# Sarah Palin proven right! Government tricks beautiful young mom; imposes 1st Death Panel Verdict **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 12, 2010, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888 "2010-04-12T22:18:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 52
**Author:** ![spinky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@spinky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spinky)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1021 "2010-05-02T22:53:47Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > [Liberalism] wants to create a world where everything is “fair”, where nobody has it better than anybody else and nobody has more than anybody else. And while that sounds all well and good … Actually, that sounds pretty terrible, not “well and good.” This sounds suspiciously like an instance of a conservative ascribing stupid or evil motivations to liberals. Weren’t you just asking for examples of that and/or claiming it never happens? ---
**Author:** ![Muffin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muffin/32/4341_2.png) [@Muffin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muffin)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1022 "2010-05-02T23:11:25Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Yeah, it’s funny how the more you guys evolve, the worse things get. 😃 Nope, I’m a Canadian. As I have pointed out before, and as you have pointedly ignored, we live longer than Americans, live in a healthier state for a longer period than Americans, pay less for health care out of our own pockets than Americans, and pay less for health care through the government than Americans. ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1023 "2010-05-02T23:13:35Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > 46 million people aren’t being completely fucked over. They aren’t even being partially fucked over. In fact, most don’t need health care at all at the present time. And of those who do, most don’t need urgent or expensive care. So that leaves a small percentage of the overall population who truly is in need of help, and my contention is that we’d all be much better served to come up with some sort of program to assist those few people rather turning the whole system upside down for the sake of those few people and putting all our health care in the hands of a government that we all know produces inferior results. > > But to tell the truth I think this concern over the uninsured is largely a smokescreen just like insurance company malfeasance is largely a smokescreen. Solutions exist to deal with both of these problems but anytime someone brings one up they fall on deaf ears. This is because, once again, the real goal is political and it’s name is socialized medicine. You guys will condemn any and all ills that result under a free-market system and then, as has been demonstrated quite clearly in both these threads, you’ll excuse, rationalize or handwave away even greater ones provided they happen under a system of socialized care. > > What we really need to be doing in this country is asking ourselves whether we want the government running our lives or not, because ultimately that is what liberalism really wants. It wants to create a world where everything is “fair”, where nobody has it better than anybody else and nobody has more than anybody else. And while that sounds all well and good, a couple of major problems exist in trying to acheive it. Number one, “fairness” is impossible to create in the first place. Fairness has never existed and it never will. Attempts to manufacture it only create other types of unfairness - and artificial, unnecessary ones at that. > > Life was pretty fair for the inhabitants of the Soviet Union and communist China, but how happy were their lives? Life under forced fairness was bleak, oppressive and hopeless. What little that people had was cheap and of inferior quality, long lines existed for simple staples, and people were forced to buy and eat whatever the government in its wisdom decided should be grown and made available. And of course, government being government, errors in that decision making process were common, with the result being unexpected overages of some foods and shortages of others which resulted in such things as people having to eat bananas for three months because the government had produced too many of them and while having to stand in line for hours to get their allotment of bread due to a grain shortage. > > And then we have the fact that so far as we’ve ever been able to determine, the only way that entirely socialistic governments can remain in power is through spying on and oppressing their populace. This is because the lack of individual freedom so characteristic of collectivist governments is utterly contrary to human nature and people will rebel against it if given the chance. And so criticism of government cannot be tolerated, with spying and police-state oppression being the result. > > No, the fact of the matter is that life is unfair and shit happens. Conservatives believe that this fact should be recognized and that people should do the best they can to build lives in which they can better contend with the visissitudes of life when they happen, and in the event they can’t…well, that’s just life. And conservatives fall prey to the very same illnesses and accidents and troubles in life that happen to everyone else. We just don’t think it’s everyone else’s responsiblity to do something about it. And this is because we know that the individual freedom that goes along with living for ourselves and taking our own chances is vastly preferable to the oppression, privation and lack of personal freedom that is the inevitable result of creating a government whose purpose is to make things “fair”. