# Sarah Palin proven right! Government tricks beautiful young mom; imposes 1st Death Panel Verdict **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 12, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888 "2010-04-12T22:18:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/201 "2010-04-13T19:54:53Z")
> [@niblet\_head](#): > > Hey, now. Show some respect, **Euphonious**. **SA** is sooooo busy. So very, very busy. He’ll get back to you when he can. When he does, I hope he’ll address the fact that the example in his link happened under the current system that Republicans want to keep rather than the new system that has not come into effect yet. I mean, how can this example be confirmation of Palin’s “death panel” remark, when the changes to health care have not even occurred yet? ETA: **Starving Artist** , care to weigh in on this if you’re not too busy? ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/202 "2010-04-13T20:00:23Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Speaking as one knowledgeable about 9 year olds receiving sex education in the classroom… > > I can assure your from my anecdotal knowledge, that if a 9 year old “tried to get it on” with an 8 year old after hearing how babies are made… > > I would advise a psychological counselling session. 100% of the boys in my son’s class reacted to the sex ed in two ways: “meh” or “yuck”. To react the way **SA** did is, IMHO, aberrant. > > SA, just because you are wired in a screwed up way does not mean the rest of the population is equally screwed up. As someone who works in juvenile court with sex abuse victims (and juvenile perpetrators) on a near-daily basis, THIS. This sort of behavior is NOT NORMAL. To fight anecdote with anecdote, I looked up “sex” in the encyclopedia when I was 8 years old, out of natural curiosity. I had absolutely no desire to actually try it with anyone at that point. None of the kids who looked it up with me felt the need to try it with one another either. If I heard, in my line of work, of a kid who did what **Starving Artist** did, it would probably be enough to get a mandatory court case opened on the kid in order to get him into sex offender treatment. Yes, as a nine-year-old. The system takes that shit seriously. Charges would not be filed due to his age, but Children Services would likely get involved to monitor the situation. Seriously, I’ve read some fucked up shit from SA, but that little bit takes the cake. ---
**Author:** ![CannyDan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cannydan/32/548_2.png) [@CannyDan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CannyDan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/203 "2010-04-13T20:01:54Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > \ **Starving Artist** , care to weigh in on this if you’re not too busy? Wait for it. He’s wracking his brain for another anecdote. He’ll be back with something making all his former stupidity shine like brilliance in comparison. Trust me. ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/204 "2010-04-13T20:29:18Z")
When Bush was governor of Texas, he brought death panels to Texas: [section 166.046 of the Texas Health and Safety Code](http://www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us/Docs/HS/htm/HS.166.htm#166.046). This makes for a self-fulfilling prophecy. The radical right do not want government involvement in health care because if a radical right party were in power that party would institute death panels, as Bush did in Texas. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/205 "2010-04-13T23:25:51Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > Seriously, I’ve read some fucked up shit from SA, but that little bit takes the cake. Oh, I’m fairly convinced it was total bullshit. He was just trying to make us understand what librul ideas (sex ed, porn) do to a 1950’s version of Moral Orel. If it did that to a paragon like **him** , what do you think is going on with the depraved youth of today? -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/206 "2010-04-14T00:10:32Z")
But you know, if it’s true, and if the sex talk made him eager to try and fuck everybody else all the time, it’s no wonder he ended up with the politics he’s got. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/207 "2010-04-14T00:12:47Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Oh, I’m fairly convinced it was total bullshit. He was just trying to make us understand what librul ideas (sex ed, porn) do to a 1950’s version of Moral Orel. If it did that to a paragon like **him** , what do you think is going on with the depraved youth of today? Even assuming the story is entirely true, and went down exactly as he said it did (memories can get a bit fuzzy after 50 years), it really doesn’t tell us anything about the desirability of sex education. If we were talking about whether Polio vaccinations should be mandatory, and someone tells us a sob story about their cousin having an allergic reaction and dying, what should we make of it? We can’t draw a conclusion about it just from one story, we’ve got to look at the larger picture. If the statistics say that Polio vaccine will save 100 kids for every 1 that it kills, then on balance it is worth it despite the risk of an allergic reaction. If sex education can be shown to confer a net benefit by reducing STDs and teen pregnancy, it may be worth it even if a very small minority of children react like Starving Artist did. ---
