# Saw an ad in a local paper for "white milk". What does that term mean to you? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [August 29, 2022, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565 "2022-08-29T21:59:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/61 "2022-08-30T16:40:04Z")
> [@bump](#): > > It’s the same sort of creeping idiocy that gives us “unsweet tea”. Not only is it ‘unsweetened tea’, but ‘tea’ implies unsweetened if there’s an alternative of “sweet tea” That one I can understand. At least where I am, finding unsweetened tea, at least when talking about iced/cold tea, is considerably less common in a world full of Snapple and Arizona. I work with all of beverage vendors, finding unsweetened can be a chore. But unless you specifically want non-homogenized milk, I doubt most people would ever run across it. “Unsweet Tea” sounds like a regional thing. Like someone saying they’re going to ‘unthaw’ or ‘dethaw’ something for dinner tomorrow. IMO, that’s worse than unsweet since unthaw/dethaw mean the opposite of what they’re intending it to mean. For no real reason, this reminds me of [this clip from Better Off Ted](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vxzWIN-tXeM). ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/62 "2022-08-30T17:09:53Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > > [@puzzlegal](#): > > > > It’s hard to find milk that hasn’t been homogenized. I’m surprised that made it into an ad. > > At my store I’ve asked the person who orders milk AND the person who delivers it why people refer to whole milk as homogenized (and sometimes ‘homo’ when I think they think they’re being coy/clever). I always get the same answer ‘because it’s homogenized’ to which I reply ‘and the other milk isn’t?’. > To be fair, even the labels on whole milk often say ‘homogenized’ and/or ‘vitamin d’ in a considerably bigger font than on the other cartons. But it still seems odd to refer to one type of milk by something that describes nearly all of them. Huh? Do you interpret “homogenized milk” to mean homogenized whole milk? I have never heard that, either. Unless it’s just that “milk” with no modifiers means “whole milk”. But why add the one modifier “homogenized” when everything except a couple of pricy “natural” brands is homogenized? ---
**Author:** ![SCAdian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scadian/32/3292_2.png) [@SCAdian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCAdian)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/63 "2022-08-30T17:20:11Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Do you interpret “homogenized milk” to mean homogenized whole milk? He appears to be questioning the store’s use of “homogenized” only with whole milk, so I would say the answer is “No!” ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/64 "2022-08-30T17:21:35Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > Do you interpret “homogenized milk” to mean homogenized whole milk? _I_ don’t, but it’s not uncommon. But regardless, my question is why “homogenized milk” would mean ‘whole milk’. It would be like calling a Ford a Ford and a Chevrolet a Chevrolet but referring to a Honda as “car with wheels”. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/65 "2022-08-30T17:28:57Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > “Unsweet Tea” sounds like a regional thing. Like someone saying they’re going to ‘unthaw’ or ‘dethaw’ something for dinner tomorrow. IMO, that’s worse than unsweet since unthaw/dethaw mean the opposite of what they’re intending it to mean. I don’t know… it wasn’t a thing until about 10 years ago. Before then, you’d say “iced tea”, and you’d get unsweetened tea by default. At some point about 10 years ago, they’d start asking sweet or unsweet, which has rankled me ever since because it’s just wrong, doesn’t need to be there. And half the time I still end up with sweet tea anyway, because it’s easily misunderstood through drive-through intercoms with “sweet tea”. It’s absolutely terrible for all the above reasons. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/66 "2022-08-30T17:29:00Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > But regardless, my question is why “homogenized milk” would mean ‘whole milk’. Disclaimer: I used to have a big milk processor board as a client. My understanding, from talking with them, is that whole milk is often labeled as “Vitamin D Milk” (despite the fact that nearly _all_ dairy milk in the U.S. has Vitamin D added), or “Homogenized Milk” (despite the fact that nearly all dairy milk in the U.S. is homogenized), as a way to put something on the label that sounds like a product benefit or descriptor, besides “whole milk,” or just “milk” – as opposed to “Reduced Fat”/“2%,” “Fat-Free”/“Skim,” etc. But, yes, it does lead to confusion among consumers: “So, if this milk has Vitamin D, does that mean that the other ones don’t?” ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/67 "2022-08-30T20:45:41Z")
I’ve found that most people that say it’s called Homogenized Milk because it’s homogenized don’t actually know what homogenized means. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/68 "2022-08-30T20:46:49Z")