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Do you want everything to be “fair”? I suspect you do, at least in theory. And if so the way fairness can be can be created and enforced is through government intervention. And I’d also wage just about any amount you’d care to name that once single-payer becomes the norm you’ll soon be on to having government take over some other area where problems exist under a free market system. And then another and then another. > > There is a constant push from the left in this country for more and more government, for higher and higher taxes, for more and more social programs, and for ever-increasing redistribution of income. Each of these leads to increased government control, and the more you get the more you want. There is absolutely no evidence that we will ever reach the time when liberals in this country will become satisfied with tax rates and government programs and social engineering until we reach the point that there is simply no more to take. And of course once we reach that point government will be running your life, whether you wanted it or saw it coming or not. Holy shit this is a massive strawman. Have you learned nothing from this thread? When making a strawman, you need to pick topics that you can easily argue against. The Soviet Union might have been a good one a decade ago. But China? Are you use you want to do there? Please, I want you to continue to use strawmen for all your arguments, it makes reading your nonsense that much more enjoyable. But for the love of god, remember that the point of strawman is to construct an argument you can win. I’m starting to think you took the Cold War a little too seriously. > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > No, the fact of the matter is that life is unfair and shit happens. Conservatives believe that this fact should be recognized and that people should do the best they can to build lives in which they can better contend with the visissitudes of life when they happen, and in the event they can’t…well, that’s just life. Is that just life? Or is that just death? > [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > And conservatives fall prey to the very same illnesses and accidents and troubles in life that happen to everyone else. We just don’t think it’s everyone else’s responsiblity to do something about it. Horseshit. 100% pure Colombian Horseshit. The rest of those two posts were equally full of nonsense and horseshit. You may or may not have noticed that countries with UHC have yet to go full-socialist. But do continue with your strawman ballet, it is extremely amusing. I’ve realized that your anger has nothing to do at all with health care, you’re still living in the McCarthy era. If you want to have some fun, take a look at what the free market brought to Russia. Good times had by all. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1024 "2010-05-02T23:13:52Z")
> [@ntucker](#): > > Actually, that sounds pretty terrible, not “well and good.” This sounds suspiciously like an instance of a conservative ascribing stupid or evil motivations to liberals. Weren’t you just asking for examples of that and/or claiming it never happens? He’s very accommodating in that regard. It appears that **SA** feels that the opposite of the view that “government is inherently bad and we should have as little of it as possible” is the view that “government is the bestest thing ever and should run everything”, with no middle ground. If he does acknowledge the existence of the middle ground, I haven’t seen much evidence of it. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1025 "2010-05-02T23:20:51Z")
> [@Gustav](#): > > Well hell, what do you care anyway? If this is what you’re paranoid of it’s clearly something that will happen long long after you’re dead and buried. You’re paranoid about a sceme that will take at least 100 years to put into action, even if things go exactly according to our evil plan. I thought you were concerned about something immediate, like the healthcare bill. In fairness, given his beliefs, his caring about the future is an entirely appropriate response. Most non-sociopathic humans realize that actions taken today will have an effect on generations yet unborn, and hope to leave them a better world. That argument could be turned around, and you could ask me why I’m concerned about global warming. After all, I’ll be dead and cremated long before the really bad things start happening. Despite his beliefs being completely wrong-headed, bull-headed, and pin-headed, his worry about the future and his attempts today to affect the future are completely appropriate, and even ethical. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1026 "2010-05-02T23:39:38Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > 46 million people aren’t being completely fucked over. They aren’t even being partially fucked over. In fact, most don’t need health care at all at the present time. And of those who do, most don’t need urgent or expensive care. So that leaves a small percentage of the overall population who truly is in need of help, and my contention is that we’d all be much better served to come up with some sort of program to assist those few people rather… If you could tell us, in advance, which few of those 46 million are going to need urgent and expensive care, it would be a lot easier to target the help just to them. [QUOTE=Starving Artist] It (liberalism) wants to create a world where everything is “fair”, where nobody has it better than anybody else and nobody has more than anybody else. And while that sounds all well and good, a couple of major problems exist in trying to acheive it. Number one, “fairness” is impossible to create in the first place. Fairness has never existed and it never will. Attempts to manufacture it only create other types of unfairness - and artificial, unnecessary ones at that. [/QUOTE] > [@Why do the world's Joe the Plumbers think tax cuts for the rich benefit them?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-do-the-worlds-joe-the-plumbers-think-tax-cuts-for-the-rich-benefit-them/507334/153): > > A flat tax would insure that rich people pay their **fair** share. More than that is classist, socialistic and confiscatorial, as I said just above. > [@I'm tired of Socialized Fire Fighting!](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-tired-of-socialized-fire-fighting/506373/184): > > With regard to the flat tax, I’m aware that among people of a certain political bent, flat tax is considered ill-advised/ridiculous. I’m also aware that people of certain other political beliefs consider it not only feasable but eminately **fair**. > [@I'm tired of Socialized Fire Fighting!](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-tired-of-socialized-fire-fighting/506373/167): > > Take away government-designed tax loopholes and institute a flat tax and the rich will ipso-facto pay their **fair** share (as anyone without a vested interest in greedily grabbing even more of their money for their own use can readily see). Bolding mine. ---
