# Sarah Palin proven right! Government tricks beautiful young mom; imposes 1st Death Panel Verdict **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 12, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888 "2010-04-12T22:18:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/61 "2010-04-13T00:57:02Z")
I find it very difficult to place much blame on Ms. Smith. She’s broke, struggling to raise her son, and in the middle of difficult medical treatments. Yeah, you can say “well, she should have done her homework”, but, realistically, given her situation, it’s easy to see why she didn’t. What’s appalling is that she is expected to \*choose \*between receiving money that, by law, her son is entitled to, and receiving medical treatment for her cancer. And **Starving Artist** is annoyed because the government didn’t \*cancel \*her son’s SS payments promptly enough! He’s not bothered by the fact that our crazy unfair system forces this poor woman to make such an insane choice. No. Rather this “compassionate conservative” is annoyed because the government didn’t act quickly enough to restore her to her sanctioned level of poverty. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/62 "2010-04-13T00:59:59Z")
Can we merge the OP with the **What stupid shit do you have to believe to be a conservative today** thread? ---
**Author:** ![MissTake](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misstake/32/3189_2.png) [@MissTake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MissTake)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/63 "2010-04-13T01:01:05Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Accidentally? _Accidentally?_ Hell, they sent her an offer to begin disability payments for her three year old son. I know several people who get SS disability and every one was denied initially after a one-year wait, including a woman who was left completely paralyzed on one side after a stroke. The SS administration determined she was still capable of some kind of work. Every person I know who is currently drawing SS disability had to hire a lawyer in order to make it happen. > > And then, the month after the offer was made her cancer treatment got cut off. Since when dies the SS administration move so quickly? Hell, their website advises a three month head start when applying for retirement benefits just to try to make sure you get them on time. The reason the child received benefits so fast is due to SSA not having to go through the whole process of certifying _him_ disabled - his benefits are based solely on what his mom receives. I’m surprised they didn’t have her apply for derivative benefits when she applied. I routinely inform my clients when I find they may be able to receive derivative benefits, but I don’t check to see what their public assistance status is, nor do I ask “BTW, are you pending life saving surgery and receiving a few extra hundred dollars a month would cause you to do?” I proffer the information, they decide whether to act upon it. So now that she’s ineligible for public assistance medical care, I wonder what private insurance company would be willing to take her on, what with that pre-existing condition. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/64 "2010-04-13T01:01:12Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > I find it very difficult to place much blame on Ms. Smith. She’s broke, struggling to raise her son, and in the middle of difficult medical treatments. Yeah, you can say “well, she should have done her homework”, but, realistically, given her situation, it’s easy to see why she didn’t. > > What’s appalling is that she is expected to \*choose \*between receiving money that, by law, her son is entitled to, and receiving medical treatment for her cancer. And **Starving Artist** is annoyed because the government didn’t \*cancel \*her son’s SS payments promptly enough! He’s not bothered by the fact that our crazy unfair system forces this poor woman to make such an insane choice. No. Rather this “compassionate conservative” is annoyed because the government didn’t act quickly enough to restore her to her sanctioned level of poverty. That’s it exactly. Worse he’s using her awful situation to make an argument against NHC! :eek: On what planet would this poor young woman be better off with a market based system of health care? What corporate executive is going to make sure she’ll get access to health care once she survives this awful disease? Talk about pre-existing conditions! ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/65 "2010-04-13T01:09:56Z")
I’m confused. I’ve always been told that my SSI specifically **doesn’t** count as income and I am not required to declare it. The only exception was for FAFSA. While I agree that Starving Artist is being an idiot here, he does have an oblique point. There’s no reason why money given to you because you are poor should count the same as money you actually earned. According to my own experience, she was likely told this would not count against her getting Medicaid. So the stupidity was not all on her. Still, this is not an argument against the new law, nor for actual government run health care, as, in those situations, BY DEFINITION, this could not happen. His thesis therefore just the stupid “look at the government: They screwed up here. That means they’ll always screw up.” I bet he’d love it if the same standard were applied to him. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/66 "2010-04-13T01:12:03Z")
