# Satanists propose monument to the Dark Lord on Oklahoma State Capitol grounds **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 9, 2014, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354 "2014-01-09T13:56:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![wevets](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9a140/32.png) [@wevets](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wevets)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/21 "2014-01-09T18:25:52Z")
Assuming [this](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanism#The_Satanic_Temple) is the group in question, they don’t seem to be the antithesis of commandments #5-10 > [@wikipedia](#): > > The Satanic Temple > Main article: The Satanic Temple > > The Satanic Temple, based in New York, represents a variety of Satanism that uses the literary Satan as a mythological foundation for a non-supernatural religion,[46] which it believes can be used to construct a cultural narrative that can usefully contextualize life experiences and promote pragmatic skepticism, rational reciprocity, personal autonomy and curiosity. > > As it lacks the creed of elitism and Social Darwinism that define the Church of Satan[47] in favor of other characteristics of the literary Satan, it contrasts[48] itself by its desire to actively participate in public affairs and provide outreach to the wider public. This has manifested in several public political actions[49][50] and efforts at lobbying,[51] with a focus on the separation of Church and State and using satire against religious organizations that it believes interfere with freedom and the pursuit of happiness.[52] > > The only requirements to be a member are to support the tenets and beliefs of the organization, and to name yourself a member.[53] ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/22 "2014-01-09T19:59:46Z")
For the sake of completeness, here are the [Eleven Satanic Commandments](http://www.churchofsatan.com/eleven-rules-of-earth.php): > [@](#): > > 1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked. > 2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them. > 3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there. > 4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy. > 5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal. > 6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved. > 7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained. > 8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself. > 9. Do not harm little children. > 10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food. > 11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him. Kindly note, that for most of us who post to the Straight Dope, or anywhere else on the Internet for that matter, we are in violation of commandments #1, #2, #3, #5, #8 & #11, thus putting all of us at great risk of Eternal Salvation. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/23 "2014-01-09T20:11:08Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > The Church of Satan doesn’t worship satan… I suppose I know that, and I can totally get on board with the various humanist Satanic organizations and what they stand for. It’s just that the traditional concept of Satan as “The Devil” is not an especially pro-human figure. Not trying to Godwinize, but picking that particular character and redefining it into something secular & nice is a bit like running a sincerely nurturing home for orphaned Jewish children and calling it Uncle Adolph’s Krystallkamp. You can pick whatever name and iconography you want for your organization, but there are some symbols that defy redefinition. Not really looking to argue for or against anything with respect to OK City. Just kinda thinking out loud–and doing it poorly–that the incongruity of the message and the symbol seems a bit trollish when placed next to T10Cs. For what it’s worth, I don’t much care for the juxtaposition of T10Cs with a government building either. Whatevs. Is there gonna be pie here or what? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/24 "2014-01-09T20:18:12Z")
> [@The Great Sun Jester](#): > > Not really looking to argue for or against anything with respect to OK City. Just kinda thinking out loud–and doing it poorly–that the incongruity of the message and the symbol seems a bit trollish when placed next to T10Cs. For what it’s worth, I don’t much care for the juxtaposition of T10Cs with a government building either. Whatevs. Is there gonna be pie here or what? Of course it’s “a bit trollish.” That’s the point, I presume. SDMB rules don’t apply IRL. A reaction from the good people of OK City is exactly what they are looking for. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/25 "2014-01-09T20:26:36Z")
Not just OKC people, they are getting national coverage out of this. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/26 "2014-01-09T20:55:25Z")
I understand why the Republican state legislators are against this. They’re worried that Satan will stand and salute them when they walk past. ---
**Author:** ![Alan\_Smithee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/2acd7d/32.png) [@Alan\_Smithee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alan_Smithee)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2014, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/27 "2014-01-09T21:27:34Z")
> [@buddha\_david](#): > > For the sake of completeness, here are the [Eleven Satanic Commandments](http://www.churchofsatan.com/eleven-rules-of-earth.php): > > Kindly note, that for most of us who post to the Straight Dope, or anywhere else on the Internet for that matter, we are in violation of commandments #1, #2, #3, #5, #8 & #11, thus putting all of us at great risk of Eternal Salvation. :eek: As the post directly above yours points out, those are the commandments of a completely separate Satanist group with very different goals and values. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/28 "2014-01-10T02:07:54Z")
> [@The Great Sun Jester](#): > > Not really looking to argue for or against anything with respect to OK City. Just kinda thinking out loud–and doing it poorly–that the incongruity of the message and the symbol seems a bit trollish when placed next to T10Cs. For what it’s worth, I don’t much care for the juxtaposition of T10Cs with a government building either. Whatevs. Is there gonna be pie here or what? The entire purpose of the exercise appears to have completely whizzed by about a foot or so over your head. OF COURSE it’s trollish! That’s the whole point! By the tenets of the Constitution (as it’s currently interpreted), the Satanic Temple is exactly as good as the First Methodist Church is exactly as good as the Dearborn Mosque is exactly as good as Temple Beth Israel is exactly as good as The 3rd Dianic Circle of Oakland (Reformed). And the Satanic Temple going to make the courts make OKC treat them that way by shoving this large, ugly statue down their throats, the same way the Baptists/whoever did the 10C statue. