# Sarah Palin proven right! Government tricks beautiful young mom; imposes 1st Death Panel Verdict **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 12, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888 "2010-04-12T22:18:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/81 "2010-04-13T02:09:24Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > She doesn’t get needed medical care either way whether on purpose or an oopsie. THAT’S pretty important! Absolutely. Except… The very story linked by the OP suggests that, upon reviewing the situation, both a State Senator and officials from the Social Security Administration are “looking into the case to make the surgery happen.” The difference between on purpose and an oopsie is that when an oopsie is discovered, and found to be an oopsie, it can (and often will) be corrected. But when the denial of services is a policy, then it is, by definition, not an oopsie, and the company will likely tell the complainant to pound sand. I would prefer that situations like this didn’t arise in the first place, that there were mechanisms within the SSA and other government agencies that would prevent people slipping through the cracks in this way. I also think it would be good if there were better mechanisms in place to correct the problems at a level where citizens could deal with the issue themselves, rather than involving state senators and mucky-mucks in the SSA. But the fact is that the United States is a big country, the SSA and other government bodies deal with millions of people, and sometimes mistakes like this happen. Whatever else is wrong with government bureaucracy–and i think there are plenty of ways in which it could be improved–i think that to attribute something like this to malice, and to argue that it was done intentionally in order to deny the woman coverage and save a few bucks, is ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/82 "2010-04-13T02:10:35Z")
Well, as disturbing as this story is, **SA** , you do realize that it happened before any of the new HCR provisions kicked in. Right? So, if this is a “death panel”, then we’ve had them all along. Can you explain how these types of things will be more likely happen with the new HCR law? ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/83 "2010-04-13T02:18:02Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > I think a lot of you are missing the point here. > > Insurance companies may be slimy bastards but they are not incompetent. The bureaucracy that they put up are roadblocks to avoid paying off valid claims. Should that be outlawed and fined? Yes! Should they be allowed to drop someone who has been paying in because they get sick. Of course not! Should they be allowed to refuse someone for a pre-existing condition? As far as I’m concerned, when you can give me a way that someone doesn’t refuse to have health insurance then get it when they get really sick, I may agree but that is another thread. > > But when this idiocy and bureaucracy and “I can’t do anything about it.” is our own government that has pissed their pants for a year everytime a private insurer did it, then why the fuck should I trust Washington DC more than BCBS? > > Where’s the UHC for this lady? Do you really think there’s no incompetence in the private health insurance sector? :dubious: Like many people I’ve spent hours and hours and hours and hours dealing with private health insurance company sector incompetence. There is no magic employee competence dust that gets sprinkled all over you when you work for a private company. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/84 "2010-04-13T02:21:32Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Should they be allowed to refuse someone for a pre-existing condition? As far as I’m concerned, when you can give me a way that someone doesn’t refuse to have health insurance then get it when they get really sick, I may agree but that is another thread. :rolleyes: Perhaps you switched jobs and you HAVE to change your health insurance. And some people have conditions they were born with, and don’t have a choice. And sometimes the insurance companies’ definition of a “pre-existing condition” is so outrageous, how is anyone to even GUESS that they had one? The OP is just too stupid, even by **Starving Artist** standards. ---
**Author:** ![Sailboat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sailboat/32/461_2.png) [@Sailboat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sailboat)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/85 "2010-04-13T02:22:29Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Look, I don’t have time for this nonsense. I’m pissed that the government went out of its way Isn’t a big part of the problem here that we are talking about two different governments? The Fed offering her son the extra payments and the State of Florida administering (and canceling) the Medicare payments? It’s the fact that the two _different_ government bodies didn’t coordinate in her best interest that seems to be what you are objecting to? Why is this a “government is bad” issue for you and not a “conservatives support states’ rights” issue or a “no government welfare to people who have money” issue for you? ---
**Author:** ![MissTake](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misstake/32/3189_2.png) [@MissTake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MissTake)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/86 "2010-04-13T02:24:23Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’m confused. I’ve always been told that my SSI specifically **doesn’t** count as income and I am not required to declare it. The only exception was for FAFSA. > > While I agree that Starving Artist is being an idiot here, he does have an oblique point. There’s no reason why money given to you because you are poor should count the same as money you actually earned. According to my own experience, she was likely told this would not count against her getting Medicaid. So the stupidity was not all on her. I’m going to guess that she receives RSDI, not SSI, as derivative benefits are not available for the children of SSI recipients. You don’t receive SSI or RSDI because you’re poor, you receive it because you cannot work. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/87 "2010-04-13T02:30:14Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > Are you really this stupid or are you Andy Kaufman? > [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > How dumb are you? > [@Lobohan](#): > > So you are that stupid? Do you guys really have to ask? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/88 "2010-04-13T02:33:19Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > He’s upset because he thinks Medicaid has too low of an income cut off? Where does he think it should be cut off? At birth? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/89 "2010-04-13T02:51:55Z")
What a perfect storm of stupidity. A post of Starvy’s is a joy forever. Its ignorance increases; it will never pass into intelligibility, but still will … DUCK! It’s a length of barbed wire! ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/90 "2010-04-13T02:56:04Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > I’m confused. I’ve always been told that my SSI specifically **doesn’t** count as income and I am not required to declare it. The only exception was for FAFSA. Medicaid calculates income differently from the IRS. Income generally counts regardless of whether or not it is taxable. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/91 "2010-04-13T03:00:14Z")
