# Saw Star Trek: Nemesis last night. Any questions? \*SPOILERS\* (probably) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 11, 2002, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065 "2002-12-11T19:05:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Sdrawkcab](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/22d042/32.png) [@Sdrawkcab](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sdrawkcab)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/141 "2002-12-17T23:05:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Achernar \* > \*\*I know that a lot of your rant is just bizarre, pent-up emotion, Thanks a lot for the personal insult. > [@](#): > > A fat lot of good that would have done! How is Picard supposed to stop the weapon _and_ beam back? You assume Picard was just going to shoot the thing and blow up with it, rather than try to disarm it. Why? He had plenty of time to turn it off, change where it was aiming, whatever. There is nothing on the screen, nor in the screenplay, that indicates that Picard is going over there to die. > [@](#): > > Maybe you didn’t notice this, as it was kind of subtle, but _the ship blew up when Data did exactly what Picard was going to do!!!_ Really? And where did Picard say “I’m going to go over there and shoot the swirly green energy thing!”? Data had no choice but to go for broke because shooting it was about all you could do in three seconds. Picard, if he hadn’t just stood there like an imbecile, could have tried something different, more “subtle,” and less destructive. ---
**Author:** ![EasyPhil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e47c2d/32.png) [@EasyPhil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EasyPhil)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2002, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/142 "2002-12-17T23:13:59Z")
I could swear that the main Reman sounded like Vin Diesel. It would have been a better movie if an armor clad voyager or defiant had came to the rescue. ---
**Author:** ![Achernar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e274bd/32.png) [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/143 "2002-12-18T00:04:32Z")
**Sdrawkcab** , I sincerely apologize. The last thing I wanted to do was insult you personally. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/144 "2002-12-18T00:09:10Z")
Janeway lives! ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/145 "2002-12-18T01:34:12Z")
> [@](#): > > s that even possible? Has any movie or episode of the show shown that it is possible to replicate an entire photon torpedo? Since a photon torpedo is a matter/antimatter warhead, I doubt it. I understand that replicating antimatter is a no-no. A few other nits: 1. “We have the same eyes, the same heart…” Um, no you _don’t_… you have an artificial heart! (Picky, picky, picky…) 2. How can something “disrupt organic tissue at the subatomic level”? It seems to me that at the subatomic level, or even the atomic level, it’s not organic tissue anymore… just carbon and whatnot. Organicity begins with molecules. and… there was another major one that I don’t recall at the instant. Be that as it may, I enjoyed this outing and I don’t quite grasp the excoriations it’s receiving. I certainly don’t think it was the best… rather put it around the low half of the even numbers… but still even-numbered. ---
**Author:** ![EasyPhil](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e47c2d/32.png) [@EasyPhil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EasyPhil)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/146 "2002-12-18T02:36:20Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sdrawkcab \* > \*\*You assume Picard was just going to shoot the thing and blow up with it, rather than try to disarm it. Why? He had plenty of time to turn it off, change where it was aiming, whatever. There is nothing on the screen, nor in the screenplay, that indicates that Picard is going over there to die. > \*\* No assumption, when Picard went to where the beam was, he reached for his weapon which we had been knocked away in an earlier scene. The shot of his weapon on the floor was the setup for when he got to the beam and couldn’t fire on it the way that data did. He was prepared to take his own life to save that of his crew, i.e. the needs of the many out weigh those of the few. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/147 "2002-12-18T03:54:32Z")
Or the one. ---
**Author:** ![Achernar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e274bd/32.png) [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/148 "2002-12-18T03:59:58Z")
You know, this isn’t the first time that Data tried to sacrifice himself and Picard turned him down. Remember in _Generations_ Data wanted to be traded for Geordi. There’s no telling how long Data’s been begging the Captain to let himself get killed. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/149 "2002-12-18T04:06:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Achernar \* > \*\*You know, this isn’t the first time that Data tried to sacrifice himself and Picard turned him down. Remember in _Generations_ Data wanted to be traded for Geordi. There’s no telling how long Data’s been begging the Captain to let himself get killed. \*\* Damn! Did he somehow get his programming crossed with that of Marvin the Paranoid android? Picard: Mr. Data, do you detect any life signs on that planet? Data: Life, don’t talk to me about life. ---
