Is there a causal relationship between IQ and SAT scores? Well, let’s try an experiment. Let’s take a pair of identical twins, conceived in a test tube and raised in the same environment. At some point in their lives we give one of them a magic pill which increases his IQ by say, 10 points. Eventually they take the SAT. Whom do you think will perform better?
If you are bothered by the small sample size, let’s try this. Take a population, any population, as heterogeneous or homogeneous as you like, and give half of them, chosen randomly, this magic IQ pill. A few years later give them the SAT. Which group do you think will perform better?
Now, is the the increase in IQ that CAUSES the increase in SAT scores, or is it something else? I’m thinking it is the IQ itself.
Actually, with respect to the OP it really doesn’t matter whether or not the relationship is causal, but only whether one score can be predicted or estimated to any degree by the other. Indeed the height/weight analogy works quite well for that. I’m sure there’s a table out there on the Internet that shows that for people of height X their average weight is Y and that 90% percent of them will fall within Z pounds on either side. So given that you can make a very crude guess at a person’s weight given their height.
now, now, people.
It would seem the fellow with the powersurfr site simply did a conversion based on the percentiles.
The usual way for reporting an IQ score is based on how you did versus a suitable peer group. if you are average you get an IQ of 100. if you score 1 standard deviation above the average you get 115; 2 sigmas above average gets a 130 and so on. for a Gaussian distribution (some call it a normal distribution, but most scientists insist on calling it a Gaussian), 1 standard devaiation above the mean has a percentile of 84.13, 2 deviations gives 97.725, and so on. presumably the college board releases a table of scores with thier percentile rankings and thats what he used.
college board says a score of 1500 has a 99.985 percentile, which indicates 3.615 sigmas above mean, which translates to 100+15*3.615 = 154.23.
no problem, that is the natural approach for trying to find a translation between SAT’s and IQ.
to jman: well, if you took the SAT in the seventh grade you would have to give the test to a bunch of seventh graders and use the percentiles compiled from that to translate into something resembling an IQ score. If you did that, i suspect you would have scored higher than ~99.5% of the other seventh graders.
The biggest problem with such a direct translation is not what has been pointed out. Yes, an SAT doesn’t measure intellegence directly, but no test does or can. intellegence is somewhat vaguely defined with people twisting the definition to suit their own agendas (i once read some silly person arguing that the ability to dance should be considered a form of intelligence). given that someone has gone through the first half of high school, the SAT measures how well they learn as well as most anything else (though i actually thought the ACT was a better test).
A bigger problem is the norm group; not every high school student takes the SAT, so the percentile ranks are only against college-bound students. Normed against all students, you should have a slightly higher IQ score for a given SAT score (though this would have less effect at the high end of the scores since a student capable of scoring 1400 is probably going to college).
anyway, my 2cents.
-Luckie
What’s so silly about it? though I don’t remember his name right now he had 12 (?), different types of intelligence including artistic, math, language and a host of others. I don’t see why this is any dumber than any other form of intelligence testing.
As for there being a corrilation beteen the SAT and IQ tests, there is, though I don’t know what it is off the top of my head, and I don’t think it’s very good either. There are books that give descriptions of varrious tests that include corrilation between other tests. All I remember about these books where are that they are green. I’ve packed all of my education stuff away NEVER to be looked at again so I’m not gonna go looking for the name. It’s a good 3-4 volume set of books that give who the test was written by, when, the population size and all the other stuff you could ever want to know.
Have you ever seen an IQ test? A real IQ test? It isn’t just answering multiple choice questions, it involves problemsolving and puzzle solving.
IMO low IQ test results do not definitively mean that a person has low intelligence but IQ tests can be useful to measure a certain type of ability. They’re a flawed instrument but useful in some contexts. What’s worse in a classroom situation? Only the achieving kids to get extension while the bored superbright sit and rot because they don’t play along with teacher?
The multiple intelligences guy is Howard Gardner. I’m pretty sure he added some more ‘intelligences’ to his list. I think he’s onto something which possibly could be useful but I sure wish he would call them something other than intelligences? Physical intelligence in terms of athletics? Ummmmmm…
JB Farley you may use that quote although used out of context it looks hysterically weird
UC President: Time to eliminate the SAT I requirement
By MICHELLE LOCKE
Associated Press Writer
BERKELEY, Calif. (AP) – In a development that could affect the way high school students in California and across the nation prepare for college, University of California President Richard C. Atkinson is recommending dropping the SAT I as an admission requirement.
Atkinson planned to announce his recommendation in a speech to the American Council on Education Sunday.
“Anyone involved in education should be concerned about how overemphasis on the SAT is distorting educational priorities and practices, how the test is perceived by many as unfair, and how it can have a devastating impact on the self esteem and aspirations of young students,” Atkinson said in a draft copy of the speech.
I don’t know how many others this is true for, but speaking for myself, I lose about 40 IQ points if I base it on my SAT score. According to this site, the average of the few IQ scores I have received dictates that I should have received a near-perfect score on the SAT, rather than the sad little 1220 I actually received.
shrug Whatever that means!
From a purely observational side, I do think that IQ plays into SAT scores, but not enough for us to start making broad generalizations about that correlation. A person can have a superbly high IQ but a terrible memory. That means they can be a whiz at understanding, learning, critical thinking, etc. but not necessarily at remembering general knowledge. I know a guy who isn’t very “bright” when it comes to analytical/critical thinking, brain teasers, patterns, etc. but can recite a whole movie to you after seeing it only a couple times. He did much better on the SAT than I.
With respect to including dancing/athleticism as a facet of intellegence, why not? It has to do with how well the mind can control the body. That may not be the way we normally think of intellegence, but it strikes me as a valid piece of the whole.
I copied the following list from a web site a while back … unfortunately, I didn’t copy the link. Sorry!
[ul]
[li]Logical-mathematical[/li][li]Bodily-kinesthetic[/li][li]Linguistic[/li][li]Spatial[/li][li]Musical[/li][li]Personal[/li][li]Interpersonal[/li]which includes [list][li]Internal/psychological/self-knowledge[/li][/ul][/list]
These are obviously debatable, but that’s just what I copied…