That’s weird. What’s wrong with “whole milk”? That’s what i’ve always called that product. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/69 "2022-08-30T20:48:18Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > That’s weird. What’s wrong with “whole milk”? My guess is that a name like “Vitamin D Milk” or “Homogenized Milk” connotes that there is something better/enhanced to it, and thus, it sells better. I’m fairly certain that market research was done to confirm that, at some point. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/70 "2022-08-30T20:58:21Z")
When I was a kid in the '70: Whole milk (For home) 2% (For school ) Skim milk (for cereal killers) ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/71 "2022-08-30T21:11:16Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > But, yes, it does lead to confusion among consumers: “So, if this milk has Vitamin D, does that mean that the other ones don’t?” It is somewhat odd. And it varies even for a single manufacturer. For example, here’s the milk page for a large California-based dairy: [https://crystalcreamery.com/products/milk](https://crystalcreamery.com/products/milk) Their individual serving ultra-pasteurized whole milk has “Vitamin D Milk” in the largest font. But for the half/full gallon sizes, “Whole milk” has the largest lettering, with “Vitamin D” smaller but still prominent. For the 2% milk, “Reduced Fat Milk” is most prominent in all sizes, with “Vitamin A & D” and “2%” being smaller but still visible. “Homogenized” is either in small letters or doesn’t appear at all. I don’t recall homogenized=whole ever being a thing around here. Only Vitamin D=whole (that fits with what I remember about the half-pint sizes I got at school, too). ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/72 "2022-08-30T21:25:28Z")
I always figured “homogenized” meant homogenized, and as for processed milks with exact percentages like 2%, assumed that basically had to be homogenized in any case. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/73 "2022-08-30T21:46:15Z")
Any ordinary outlet doesn’t carry unhomogenized milk at all, though, so the distinction doesn’t make much sense (except as a historical artifact). My prediction: First, milk was milk (i.e., what you get from the cow). Somewhere along the way, consumers decided that homogenization was convenient, and the government decided that fortification was useful. Milk producers advertised their product as homogenized, vitamin D milk. Sometime later, low-fat and other varieties came along. These could be distinguished by their fat content, calling them 2% milk or whatever. But as with the OP’s “white” milk, there was a need to distinguish the original variety of milk. Even though it had been going by plain “milk” forever, now it was ambiguous. However, it had already been advertised alongside “homogenized” and “vitamin D” for years, so it was easy to latch onto those names, even though they weren’t really exclusive to that product. And different areas picked different qualifiers to latch on to. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/74 "2022-08-30T22:00:48Z")
> [@digs](#): > > I just find the ad’s language needlessly awkward. Isn’t the default for milk “white”? IfI was asked to pick up a gallon of milk, I wouldn’t come home with a jug of chocolate. No. In advertising, defaults will trip the advertiser up. Just saying “milk” without specifying that you are not including chocolate milk, buttermilk, lactose-free milk, organic, etc. can be argued that it is all on sale. And yes, there are lots and lots of milk these days. ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/75 "2022-08-30T23:09:57Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Any ordinary outlet doesn’t carry unhomogenized milk at all, Respectfully…I have never been in a chain grocery store that doesn’t have at least one brand of raw milk. It will be over by the specialty milks, but it is available. It is usually organic and branded with things like “All natural” or “Not Pasteurized”, but it is also not homogenized. It is also about twice the cost of good ol’ regular milk. Trader Joe’s (which is not what I consider to be a chain grocery store) has it in glass milk jars shaped just like the ones I remember from back in the day, but these ones come with a substantial deposit. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/76 "2022-08-30T23:14:19Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Any ordinary outlet doesn’t carry unhomogenized milk at al This varies, depending on state regulations. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/77 "2022-08-30T23:25:31Z")