Immediate effects of health care bill 1. If you have a pre existing condition. you can no longer be denied coverage 2. You can not be dropped and you get sick. Can you imagine such a thing. If you get sick insurance companies can not drop you for having the nerve of using the insurance you paid for 3. New health care plans to include preventative coverage. No copays or deducts. How un American is that 4. women allowed to visit ob-gyn without getting permission from insurance company 5. Patients guaranteed emergency room care 6. no lifetime limits of coverage 7. seniors get free wellness checkup -no copay or deductible 8. Seniors hurt by doughnut hole get a 250 buck rebate Small businesses get a tax cut to help pay for coverage-(10 employees or less) 9. Increase in community health care facilities. (11 billion0 Insurance companies have to spend 80-85 percent of revenue on medical care-not salaries, bonuses or lobbying The idea that health care does not go into effect for years is badly mistaken ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/67 "2010-04-13T01:12:07Z")
I move that the thread title be changed as it is blatantly dishonest. I don’t understand the OP’s complaint at all. He’s upset because he thinks Medicaid has too low of an income cut off? Where does he think it should be cut off? ---
**Author:** ![mozchron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@mozchron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mozchron)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/68 "2010-04-13T01:16:46Z")
SA, you have a problem in your understanding, and its a very common one. You keep saying the **"GOVERNMENT! THE GOVERNMENT! THE GOVERNMENT GAVE HER THE MONEY THEN CANCELED HER HEALTH CARE!"** The “government” isn’t a single monolithic entity. In this situation, there is a major disconnect between the federal government and the state government. One didn’t know what the other was doing, and this women got caught in the middle. Sad. And something that the new health care regulations will help with. ---
**Author:** ![descamisado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e480ec/32.png) [@descamisado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/descamisado)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/69 "2010-04-13T01:22:22Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Can we merge the OP with the **What stupid shit do you have to believe to be a conservative today** thread? Done. Or, at least I’ve linked to the OP over there. I also want to say that, once the snafu was set in motion (by mis- or lack of communication between her, and the state and federal agencies), I support all efforts to get it straightened out _post haste_ so that she can have the surgery she needs, pretty or not. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/70 "2010-04-13T01:31:34Z")
> [@Fake\_Tales\_of\_San\_Francisco](#): > > Hold the phone, **you actually think** they devised a plan to kill her off by tricking her into receiving disability payments for her son, thereby making her ineligible for Medicaid insurance? This is **SA** we’re talking about – I’ve taken the liberty of bolding the part of your post where things fall apart. ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/71 "2010-04-13T01:34:46Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I know several people who get SS disability … Surprise, surprise! It took **Starving Artist** three whole posts before resorting to his usual “I know some people…” mode of evidence. Broad, national social and historical trends can, for this dunce, be reduced to a few anecdotal cases that (shock, horror) he can never actually provide any evidence for. Blacks were happy in pre-Civil Rights era; everyone felt safer before the 1960s; and anyone on social security had to fight the government tooth and nail to get it. If all this weren’t stupid enough (and, Og knows, when **SA** is involved, “stupid” barely begins to cover it), he uses this case as proof that Palin was right about a program that hasn’t even started yet, and that has nothing to do with the particular case under discussion. I’ll give you this, **SA** : what you lack in intelligence, you make up for in stupidity. You’re a living, breathing caricature. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/72 "2010-04-13T01:36:15Z")
I think a lot of you are missing the point here. Insurance companies may be slimy bastards but they are not incompetent. The bureaucracy that they put up are roadblocks to avoid paying off valid claims. Should that be outlawed and fined? Yes! Should they be allowed to drop someone who has been paying in because they get sick. Of course not! Should they be allowed to refuse someone for a pre-existing condition? As far as I’m concerned, when you can give me a way that someone doesn’t refuse to have health insurance then get it when they get really sick, I may agree but that is another thread. But when this idiocy and bureaucracy and “I can’t do anything about it.” is our own government that has pissed their pants for a year everytime a private insurer did it, then why the fuck should I trust Washington DC more than BCBS? Where’s the UHC for this lady? ---
