# Sarah Palin proven right! Government tricks beautiful young mom; imposes 1st Death Panel Verdict **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 12, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888 "2010-04-12T22:18:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 48
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/941 "2010-04-30T07:32:36Z")
> [@42fish](#): > > Based on your “Let me tell you about the time I got so het up from porn that I had to molest a fellow eight-year-old and how this proves sex ed is a bad thing” post, I’m guessing it’s because you lack smarts, self-awareness and any sense of shame, thereby rendering you immune to embarassment. You can guess whatever you want. The fact is that when kids too young to handle the information get it anyway, it leads to things that most people would think shouldn’t happen. Shall I look up the recent news article detailing multiple incidents of oral sex and other types of sexual misbehavior on the part of children _in a day care center_? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/942 "2010-04-30T08:03:03Z")
> [@LavenderBlue](#): > > **Starving Artist** , > > You remind me of my father in some ways. He’s 72 and likes to rail about the evils of blogs and the internet in a way that makes me want to run screaming from the room because he simply doesn’t know what he’s talking about. I do my best to ignore him and try to steer our conversation back to the constant evils of Republicans where it rightfully belongs. > > I know he’s a retired postal worker and therefore one of those government workers that you like to hate on but you really do remind me of him in one or two ways. You have one stupid premise and you keep repeating it over and over again: government sucks. You know this because you’re older than we are. > > Like my dad in some ways I’m sure you’re probably a nice person in other ways (you should see the man getting on his hands and knees to play horsie for my little daughter :D) but on this issue well frankly you’re nothing but a ranting old man. > > Go stand on the porch and yell instead of coming to the net to write stupid things over and over again. At least then the only people tempted to argue with you would be your poor neighbors. You know, I get really tired of this “old guy” shit. I have felt the same way about politics and the way government operates for almost my entire adult life. FWIW, I was even more strenuously opposed to Hillarycare than I was to Obamacare. I posted here for years with no comment ever made about my age until I made the mistake of answering a poster who asked how old I was, and ever since the same sort of people who think that calling me stupid is a valid debating tactic also resort to attempting to portray my views as being the result of my being an “old guy”. It’s specious and utter bullshit. I’ve been politically conservative since I was old enough to pay attention to politics. I abhored hippiedom at the time it was popular and I’ve abhored most of what has happened in its wake. If anything, I’m more philosophical about it now than I was 20 or 30 years ago. :eek: 😃 And yeah, I am a nice guy and since my daughter was born 30 years ago I’m the biggest tool you can imagine when it comes to little kids, and I can say honestly and without fear of contradiction that not a single person who knows me personally away from this board thinks I’m an asshole. Not one. So argue with what I’m saying all you want but get off the old guy shit, okay? If we were having this conversation 20 or 30 years ago you’d find I was even more critical of liberalism and its goals and impact than I am now. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/943 "2010-04-30T08:14:19Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > “You’re stoopid”, after all, is not a persuasive rebuttal, and when people stoop to doing so it appears to me as if they’ve got nothing else to bring to the table, with the result that I sometimes declare “victory” in our exchange. > [@Starving Artist](#): > > I can’t believe you are actually this stupid. Please tell me you’re just responding reflexively and without thinking it through…Oh, wait, that’s pretty much what liberals are known for anyway, isn’t it? Woohoo, victory is mine! ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/944 "2010-04-30T08:37:16Z")
> [@emacknight](#): > > "That’s not why you got 19 pages of shit piled on you. It wasn’t that you posted something politic[sic]. You posted a thread -\>in the pit\<- called, “Sarah Palin proven right! Government tricks beautiful young mom; imposes 1st Death Panel Verdict.” > > Except, she wasn’t proven right, the government didn’t trick anyone, and there was no death panel verdict. The article you used to show the government sucks turned out to show the exact opposite; private hospitals suck, the rules Medicare has to follow suck, and that government is able to show compassion when a hospital fails to do so. " > > Did you post in the pit? > > Was your thread titled, "“Sarah Palin proven right! Government tricks beautiful young mom; imposes 1st Death Panel Verdict.” ? > > Was she proven right? Did the government trick someone? Was there a death panel? > > Once again, you were shown to be factually incorrect. You respond with, “virtually every sentence contains something that isn’t true.” (calling me a liar) > > So here I am again, showing that you were factually incorrect. And now I’m calling you an asshole, because what you did was an assholish thing to do. > > See the pattern? You said something wrong, were shown it was wrong, then you claim we’re being dishonest in showing you that you’re wrong, again we show you that you were wrong, and that we weren’t being dishonest, now we’re calling you a name. > > It has nothing to do with you being a conservative. You just happen to be a conservative AND and asshole. Sure it does. Do you think this is the first thread where I’ve encountered this kind of rhetoric? (And while you’re thinking, take a look at the response **ralph124c** has been drawing for his thread on Obama fighting the deficit. I linked to it in my response to **Algorithm** above.) You are correct that there was no trickery. However that ship sailed a long time ago and people haven’t been assailing me ever since because of the OP, but because of my view of government and my descriptions of how it works. You guys love government and want it to run everything. So when I post things that illuminate the realities of how government operates, you guys go into a snit because it threatens your view of a perfect world in which we all live in perfect, equal harmony - protected and provided for and cared for by our loving, benevolent government. Now, you