> [@JaneDoe42](#): > > I have never been in a chain grocery store that doesn’t have at least one brand of raw milk. It will be over by the specialty milks, but it is available. It is usually organic and branded with things like “All natural” or “Not Pasteurized”, but it is also not homogenized. That’s fair, and it probably does depend on the state. It appears that raw milk is legal for sale in California, though bottles must contain a warning about health hazards, which I don’t recall seeing. Admittedly, I haven’t inspected the “expensive glass-bottled milk” sections too closely (only enough to confirm that homogenized whole milk is available as well). Still–I’d suggest that unhomogenized milk is very much the exception, even when available. ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2022, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/78 "2022-08-30T23:57:24Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > though bottles must contain a warning about health hazards, which I don’t recall seeing. The warnings are in small letters on the back of the bottle. > [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > Still–I’d suggest that unhomogenized milk is very much the exception, even when available. It is very much a niche market, but demand is growing. It’s organic and all natural, it MUST be better than processed milk, right? I play with milk for fun and profit, every time I am in a new grocery store I inspect the dairy case pretty thoroughly. This is NOT directed at you in any way, but some folks don’t really understand the difference between homogenized and pasteurization. These are two separate processes, pasteurization in the US uses what is known as High Temperature Short Term or HTST. For milk, the temp is quickly raised to at least 160 for at least 15 seconds then rapidly cooled. Beer is raised to 140F. Pasteurization is for food safety and allows for a longer shelf life. Homogenizing is a mechanical process that forces milk through very small holes at very high pressure. This makes the fat cells a uniform size and prevents that lovely layer of cream that used to be at the top of the glass milk bottles our milkman left by our door and allows the dairy companies to make consumers pay for every single fat cell in every glass of milk. Speechifying over, back to topic. Hubs who is 5 years older than me and raised in West Virginia remembers white milk and chocolate milk cartons when he was in grade school. He didn’t know that pink/strawberry pre-mixed milk was an option back then but remembers one of his teachers making vanilla milk sprinkled with cinnamon for a grade school Christmas class. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2022, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/79 "2022-08-31T00:03:39Z")
> [@JaneDoe42](#): > > pasteurization in the US uses what is known as High Temperature Short Term or HTST. And of course this gets even more complicated. I’m sure you’re aware of ultra-high temperature pasteurization, which kills more microorganisms than the HTST kind. But what I found out fairly recently is that “ultra-pasteurized” and UHT are slightly different things. The pasteurization process is the same, but UHT products are aseptically packaged, which makes them (relatively) shelf-stable. And for whatever reason, UHT and organic milks are somewhat correlated. At least for a while, Horizon brand organic milk was the only UHT milk you could get (around here). ---
**Author:** ![JaneDoe42](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/janedoe42/32/14104_2.png) [@JaneDoe42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JaneDoe42)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2022, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565/80 "2022-08-31T00:32:42Z")
Oh gosh yes, I am aware of both of them. I once tried using shelf stable milk and poured it out after 8 hours. Being stubborn, I tried a second time with double rennet and lipase and still couldn’t get a reaction. > [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > And for whatever reason, UHT and organic milks are somewhat correlated. This is because there are three requirements for milk to be labeled organic\*, none of which touch on pasteurization or homogenization. If it is not forbidden, it must be allowed. Anything with the organic label is going to be more expensive for the consumer. Having a longer shelf life means they don’t have to produce as much to make the same amount of money. (Does that make sense?) So, seeing as how I have some very strong opinions about this subject AND because we are totally hi-jacking this thread…I think I’m going to have to bow out of this very interesting side conversation. \*cows get no antibiotics, fertility or growth hormones and get a third of their food by grazing in a pasture. That is it, you can feed them 2/3 synthetic feed and the milk will still be organic per the FDA. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-an-ad-in-a-local-paper-for-white-milk-what-does-that-term-mean-to-you/970565.md?page=5)