**Author:** ![11811](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/9d8465/32.png) [@11811](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/11811)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/73 "2010-04-13T01:37:01Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > I just clicked it and the photo’s there. She looks like a young Persis Khambatta. ---
**Author:** ![11811](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/1/9d8465/32.png) [@11811](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/11811)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/74 "2010-04-13T01:43:24Z")
> [@Torpor\_Beast](#): > > Unless they’re beautiful, of course. Right, then they get eaten by _ **beautiful** _ tigers. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/75 "2010-04-13T01:49:09Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > I think a lot of you are missing the point here. > > Insurance companies may be slimy bastards but they are not incompetent. The bureaucracy that they put up are roadblocks to avoid paying off valid claims. Should that be outlawed and fined? Yes! Should they be allowed to drop someone who has been paying in because they get sick. Of course not! Should they be allowed to refuse someone for a pre-existing condition? As far as I’m concerned, when you can give me a way that someone doesn’t refuse to have health insurance then get it when they get really sick, I may agree but that is another thread. > > But when this idiocy and bureaucracy and “I can’t do anything about it.” is our own government that has pissed their pants for a year everytime a private insurer did it, then why the fuck should I trust Washington DC more than BCBS? Two different agencies. They’re working on it now. > [@](#): > > Where’s the UHC for this lady? The majority of the features of the HCR bill don’t roll in until 2014. Also, she wouldn’t have some magic UHC, she’d either have Medicade (as I recall if she was 133% of poverty level [which for a single woman with a child would be 20k or so]). Otherwise she’d have to get insurance. From [this calculator](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/politics/what-health-bill-means-for-you/), and assuming she has a family of 2 and makes 21k it would cost no more than $840, possibly as little as $680. So around $70 a month. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/76 "2010-04-13T01:51:33Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’m confused. I’ve always been told that my SSI specifically **doesn’t** count as income and I am not required to declare it. The only exception was for FAFSA. Could be related to the fact that you’re in Arkansas, and the young lady in the story is in Florida. Different states, different eligiblilty rules. Here in California, One of **kaylasmom** ’s classmates from guide dog school was an SSI recipient, and receiving Medicaid (CalOptima), until her husband got a job, that allowed him to buy health insurance for the family. Even after that, the state still had her on the list as eligible to receive benefits. They offered to pay for all medical expenses each month that were incurred AFTER he had spent $1850 (IIRC). Yes, that’s right. They spend $1850 per month out of pocket on her medical care, and then CalOptima picks up the balance. Point is, in some states, the eligibility tapers off, and in others, it apparently cuts off at a certain income level. ---
**Author:** ![sparky\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/77aa72/32.png) [@sparky\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sparky_1)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/77 "2010-04-13T01:52:04Z")
> [@Torpor\_Beast](#): > > In the broadest sense it is. Where I’m going with this is that **you** , are the government. You, the woman in your OP, RNATB, Tiger Woods, Der Trihs, Sarah Palin and all the rest of you, are The Government. That’s how democracy works. In essence, when you say that The Government can’t do anything right, you’re saying that **you** just can’t get shit done. > The Government is all of you together, making sure you don’t get screwed over. Be that by private companies, individuals, or other governments. Think of it as collective bargaining, in enormous scale. Sometimes you don’t get a deal that gives the best possible benefit to you individually. But it’s helluva lot better than letting faceless people, whose only responsibility is to make profit, lord over your basic sickness and health. > As it should be in a capitalist society, nothing prevents you individually from picking and choosing extra coverage after the basics have been taken care of, should some private company offer it. Exactly! Thank you for this post. I dislike my country more and more every day due to the shallow minded, preschool politics so well displayed in this thread. We have people aghast and slaying mud because a black guy is now President. He got there by the will of the majority. Hell, MA elected a Republican to Kennedy’s seat because of the will of the people. This is OUR Country! We do have a say. I feel like I’m wading through a sea of morons when I try to talk to people. As to health care… our model does not work! No one should ever benefit financially from the health of another. Ever! As such, capitalism does not and never will work for health care. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/78 "2010-04-13T01:52:59Z")
When this shit happens, its a mistake. With WellPoint, it’s a policy, a decision to fuck over the sick for money. I think that’s pretty important. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/79 "2010-04-13T02:00:15Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > When this shit happens, its a mistake. With WellPoint, it’s a policy, a decision to fuck over the sick for money. I think that’s pretty important. She doesn’t get needed medical care either way whether on purpose or an oopsie. THAT’S pretty important! ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/80 "2010-04-13T02:06:49Z")
Didn’t you read the last sentence? She’s getting it. Pencils have erasers. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=5)