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/29 "2014-01-10T02:15:15Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > The entire purpose of the exercise appears to have completely whizzed by about a foot or so over your head. OF COURSE it’s trollish! That’s the whole point! By the tenets of the Constitution (as it’s currently interpreted), the Satanic Temple is exactly as good as the First Methodist Church is exactly as good as the Dearborn Mosque is exactly as good as Temple Beth Israel is exactly as good as The 3rd Dianic Circle of Oakland (Reformed). And the Satanic Temple going to make the courts make OKC treat them that way by shoving this large, ugly statue down their throats, the same way the Baptists/whoever did the 10C statue. The way to treat this is to say “go ahead, Satanists, commission your sculpture and place it here”. It’s easy to make a drawing of the sculpture. Actually having it done, physically, will cost at least $50K, probably more. You give the go ahead, the idea will fizzle out. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/30 "2014-01-10T02:22:01Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > The entire purpose of the exercise appears to have completely whizzed by about a foot or so over your head. OF COURSE it’s trollish! That’s the whole point! By the tenets of the Constitution (as it’s currently interpreted), the Satanic Temple is exactly as good as the First Methodist Church is exactly as good as the Dearborn Mosque is exactly as good as Temple Beth Israel is exactly as good as The 3rd Dianic Circle of Oakland (Reformed). And the Satanic Temple going to make the courts make OKC treat them that way by shoving this large, ugly statue down their throats, the same way the Baptists/whoever did the 10C statue. Ridiculous! Dianic Circles never reform. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/31 "2014-01-10T02:44:37Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > The way to treat this is to say “go ahead, Satanists, commission your sculpture and place it here”. It’s easy to make a drawing of the sculpture. Actually having it done, physically, will cost at least $50K, probably more. You give the go ahead, the idea will fizzle out. I think you’re liable to wind up with some mighty funny-looking courthouse lawns if you count on that. This is a big country, and there are a _lot_ of groups out there who can probably scrape together a few thousand bucks to put up a statue on some public property that–thanks to the Christianists–has been declared to be a “public free speech forum”. ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/32 "2014-01-10T02:45:53Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > I think you’re liable to wind up with some mighty funny-looking courthouse lawns if you count on that. This is a big country, and there are a _lot_ of groups out there who can probably scrape together a few thousand bucks to put up a statue on some public property that–thanks to the Christianists–has been declared to be a “public free speech forum”. Get good enough publicity and one of those crowdfunding-type accounts, and $50K might be pretty easy to get. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/33 "2014-01-10T03:10:05Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > I think you’re liable to wind up with some mighty funny-looking courthouse lawns if you count on that. This is a big country, and there are a _lot_ of groups out there who can probably scrape together a few thousand bucks to put up a statue on some public property that–thanks to the Christianists–has been declared to be a “public free speech forum”. Kickstarter? Indi go-go? I think you could EASILY get $50k for a statue, probably surpass your goal. I know my husband will give them $1 over the internet, probably more - and I think that there are easily another 49,999 people willing to spent $1 to make this point. We’ll give another buck to the Wiccans when they put their proposal forward as well. I draw the line at giving a buck to the Scientologist, even to make a point. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/34 "2014-01-10T03:49:04Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > The way to treat this is to say “go ahead, Satanists, commission your sculpture and place it here”. It’s easy to make a drawing of the sculpture. Actually having it done, physically, will cost at least $50K, probably more. You give the go ahead, the idea will fizzle out. I agree with you, since my go-to is “If one religious statue is okay, then all have to be okay”. Regardless of whether they can scrape together that kind of money or not. But that’s the last thing the majority of city/state governments are going to do away from the huge coastals (and a couple of upper Midwestern). ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Sensitive](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/58956e/32.png) [@Darth\_Sensitive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Sensitive)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/35 "2014-01-10T03:50:57Z")
Pretty sure I saw a kickstarter for this that already had $20,000 for the statue linked on one of the local news sites. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/36 "2014-01-10T04:07:22Z")
When do we see a monument to Ceiling Cat? ---
**Author:** ![buddha\_david](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ee7513/32.png) [@buddha\_david](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/buddha_david)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/37 "2014-01-10T04:25:39Z")
> [@Dangerosa](#): > > Kickstarter? Indi go-go? I think you could EASILY get $50k for a statue, probably surpass your goal. I know my husband will give them $1 over the internet, probably more - and I think that there are easily another 49,999 people willing to spent $1 to make this point. I’ve seen people donate over $10K just to support someone’s fledgling YouTube Let’s Play channel, so yeah, what you said. > [@Dangerosa](#): > > I draw the line at giving a buck to the Scientologist, even to make a point. Scientology isn’t a religion, they’re an organized crime network. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/38 "2014-01-10T04:59:24Z")
> [@LawMonkey](#): > > I do love this one. And I appreciate that it will be practical as well, so that you can sit in Baphomet’s lap. 🙂 Does the statue have an erection under his robes to give the kiddies a little poke? 'Cuz real Satan would. ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/39 "2014-01-10T05:00:53Z")
I read an opinion piece from a right wing christian group explaining how freedom of religion in the 1st amendment REALLY means Christians only and not other religions. The mental gymnastics they use never ceases to amaze. ---
**Author:** ![JohnClay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c37758/32.png) [@JohnClay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnClay)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2014, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354/40 "2014-01-10T05:11:49Z")
It makes sense, after all many Christians believe that Satan is the ruler of this world… > **[How is Satan god of this world (2 Corinthians 4:4)? | GotQuestions.org](http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-god-world.html)** > > How is Satan god of this world (2 Corinthians 4:4)? Is Satan in control of what happens on earth? Also remember in the story where Satan tempted Jesus, he said that he could offer him all of the kingdoms of the world. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/satanists-propose-monument-to-the-dark-lord-on-oklahoma-state-capitol-grounds/678354.md?page=3)