**Author:** ![Achernar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e274bd/32.png) [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/150 "2002-12-18T04:14:15Z")
I just… love scanning for lifeforms. Life… forms… You precious little life… forms… You tiny little life… forms… Where are you? _Beep beep beep_ Ah, one of the high points of the whole series, IMO. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Enola\_Straight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dec6dc/32.png) [@Enola\_Straight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enola_Straight)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/151 "2002-12-18T05:22:24Z")
Did anyone think that the ARGO jeep-drop ship looked like the starfighter from Buck Rogers in the 25th century? Why the hell didn’t the E-E have batmobile armor and super-duper torpedoes from Voyager? For that matter, why haven’t they figured out transwarp/quantum slipstream drive? ---
**Author:** ![CaptGarf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@CaptGarf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptGarf)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/152 "2002-12-18T18:31:36Z")
The only worse Trek movie than this one was ST5… and even that had the small value of the Yosemite scenes. Also, Data’s death had absolutly no emotional impact. It could have been done much better. ---
**Author:** ![TheeGrumpy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/779978/32.png) [@TheeGrumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheeGrumpy)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/153 "2002-12-18T19:35:24Z")
> [@](#): > > Originally posted by **CaptGarf** > Data’s death had absolutly no emotional impact… …Because the Magic Reset Button ™ was glaringly obvious. “Data’s dead. No, he’s retarded!” It’s like they stole the endings to ST2 and ST3 and crammed them in the same movie. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/154 "2002-12-18T19:56:48Z")
If Data bought the farm because “he can’t get wrinkled or fat”, won’t Brent Spiner play the replacement? ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2002, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/155 "2002-12-18T22:45:40Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Enola Straight \* > \*\*Did anyone think that the ARGO jeep-drop ship looked like the starfighter from Buck Rogers in the 25th century? > > Why the hell didn’t the E-E have batmobile armor and super-duper torpedoes from Voyager? > > For that matter, why haven’t they figured out transwarp/quantum slipstream drive? \*\* Janeway is probably in charge of that. So the blueprints probably got lost in the Delta Quadrent again… ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/156 "2002-12-19T01:04:36Z")
Just saw it today and quickly scanned all these posts, so I’m not sure if anyone mentioned this: Doesn’t Riker mention a “something-Kirk-Epsilon” maneuver on the bridge? I swear I heard Kirk’s name. ---
**Author:** ![Laureen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85f322/32.png) [@Laureen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laureen)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/157 "2002-12-19T01:05:09Z")
I’m with the few, the proud, the ones who actually enjoyed this flick. Then again, I rarely pick apart movies or worry overmuch about their verisimilitude, especially with science fiction and fantasy. All I really ask of a movie is that it entertain me, and this one did. Plus I can never get enough of Jean-Luc, and I liked all the “nature vs. nurture” stuff where we see him question who he might have become had he suffered severe deprevation and abuse. It’s an interesting question for any of us… and a timeless one with no easy answer: how much of who we are is genetic, and how much do our experiences shape us? ---
**Author:** ![Cleverman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ec9cab/32.png) [@Cleverman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cleverman)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/158 "2002-12-19T01:54:09Z")
Why did Picard just sit there with a stupid look on his face saying nothing after his clone died? And why did Data not say a word when he beamed Picard back to the Enterprise and blew himself up? That moment carried incredible emotional weight, and they chose to have everybody stay mute. What a shame. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/159 "2002-12-19T02:34:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by vivalostwages \* > \*\*Just saw it today and quickly scanned all these posts, so I’m not sure if anyone mentioned this: Doesn’t Riker mention a “something-Kirk-Epsilon” maneuver on the bridge? I swear I heard Kirk’s name. \*\* You did. “Attack manuever Kirk epsilon!” As opposed to, “Run away manuever Archer my ass!” ---
**Author:** ![Achernar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e274bd/32.png) [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2002, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065/160 "2002-12-19T04:06:15Z")
I think it was a defensive maneuver, though I could be wrong. I found it dubious that Kirk would have five defensive maneuvers named after him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saw-star-trek-nemesis-last-night-any-questions-spoilers-probably/142065.md?page=9)