know and I know that government is no such thing. But you still think that all things considered government is the best solution to most of the country’s problems. So when I post anti-government things that you fear people might take to heart, you go ballistic and respond in the time-honored way of liberalism, which is to assume that anyone who disagrees with you has to be stupid, a moron, etc., etc., almost ad infinitum. In your mind as well as in many if not most liberal minds, there is simply no other legitimate way to think. There is your way - the kind, loving, tolerant, just, and, most importantly, intellectually superior way - and what anyone else thinks is either stupid, evil or cruel. But guess what? That ain’t so. Nearly half the population thinks your ideas and beliefs fly in the face of human nature and will never work and will only cause problems and make things worse, and in their opinion you are the stupid ones walking around with your heads in the clouds. Now if you will stop and think about it, you will note that you very rarely see me calling my liberal brethren here “stupid” or claiming that they are “morons” for thinking the way they do or favoring the things they favor. I may attack what they think or what they want, but I don’t immediately assume that they don’t have a brain in their heads if they think differently than I do about something. So I’ll say the same thing to you that I did to **Lavender Blue**. State your opinions all you want and argue with me all you want, but if you want to resort to calling me stupid and shouting “Fuck you” every time you hear something you don’t like, then don’t expect me to take you seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/945 "2010-04-30T08:50:53Z")
> [@Starving Artist](#): > > I can’t believe you are actually this stupid. Please tell me you’re just responding reflexively and without thinking it through…Oh, wait, that’s pretty much what liberals are known for anyway, isn’t it? > [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Woohoo, victory is mine! Not quite. If you’ll stop and think about it, I said I couldn’t believe he (or she, I’ve lost track) was that stupid. This means I don’t think he or she is stupid in point of fact, but rather reacting reflexively and without thinking it through. William F. Buckley once said to an opponent, _“I won’t insult your intelligence by suggesting that you really believe what you just said”_. My comment was intended to convey that sort of sentiment. But hey, at least you got to experience the feeling of victory for a moment, fleeting though it was. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/946 "2010-04-30T09:00:43Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Not quite. If you’ll stop and think about it, I said I couldn’t believe he (or she, I’ve lost track) was that stupid. This means I don’t think he or she is stupid in point of fact, but rather reacting reflexively and without thinking it through. Oh, I dunno. I believe that you believe the person you were talking to is stupid. This “I can’t believe you are actually this stupid” stuff is just trying to put a polite spin on things, and it’s not even that polite, implying as it does “I thought you were stupid, but I didn’t think you _that_ stupid”. I mean, why not be honest about who you think is stupid? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/947 "2010-04-30T09:08:38Z")
You know, stupid people are not that common. I can’t think of anyone on this board who I truly believe to be stupid. But if you want to continue to think that you know better than I do about what I think, knock yourself out. As for me, I think I’m gonna call it a night. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/948 "2010-04-30T09:09:47Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > You guys love government and want it to run everything. You are very quick to point out differences between your statements and how people interpret them, or to claim that you have been quoted out of context. Who in this thread has said they want government to run everything? Who has posted anything even remotely like that? > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Not quite. If you’ll stop and think about it, I said I couldn’t believe he (or she, I’ve lost track) was that stupid. This means I don’t think he or she is stupid in point of fact, but rather reacting reflexively and without thinking it through. > > William F. Buckley once said to an opponent, _“I won’t insult your intelligence by suggesting that you really believe what you just said”_. > > My comment was intended to convey that sort of sentiment. The comment “I can’t believe you are actually this stupid,” was directed at me, without any provocation or insult on my part. It was preceded by: > [@Starving Artist](#): > > _Sigh_ No it isn’t dumbass. Is there some way that that wasn’t intended as an insult, either? ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/949 "2010-04-30T09:16:25Z")
In my opinion SA has clearly stepped over the line from Guinness Book of Records Ignoramus to downright trolling. If he has neither the wit nor the honesty to debate in good faith (and this thread demonstrates conclusively, beyond all doubt that he is incapable/unwilling) he should either leave, be removed or just plain shunned. Enough is enough. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/950 "2010-04-30T09:27:27Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > Is there some way that that wasn’t intended as an insult, either? Nope, that was an insult. (I knew I shouldn’t have refreshed the screen one more time.) But knowing me as I do, and not wanting to take the time right now to investigate it, I find it hard to believe I’d post something like that with “no provocation”. > [@tagos](#): > > Enough is enough. No one’s putting a gun to your head and forcing you into this thread, chum. But the fact is that people here will always respond to me because they’re terrified that if they don’t come flooding in here en masse to call me stupid, fence-sitters and the uninitiated might think I have a point. And we certainly can’t have _that_ around here, can we? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/951 "2010-04-30T09:32:39Z")