I don’t care about **SA** ’s posting history - this HAS to have been a joke. It it simply too goddamn stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Triskadecamus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@Triskadecamus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Triskadecamus)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/92 "2010-04-13T03:01:48Z")
So, was it the Death Panel that sent her the letter? I though they only decided to let people die to save money. Are they involved in giving out money too? Tris ---
**Author:** ![fubbleskag](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@fubbleskag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fubbleskag)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/93 "2010-04-13T03:02:01Z")
This might actually be the most amazing thread I’ve yet read on this forum. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/94 "2010-04-13T03:02:35Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > I don’t care about **SA** ’s posting history - this HAS to have been a joke. It it simply too goddamn stupid. No, he just forced us to revise downward. ---
**Author:** ![MTCicero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a4c791/32.png) [@MTCicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MTCicero)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/95 "2010-04-13T03:33:16Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > I have yet to see one positive idea from Starving Artist to improve _anything_. Not a single one. In fact, I started a thread to solicit any ideas [he might](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=557419) have had to improve the country, and he couldn’t come up with jack shit. All he does is complain. > > I suggest that if he has nothing to add to the discussion other than whining, he and the other opponents of any and all progress should quiet down and let the grown ups in the room try to solve problems. **Starving Artist** , dude, you just had your ass squarely handed to you. ---
**Author:** ![MTCicero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a4c791/32.png) [@MTCicero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MTCicero)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/96 "2010-04-13T03:41:03Z")
Guu-uuys! Just look at what the fuck you’ve done! You went and scared **Starving Artist** away from his _own thread_! Damn it all to fucking hell! ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/97 "2010-04-13T03:46:40Z")
Okay, looks like I get to eat a little crow here. It turns out upon re-reading the article that the government never was on the hook for Diana Smith’s operation after all. It appears she raised the money to pay for it herself, through the efforts of her friends and members of her local community. The snag is that when the government denied her Medicaid coverage, the hospital would no longer agree to perform the operation out of liability concerns, concerns that would have been protected by Smith’s Medicaid coverage. Clearly that yanks the rug out from under my impression that the government deliberately tricked her into losing coverage so as to avoid paying for her operation, so you are all free to engage in high fives and happy dances and fist-bumping or whatever it is you do when you get to gloat over an opponent having been wrong. _taps foot, allows sufficient time for celebratory gloating_ But, we’re still left with the fact that once Diana Smith began to receive additional benefits by virtue of her son having become eligible for disability payments, the response of the government upon learning of the problem and the fact that government benefits themselves were what was causing the problem, turned a deaf ear to her complaints and life-threatening situation, telling her it was “too late”, nothing could be done, and leaving her to die when all it would have taken to correct the situation would have been for someone to take the bull by the horns and arrange to have her son’s benefits rescinded (and no, that’s not what I wanted in the first place :rolleyes:) and her Medicaid coverage reinstated. The very fact that the response of the government was what it was, particularly in light of the extremely precarious and life-threatening situation she was in and the relatively minor steps it would have taken in order to save her life, points out just as clearly the reasons I and others do not want our health care placed in the hands of the U.S. government. It is bureaucratic and hidebound, bogged down in red tape, and administered by lackeys of the sort who would tell a woman in her situation that nothing could be done, it was “too late”. Fortunately, as **elucidator** said, erasers exist and the mistake is being corrected. One can only wonder what would have happened had she and her son not been so photogenic and the erasers not been named _WFOR_ in Ft. Lauderdale, State Sen. Dave Aronberg, and, as it turns out, [Rush Limbaugh](http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_041210/content/01125112.guest.html). I’m guessing she would have been left to die by the very same bureaucratic indifference that Sarah Palin has in mind when she talks about death panels. So while the accusation of government trickery is withdrawn with my apologies, the larger, overriding complaint - that of a government indifferently allowing one of its citizens to die simply because she happened to fall through one of the cracks created by its own red tape and intractability - still stands as an excellent illustration of why so many of us on the right do not want the U.S. government dictating the terms of health care for ourselves and our families. > [@MTCicero](#): > > Starving Artist, dude, you just had your ass squarely handed to you. Hardly. Ask **Blalron** how much constructive criticism and how many solutions he has proposed regarding the concerns of this country’s conservatives. The phrase “They can dish it out but they can’t take it” seems almost to have been coined specifically for application to this board. If you’ll allow me to mix a metaphor, the complaining and criticizing of the left I engage in is but a drop in the bucket compared to wind of left-wing hate that blows toward anything conservative around here. > [@MTCicero](#): > > Guu-uuys! Just look at what the fuck you’ve done! You went and scared Starving Artist away from his own thread! > > Damn it all to fucking hell! Yeah. Right. :rolleyes: (And so now you see why I explain myself when I have to leave for a while. Douchebags like this guy try to pretend I’ve been “scared off” if I don’t.) ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/98 "2010-04-13T03:53:27Z")
Speaking of Limbaugh, shouldn’t he be looking for a house down in Costa Rica? ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/99 "2010-04-13T03:54:28Z")
If I was him I’d be looking for houses anywhere I liked. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2010, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/100 "2010-04-13T04:01:24Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > ..that of a government indifferently allowing one of its citizens to die…) Good Lord, man! When did she die? And how have the liberal media suppressed the story! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=6)