**Author:** ![Gustav](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/919ad9/32.png) [@Gustav](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gustav)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2010, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1027 "2010-05-02T23:39:40Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > In fairness, given his beliefs, his caring about the future is an entirely appropriate response. Most non-sociopathic humans realize that actions taken today will have an effect on generations yet unborn, and hope to leave them a better world. > > That argument could be turned around, and you could ask me why I’m concerned about global warming. After all, I’ll be dead and cremated long before the really bad things start happening. > > Despite his beliefs being completely wrong-headed, bull-headed, and pin-headed, his worry about the future and his attempts today to affect the future are completely appropriate, and even ethical. Yeah, I guess. It’s just he’s been arguing against this specific bill, and now suddenly it’s not even really about the bill, it’s about preventing this insanely contrived master plan to run everyone’s lives, and it just doesn’t seem like a concern that merits this kind of immediacy. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1028 "2010-05-03T00:19:19Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Nope, I’m a Canadian. As I have pointed out before, and as you have pointedly ignored, we live longer than Americans, live in a healthier state for a longer period than Americans, pay less for health care out of our own pockets than Americans, and pay less for health care through the government than Americans. **Starving** is demonstrating the soft jingoism of low expectations. He doesn’t believe America can do any better. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1029 "2010-05-03T01:02:51Z")
> [@Muffin](#): > > Nope, I’m a Canadian. As I have pointed out before, and as you have pointedly ignored, we live longer than Americans, live in a healthier state for a longer period than Americans, pay less for health care out of our own pockets than Americans, and pay less for health care through the government than Americans. But you do it _ **through the government** _. And that makes it shit. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1030 "2010-05-03T03:28:30Z")
Gotta wonder about that elusive quality of government, that essential nature that ensures the inefficiency of all governmental endeavors, regardless. I mean, suppose you got Wally’s Widgets, been producing a quality grade of widget for lo, these many years. Profits have always been comparable to other giants of the widget market, productivity good to excellent, that sort of thing. Then one day the Homeland Security Dept says that its important to control the domestic widget manufacturers, so the government buys Wally’s Widgets. Naturally, as it is clearly written in the Gospel According to St. Arving, productivity and efficiency will plummet like a lemming doing a swan dive. But right away? Will it happen when the ink dries on the signatures, or does the magical governmental voodoo happen when the government cuts the first paychecks? If the government bought Wally’s Widgets by stealth, and did not reveal its ownership, and left all management and workers in precisely the same roles…would it founder as quickly and as thoroughly? Is government ownership an irredeemable fall from grace, regardless of who knows about it, the deadly mojo poisons all efficiency, by its very presence? What, then, of free will? Me, I think Wally’s Widgets would be better off with a workers collective assuming ownership, and if they need an owner to take a cut, they can hire one. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1031 "2010-05-03T03:58:36Z")
> [@Blalron](#): > > His post is his cite! More like his past is his cite. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1032 "2010-05-03T07:23:12Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Me, I think Wally’s Widgets would be better off with a workers collective assuming ownership, and if they need an owner to take a cut, they can hire one. Sure. Why not. I mean, if you’re the United States government and you’re supported by the American taxpayer, you don’t have to worry about making a profit and you can do all sorts of shit to make life easier. You can hire employees you don’t need, pay them more than they’d ever make in a true business environment, give them guaranteed raises plus lots of time off and generous insurance and retirement benefits. You can also make them virtually unfirable. A worker’s paradise if ever there was one. Only problem is, real income earners must be bled in order to provide the funds for this untenable kind of employee compensation, and so the larger government gets, the fewer private wage earners there are, and eventually you reach the point of diminishing returns where there simply aren’t enough workers to bleed for funds to operate with and so the federal gravy train begins slowly grinding to a halt. Oh, wait…no, it doesn’t. Taxes can always be increased and…oh, wait, no, they can’t. Eventually even a 100% tax rate won’t pay for everything that government… Oh, well, nevermind. We’ll just let people drive off that bridge when they come to it. It’s too bad this country’s leadership isn’t as concerned about its unsustainable economic policies as it is about global warming. We’re likely to collapse under our own financial weight long before we’re drowned by melting ice caps. > [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > More like his past is his cite. More like life is my cite. For, as the wonderful conservative quote-meister William F. Buckley, Jr. once observed of the struggle between conservatism and liberalism, _“Life is our secret weapon”_. