2015-08-17T21:46:41Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > To whom are you referring with the “usual”…anyone in this thread? > > Granted, it’s a long thread. And it contains a lot of people arguing, often with great intensity. > > But have any of them posted that the arresting officer “must have murdered her”…? Well, there’s these… > [@watchwolf49](#): > > Killed the poor girl over a cigarette … > [@Kobal2](#): > > “A woman” happened to be a vocal police misconduct activist that could have publicized the bullshit she’d just went through, sued and/or gotten the arresting officer fired on the spot. So there’s that, if the possibility of “racist cop(s) lynching uppity nigger” just seem too impossible to contemplate. For some reason. This being rural Texas and all. > [@BobLibDem](#): > > Questions abound. Why did she have to put out her cigarette for a lousy traffic stop? THAT was worth pulling her out of the car for? Why would this be a lawful order? The dashcam video has some quirks. I think that needs to go to the FBI for recovery or reconstruction. Was the autopsy done properly? Could they tell a hanging from strangulation by others? Did they properly document with photographs? The jail video- we don’t see Bland. We see people coming and going. Who’s to say that they weren’t the killers? And that’s just the first page. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1790 "2015-08-17T21:51:08Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I haven’t been in the situation but I reason that you can’t bail someone out a number of times without at some point failing to do it because of logistics or just teaching them a lesson. I don’t see how they fail as a family or didn’t love her because of that. Ah-hem, HOW would SANDRA bland REACT to THE failure OF her FAMILY to BAIL her OUT of JAIL? It’s Sandra’s reaction to her family’s action that’s important. Would the failure of her family to post her bail have had any effect on Bland’s mental wellbeing? Would it make her happy/grumpy/sleepy/bashful/sneezy/dopey? ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1791 "2015-08-17T22:06:56Z")
To both doorhinge and Smapti: You yourselves _both_ admit that the examples you’ve been able to come up with appear on the first page–in other words, right after the video was released. (Nearly a month ago, now). This does not support the contention that it’s “usual” to assert that “the sheriff who arrested Bland must have murdered her”–\* Support for doorhinge’s assertion would more properly include examples more recent than the 22 July release-date for the dashcam video (which prompted this thread). - –(these being a direct quotation from doorhinge’s post #1778, linked to in my post #1787 to which you both replied). ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2015, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1792 "2015-08-17T22:21:50Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > To both doorhinge and Smapti: You yourselves _both_ admit that the examples you’ve been able to come up with appear on the first page–in other words, right after the video was released. (Nearly a month ago, now). > > This does not support the contention that it’s “usual” to assert that “the sheriff who arrested Bland must have murdered her”–\* > > Support for doorhinge’s assertion would more properly include examples more recent than the 22 July release-date for the dashcam video (which prompted this thread). > > - –(these being a direct quotation from doorhinge’s post #1778, linked to in my post #1787 to which you both replied). And you’d be wrong. You asked to what I was referring. Eye responded. Ewe don’t like the answer. That doesn’t change my reason. ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1793 "2015-08-18T04:56:50Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Just to clarify, are you saying you don’t understand why I include the Bland family’s actions in a thread concerning Bland’s arrest and subsequent personal choice of suicide or do you simply object to someone discussing any possible reason for Bland’s that do not include the usual condemnation/lie that the sheriff who arrested Bland must have murdered her? I meant exactly what I said. I really don’t understand what point you’re trying to make about Bland’s suicide. Yes, maybe not getting bailed out right away added to her depression, but something something Bland’s family didn’t love her? ---
**Author:** ![camille](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/22d042/32.png) [@camille](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/camille)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1794 "2015-08-18T05:12:16Z")
> [@cmyk](#): > > I meant exactly what I said. I really don’t understand what point you’re trying to make about Bland’s suicide. > > Yes, maybe not getting bailed out right away added to her depression, but something something Bland’s family didn’t love her? I think it’s clear. It’s the same point **Terr** stressed earlier. He wants to make sure we know _they’re not like him_. _He_ would have made someone in his family a priority. _They_ are _different_. If only _they_ were more like **doorhinge** , and you know, _people like him_, maybe this wouldn’t have happened at all. ---
**Author:** ![Gent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gent)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1795 "2015-08-18T12:40:28Z")
People continue to focus on the wrong aspect of this story. This young lady tragically took her own life. Coupling her irrational behavior toward the police officer involved, her past action toward a security guard, and a Facebook post in which she mentioned PTS, mental illness was a glaring factor. We need to do more as a country to identify and treat mental illness. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1796 "2015-08-18T13:10:38Z")
Heard this on the [morning news](http://www.khou.com/story/news/2015/08/17/special-prosecutors-take-over-sandra-bland-case/31888267/): > [@](#): > > The Waller County District Attorney has repeatedly spoken of the need for transparency in the case involving Sandra Bland. As a result, five special prosecutors have been appointed to the case. > > The private sector attorneys were all sworn in Monday. The group includes two African-American individuals and one woman. They will be investigating her arrest & her treatment in jail. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1797 "2015-08-18T14:06:11Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Ah-hem, HOW would SANDRA bland REACT to THE failure OF her FAMILY to BAIL her OUT of JAIL? It’s Sandra’s reaction to her family’s action that’s important. > > Would the failure of her family to post her bail have had any effect on Bland’s mental wellbeing? Would it make her happy/grumpy/sleepy/bashful/sneezy/dopey? When you point fingers it only leads back to you. When you shout you are protesting too much, about yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 2:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1798 "2015-08-18T14:39:41Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > To both doorhinge and Smapti: You yourselves _both_ admit that the examples you’ve been able to come up with appear on the first page–in other words, right after the video was released. (Nearly a month ago, now). > > This does not support the contention that it’s “usual” to assert that “the sheriff who arrested Bland must have murdered her”–\* > > Support for doorhinge’s assertion would more properly include examples more recent than the 22 July release-date for the dashcam video (which prompted this thread). > > - –(these being a direct quotation from doorhinge’s post #1778, linked to in my post #1787 to which you both replied). Perhaps **doorhinge** is referring to the fact that claims of murder were made at the beginning of the debate and never retracted. It seems to me that you regard the fact that the people who made those claims have simply stopped making them as sufficient to claim that they have conceded the point. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1799 "2015-08-18T15:05:51Z")
> [@camille](#): > > I think it’s clear. It’s the same point **Terr** stressed earlier. > > He wants to make sure we know _they’re not like him_. _He_ would have made someone in his family a priority. _They_ are _different_. If only _they_ were more like **doorhinge** , and you know, _people like him_, maybe this wouldn’t have happened at all. And you’d be wrong. An entertaining mind reader, but wrong. Sandra Bland committed suicide. Bland committed suicide to end whatever personal pain she was suffering from. You can try to understand why Bland committed suicide, or you can try to blame the sheriff, the jail personnel, and me, or you can make stuff up in order to participate in the thread. Either way, it’s always nice to hear from you. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2015, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859/1800 "2015-08-18T15:16:05Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > When you point fingers it only leads back to you. When you shout you are protesting too much, about yourself. Interesting. BTW, you forgot to answer my questions. Would the failure of her family to post her bail have had any effect on Bland’s mental wellbeing? Would it make her happy/grumpy/sleepy/bashful/sneezy/dopey? FYI - From an anatomical viewpoint, when you point fingers, plural, the fingers are not pointing back to you. But I think I understand what you were trying to say. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859.md?page=89) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sandra-bland-video/725859.md?page=91)