**Author:** ![Canadjun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/76d3ee/32.png) [@Canadjun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Canadjun)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/208 "2010-04-14T00:20:10Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > :smack: > What is wrong with you people? Yeah, the government took control after she raised a stink and got the media involved. Here’s yet another example of how I can’t believe how some of you think. What if an insurance company had told this woman that because of some technicality she was unaware of they were going to deny the life-saving surgery she was scheduled soon to receive, and then when presented with her offer to bring things back in line so she could her surgery, they told her it was “too late” to change anything? And then what if she publicized that response and got politicians and hugely popular talk show hosts to go to bat for her, with the result that, hey, guess what, the insurance company is now taking pains to make sure she got her surgery as scheduled. I thought insurance companies did that sort of thing all the time in your neck of the woods, as well as increasing premiums or simply dropping you if you get sick, making doctors argue with insurance companies so their patients get the care they need, and so on? Thanks, but I’ll take Canada’s UHC in preference to your system any day. And no, we don’t have death panels. By the way, I know that I am only one example, but I’ve had three hospital stays in the past two years (one 5 months, one 6 weeks, and one 10 weeks), all including plastic surgery, for an extremely persistent and deep pressure sore. I got lots of homecare nursing as well in between hospital stays. I’m not bankrupt. Yes, I like UHC! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/209 "2010-04-14T00:29:07Z")
Show-off. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/210 "2010-04-14T00:31:16Z")
I love the complete miss. The “death panel’ thing was made up by” Mooselinis" staff who were referring to end of life consultations. The idea was to pay doctors for a long consultation providing the end of life information they need to make a good decision. Doctors provide the hospice option info, pain managemen info , and all the other options. It takes time and it was thought that they should be allowed to take the time necessary and get paid for it. How Palin got that stupid concept of death panels to catch on is a mystery. ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/211 "2010-04-14T00:37:14Z")
Another battle of the anecdotes: My parents showed me a documentary on sexual reproduction when I was 7. I knew even more than Starving Artist learned by fumbling through books when he was 9. I could tell you what sexual intercourse was, and where babies come from. I didn’t respond by becoming sex crazed. In fact, I didn’t even kiss anyone until after I was 21. ---
**Author:** ![Kolga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e56c9b/32.png) [@Kolga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolga)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/212 "2010-04-14T01:10:11Z")
Another anecdote: My mom and I read a book together that was called “How to talk about sex with your 6-year-old” that she’d gotten from the doctor’s office, when I was…a little younger than 6 (how about that?). I managed to not engage in sexual intercourse until about 12 years later. Guess that makes me a freak compared to **SA**. ---
**Author:** ![MissTake](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misstake/32/3189_2.png) [@MissTake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MissTake)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/213 "2010-04-14T01:15:40Z")
Remember, though, anecdotes from people who lean left don’t count. It’s his truth only. It’s what he’s experienced therefore its the way it is. Harumph. It’s been noted a few times that the lack of communication between the SSA and the Florida Medicaid agency (dunno if it’s state run or county run) caused problems. That, sadly, is the status quo. Agencies even on the same level do not have the ability to speak to each other. The SSA tried to help her out by saying “Hey, you can get additional cash benefits for your child! More money would help, right?”. They don’t have the ability to check her public assistance status. The computers do not speak to each other. The people do not speak to each other. The main link between SSA and her Medicaid program is… her. It’s different than **SA** ’s assertion that were this done by a private insurance agency we’d be all over it like white on rice. Private insurance agencies don’t try to help their clients by contacting them out of the blue to let them know more benefits are available. Rather, they point out that itsybitsy microprint on the back of page 413 that states because the sky was blue on the third Thursday of the month, she’s SOL byebye have a nice day. Private insurance agencies do what they can to schtup you out of benefits you have paid for to protect their bottom line. The state medicaid program reviews income and cuts you off when you earn too much, allowing those fund to be freed up to help others. The pot of money is finite (as we’ve learned here in Minnesota, thanks TPaw). ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/214 "2010-04-14T02:04:08Z")
> [@MissTake](#): > > …thanks TPaw). TPaw? Awwww, that’s _adorable_! So warm, so very nearly human! ---