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1033 "2010-05-03T07:41:22Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Only problem is, real income earners must be bled in order to provide the funds for this untenable kind of employee compensation, and so the larger government gets, the fewer private wage earners there are, and eventually you reach the point of diminishing returns where there simply aren’t enough workers to bleed for funds to operate with and so the federal gravy train begins slowly grinding to a halt. Oh, wait…no, it doesn’t. Taxes can always be increased and…oh, wait, no, they can’t. Eventually even a 100% tax rate won’t pay for everything that government… Mr. Slope, meet Mr. Slippery. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 12:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1034 "2010-05-03T12:22:35Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > …More like life is my cite. For, as the wonderful conservative quote-meister William F. Buckley, Jr. once observed of the struggle between conservatism and liberalism, _“Life is our secret weapon”_. 😃 Really? I’m pretty much your exact contemporary and life has taught me quite different lessons. I remember when there were intelligent conservatives; alas, William F Buckley is dead. Sarah Palin & Rush are your new intellectual leaders–since you mentioned her in the OP & you evidently stole the whole wrong-headed idea from Limbaugh. ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1035 "2010-05-03T13:16:43Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Only problem is, real income earners must be bled in order to provide the funds for this untenable kind of employee compensation, and so the larger government gets, the fewer private wage earners there are, and eventually you reach the point of diminishing returns where there simply aren’t enough workers to bleed for funds to operate with and so the federal gravy train begins slowly grinding to a halt. Oh, wait…no, it doesn’t. Taxes can always be increased and…oh, wait, no, they can’t. Eventually even a 100% tax rate won’t pay for everything that government… I must say, it is certainly helpful to know that this thread has NOTHING to do with health care, and everything to do with a soviet take over of the US. All that shit about death panels and mediocre care was a smoke screen for what was really bothering you. But serious question: on a scale of 1-10 where 1 is minimal government and 10 is the USSR, where do you see the US now? And where do you see it after UHC? And I guess as a comparison, where do you see Canada and Europe? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2010, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1036 "2010-05-03T15:49:46Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > Sure. Why not. I mean, if you’re the United States government and you’re supported by the American taxpayer… Clearly, you haven’t the slightest idea what I’m talking about there. I think you read the word “collective” and went into spasm mode. Worker ownership is not a new idea, nor a particularly radical one, and does not suggest government ownership. Its like I was talking about Methodism, and you answered as if I were talking about voodoo. But if you ever find the time to answer the question I was actually asking… Its in that section above the part you quoted. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1037 "2010-05-04T09:11:21Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Clearly, you haven’t the slightest idea what I’m talking about there. I think you read the word “collective” and went into spasm mode. Worker ownership is not a new idea, nor a particularly radical one, and does not suggest government ownership. Its like I was talking about Methodism, and you answered as if I were talking about voodoo. The sad thing is that there are quite legitimate criticisms to be made about UHC, just as there are legitimate criticisms to be made against any system, and yet they have not been made here because making them requires an understanding of the actualities of how UHC works, rather than creating some cartoon boogeyman with no basis in reality to rail against. When you have no facts, no evidence, no informed anecdotes, nothing but a worldview and the reassuring voices in your head that you cling to in the face of all evidence to the contrary, it’s not surprising that you have trouble remembering which bits are real and which are imaginary. Or, to put it more succinctly, [this](http://intepid.com/res/417.gif). ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 10:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1038 "2010-05-04T10:46:29Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > Gotta wonder about that elusive quality of government, that essential nature that ensures the inefficiency of all governmental endeavors, regardless. I believe the US should step into the 20th century and adopt single payer yesterday, but I hope you realize this entire post could have been copy/pasted with the private/government entities reversed and made as much sense. If you want to call it that. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1039 "2010-05-04T14:26:23Z")
I have pretty good health insurance. I can see any doctor I want and they pay the bills without push-back. Sometimes they’re slow in getting me a reimbursement check, but whatever. Sometimes I’m slow paying the electric bill. So yeah, I’m happy with my insurance. Do I still think healthcare needs to be reformed? You betcha. How do you account for me, **Starving Artist**? ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2010, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888/1040 "2010-05-04T14:31:58Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > …but I hope you realize this entire post could have been copy/pasted with the private/government entities reversed and made as much sense. If you want to call it that. Quite my point, my bad for not being clearer. I don’t believe such an entity as “government” exists, in the sense of having some innate qualities that apply universally to all such things. It is a central dogma of the conservative catechism, and it has precisely the same objective reality as the Immaculate Conception, whlich is to say, none. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=51) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sarah-palin-proven-right-government-tricks-beautiful-young-mom-imposes-1st-death-panel-verdict/535888.md?page=53)