Hi, **Starving**. You are the most tenacious doper ever. No one in this thread would believe the other side of you. I just shake my head when I read. And keep grinning, of course. Just a word for government run health programs: I’ve been on Medicare for over twenty years. The first time that I got an EOB from them, I was amazed at the difference that it made in my doctor’s bill. That was my first impression. The second is that after all this time, I’ve never known them to make a mistake in my payments. They have been incredibly efficient. The problem with Medicare is that some people swindle money from the government. It’s not that the government has given us poor patient care. Please be fair and keep in mind that countries that have UHC don’t ever want to go back to the old way of doing things. And my own experience with UHC in Paris made it clear why. By the way, I have not had a cost of living raise in two years, but I just found out that Blue Cross is going up on my insurance by 11%. And they are already charging me $75 as a punitive measure if I go to the emergency room but I am not admitted to the hospital. That is over and above all of the hospital charges. My entire bill in Paris – ambulance, doctor, medication, and exam – was about half of what Blue Cross charges moi as a punishment for using the ER! That’s insane! And Paris is probably very close to being the most expensive city in the world. Judging from my own experiences and those of my friends who live under UHC, the smart and humane thing to do is to at least give it a try. I wish you peace and health and some of the things we have talked about elsewhere. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/952 "2010-04-30T09:42:40Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Nope, that was an insult. (I knew I shouldn’t have refreshed the screen one more time.) > > But knowing me as I do, and not wanting to take the time right now to investigate it, I find it hard to believe I’d post something like that with “no provocation”. All you have to do is find it and quote me. Until then I stand by my claim. You also completely ignored my point that > [@Starving Artist](#): > > You guys love government and want it to run everything. is a blatant misrepresentation of the viewpoints expressed in this thread. ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/953 "2010-04-30T09:47:34Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Nope, that was an insult. (I knew I shouldn’t have refreshed the screen one more time.) > > But knowing me as I do, and not wanting to take the time right now to investigate it, I find it hard to believe I’d post something like that with “no provocation”. > > No one’s putting a gun to your head and forcing you into this thread, chum. > > But the fact is that people here will always respond to me because they’re terrified that if they don’t come flooding in here en masse to call me stupid, fence-sitters and the uninitiated might think I have a point. > > And we certainly can’t have _that_ around here, can we? 😉 This is the last response to you. Consider yourself shunned. And I’m saying this in all seriousness. Go get yourself checked out. Something is not right if you believe anything you’ve said here. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/954 "2010-04-30T11:40:52Z")
Hey SA, You know how they say that it’s not paranoia if they really are out to get you? Yeah, well, like that, it’s also not a random insult if you really are completely fucking stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 11:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/955 "2010-04-30T11:47:49Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > I just shake my head when I read. And keep grinning, of course. Why? What’s amusing about it? It’s nothing but sadly pathetic. If you have any positive feelings for this person, you ought to PM him to try to help him out. And if one enormous “side” of a person is a complete asshole, there aren’t enough sides geometrically possible to make up for it. For instance, I hear that Jeffrey Skilling never had an overdue library book - isn’t he so very conscientious? ---
**Author:** ![Amber\_in\_Treasury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/bc79bd/32.png) [@Amber\_in\_Treasury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amber_in_Treasury)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/956 "2010-04-30T12:34:55Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > If your post #26 was as silly as this one, it’s small wonder I never addressed it. :rolleyes: Do you know of any countries that currently have UHC? If so, are you convinced they have death panels too? Just answer me this. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/957 "2010-04-30T12:41:11Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > This is the last response to you. Consider yourself shunned. > > And I’m saying this in all seriousness. Go get yourself checked out. Something is not right if you believe anything you’ve said here. I’m also deeply concerned about our dear SA’s constant need to “excuse” himself from the thread. At his age, it’s definitely time for regular prostate exams. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/958 "2010-04-30T12:46:34Z")
> [@Bridget\_Burke](#): > > I’m also deeply concerned about our dear SA’s constant need to “excuse” himself from the thread. At his age, it’s definitely time for regular prostate exams. No need. His head is so far up his own ass, he can examine his own prostate. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/959 "2010-04-30T13:20:56Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > You know, stupid people are not that common. I can’t think of anyone on this board who I truly believe to be stupid. > > But if you want to continue to think that you know better than I do about what I think, knock yourself out. Fair enough - I don’t know what you’re thinking. But I do think you’re lying. ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2010, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/960 "2010-04-30T13:24:10Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Sure it does. Do you think this is the first thread where I’ve encountered this kind of rhetoric? (And while you’re thinking, take a look at the response **ralph124c** has been drawing for his thread on Obama fighting the deficit. I linked to it in my response to **Algorithm** above.) Okay, let’s at least clear this point up. You (and ralph124c) have posted IN THE PIT. [Here](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=561496) is someone posting about Muzac. Which is neither a liberal, nor conservative, nor politic. Posts 4 and 5 are directly insulting to him. This is the pit. If you don’t want to be called names, post in Great Debates. If you had posted this there, no one would have been allowed to call you names. This is an example of how you were wrong in your assessment. Do you now feel the need to dismiss me for being young and liberal (neither of which are true), or to simply write it all off as lies? I consider this a victory. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=47) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=49)