**Author:** ![ArrMatey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/arrmatey/32/3522_2.png) [@ArrMatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArrMatey)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/215 "2010-04-14T02:06:43Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Try this: Before you post, say what you wrote down out loud. If you find yourself shaking your head and exclaiming something along the lines of, “What the hell does _that_ mean?”, delete. I don’t have a dog that I’d -want- to put in this fight, but I just wanted to ask permission to use this as a sig line. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/216 "2010-04-14T02:09:47Z")
> [@Kolga](#): > > Another anecdote: > > My mom and I read a book together that was called “How to talk about sex with your 6-year-old” that she’d gotten from the doctor’s office, when I was…a little younger than 6 (how about that?). > > I managed to not engage in sexual intercourse until about 12 years later. Guess that makes me a freak compared to SA. > [@Blalron](#): > > Another battle of the anecdotes: > > My parents showed me a documentary on sexual reproduction when I was 7. I knew even more than Starving Artist learned by fumbling through books when he was 9. I could tell you what sexual intercourse was, and where babies come from. > > I didn’t respond by becoming sex crazed. In fact, I didn’t even kiss anyone until after I was 21. Guys, guys, guys! You’re blowing this all out of proportion. In the first place, I didn’t get introduced to the subject by looking up an article in an encyclopedia. I came upon a collection of photos featuring full-on penetrative sex, some of which were taken from a…ahem…gynocological camera angle. This was followed the next day with, IIRC, four books on sex and reproduction that my father checked out of the library for me to read. Secondly, I can see that some of you took my description of the neighborhood being a junior league Playboy Mansion just a tad too seriously. And thirdly, despite my apparent sexual precocity and numerous experimentations, I never got properly and fully laid until I was 16. My guide in this delightful endeavor was a cute, highly oversexed and utterly delightful little heartbreaker of 20 who worked for my father at the time. These days, people like **Drain Bead** would be faunching at the bit to throw her in jail and brand her a “sex offender” for life, but paradoxically people weren’t so hysterical about youthful sex in those days and no one who was in the know thought anything about our relative ages. In fact, to further illustrate the mores of the time, Jerry Lee Lewis had legally married his 14-year-old cousin just seven or eight years earlier. It’s only been recently that anyone a day over 18 who has sex with anyone a day under 18 gets labeled a pervert. Anyway, the reason I brought all that up in the first place was to illustrate that the more you “educate” kids about sex, the more they’re going to want to do like the grownups do and engage in it. And of course once they hit puberty and their hormones kick in, the motivation switches from curiosity, exploration and a desire to do what the grownups do to full-blown adolescent lust. And then, because they lack the foresight and discipline and judgement to handle sex properly, their behavior will lead to problems with STDs, pregnancies, promiscuity, abortions, etc. This is really basic stuff. It’s hard to believe that here on the smartest message board on the entire internet it’s necessary to spell these things out. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/217 "2010-04-14T02:14:30Z")
> [@niblet\_head](#): > > From Post #1: :eek: I was obviously gob:smack:ed by the sheer audacity of including that in an OP. I wonder if he’ll try and use it more; it seems to be a theme or something he’s got goin’. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/218 "2010-04-14T02:18:43Z")
So you don’t tell kids jackshit? Gotchya. :rolleyes: God, just when I think **Starving Artist** can’t get any stupider than he already is… ---
**Author:** ![hotflungwok](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/edb3f5/32.png) [@hotflungwok](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hotflungwok)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/219 "2010-04-14T02:24:41Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Anyway, the reason I brought all that up in the first place was to illustrate that the more you “educate” kids about sex, the more they’re going to want to do like the grownups do and engage in it. And of course once they hit puberty and their hormones kick in, the motivation switches from curiosity, exploration and a desire to do what the grownups do to full-blown adolescent lust. And then, because they lack the foresight and discipline and judgement to handle sex properly, their behavior will lead to problems with STDs, pregnancies, promiscuity, abortions, etc. So what you’re saying is that if you teach young children, who are biologically incapable of being interested in sex, about sex, they will suddenly start having sex, so we shouldn’t teach them about it? And when these children hit puberty and become biologically capable of being interested in sex, and need that foresight, discipline, and judgement that education could give them, you want to deny it to them because it will make them want to have sex? Is that what I’m hearing? I’d ask you to rethink this, but I’m not certain you’ve actually put any thought into this in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2010, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/220 "2010-04-14T02:26:10Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > …And then, because they lack the foresight and discipline and judgement to handle sex properly… Entering a stage that lasts anywhere from thirty to fifty years. The alternate presumption is equally plausible, that familiarity with sex makes it less mysterious, and thereby less enticing. My suggestion has as much scientific support as your own, being none. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=12)