# Say the states that wanted to secede did. Then what? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [October 15, 2013, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272 "2013-10-15T02:19:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/21 "2013-10-15T18:13:36Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > The Civil War settled this: you don’t get to join the Union and then back out just because you are unhappy about one law or your lack of control. The Constitution is a binding agreement. Unless of course the Supreme Court decides otherwise. 🙂 Nor does one get to a colony of Great Britain and then back out. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/22 "2013-10-15T18:41:46Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > There’s no real interest in this from anyone with power. Statements to the contrary are just a sop to dumbasses who like this kind of rhetoric. That said, if someone really tried to secede there would be another war. The Civil War settled this: you don’t get to join the Union and then back out just because you are unhappy about one law or your lack of control. The Constitution is a binding agreement. Then let’s give – oh, Rhode Island or better, Samoa! – to the dumbasses and let them go nuts is their little world. I think I read somewhere that global warming is going to threaten the very existence of Samoa. There would be a delicious irony if the nutcases kept denying it until they had to start treading water. Let ‘em build a funckin’ ark. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/23 "2013-10-15T18:54:30Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Nor does one get to a colony of Great Britain and then back out. I’m pretty sure that didn’t work quite the same way. > [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Then let’s give – oh, Rhode Island or better, Samoa! – to the dumbasses and let them go nuts is their little world. Yeah, nobody’s doing that. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/24 "2013-10-15T18:55:36Z")
Much though we might like to fantasize about it, it would mean the death knell for _all_ of the states. Even after the split, some new issue would arise to divide the new nation, and you’d get a new two-party system. And in the first election after this new schism, you’d get some “green states” and “orange states”, or whatever, and whichever side lost, those states would then follow the precedent of Texas, and would split off so they could get their own way. Pretty soon, there would be no “United States”, and we’d all hang separately. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/25 "2013-10-15T19:07:37Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I’m pretty sure that didn’t work quite the same way. No, it did not. It depends upon who wins. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![That\_Don\_Guy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/that_don_guy/32/538_2.png) [@That\_Don\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/That_Don_Guy)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/26 "2013-10-15T19:08:47Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Let’s say we had the Blue States of America (BSA) and Red States of America (RSA). Job 1 would be to apportion to each its share of the national debt. Excuse me? What makes you think the RSA would be responsible for any of the USA’s debt? That’s like saying that the RSA gets “its share” of the USA’s armed forces hardware - that’s not going to happen either. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/27 "2013-10-15T19:19:48Z")
It would be like any other “we want to make our own government” move; they’d want to retain every beneficial aspect of being a US state while being able to say no to federal demands, no matter how contradictory or self-cancelling those positions might become. It’s like small towns that have gone Libertarian or Communist or whatever: they can play at being “totally different” while surrounded, supported and succored by the US infrastructure. None would want to raise their own militaries, be self-sufficient economically, or in general deal with the issues of being a free nation; they’d just want to take all the candy up to their room, play video games all night and tell Mom and Dad to get stuffed. And in the end it would be “meet the new boss… same as the old hoss('s ass).” ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/28 "2013-10-15T19:22:26Z")
The RSA is in physical possession of more than its share of the military facilities, at least. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/29 "2013-10-15T19:24:38Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Much though we might like to fantasize about it, it would mean the death knell for _all_ of the states. Even after the split, some new issue would arise to divide the new nation, and you’d get a new two-party system. And in the first election after this new schism, you’d get some “green states” and “orange states”, or whatever, and whichever side lost, those states would then follow the precedent of Texas, and would split off so they could get their own way. Pretty soon, there would be no “United States”, and we’d all hang separately. Why? Is the Queen gonna reconquer us state by state? ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/30 "2013-10-15T19:35:42Z")
The seceding states would be invaded by the US government and occupied for several years. Nuclear bombs will shake the Earth. Millions would die needlessly. A century and a half later, statists will build a monument for the presidential invader next to the Lincoln Temple in D.C. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/31 "2013-10-15T19:37:57Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Why? Is the Queen gonna reconquer us state by state? Canada could pick off small northern states one by one. And what’s to stop China from colonizing Los Angeles? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/32 "2013-10-15T20:49:34Z")
> [@Translucent\_Daydream](#): > > What would happen if the deeply gerrymandered red states actually seceded from the US and formed their own Red States of America or Republican Republic of Republically Republican Republics of America (RRRRA)? How would their government **fair** in five or ten years? For one thing, they’d still be making a lot of spelling misteaks. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/33 "2013-10-15T20:51:28Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Let’s say we had the Blue States of America (BSA) and Red States of America (RSA). Job 1 would be to apportion to each its share of the national debt. Suppose we just did it by share of the former USA’s population. Fine, whatever. If we can do that, then each new nation has its own currency, own laws, own capital. The RSA could outlaw abortion and teach creation in school and recite the Lord’s Prayer to their heart’s content. The BSA could have the carbon tax and do away with the destructive Bush tax cuts. In fifty years, the BSA will thrive and have to seal its border with the RSA. Or, at that point, the BSA could invade the RSA, exterminate the population and settle the territory, in the finest tradition of both Americas! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/34 "2013-10-15T21:23:49Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > Canada could pick off small northern states one by one. And what’s to stop China from colonizing Los Angeles? If by ‘pick off’, you mean allow Maine to respectfully petition the Queen, her representative the Governor General, Parliament and the Prime Minister for inclusion in the Dominion of Canada, sure. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/35 "2013-10-15T21:49:42Z")
“Occupy first, petition later, eh” will be their slogan. Or does Canada seriously have some sort of no-aggression clause in their constitution? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/36 "2013-10-15T22:20:14Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > And what’s to stop China from colonizing Los Angeles? The Mexicans’ dibs. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/37 "2013-10-15T22:29:18Z")
Mexico gets San Diego County, and everything east, Arizona, New Mexico, and Texas. China gets LA and everything east and north of there. Dividing line will be through LegoLand in Carlsbad, it’ll be the coolest DMZ on the planet. ---
**Author:** ![detop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@detop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/detop)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/38 "2013-10-15T22:40:15Z")
> [@Translucent\_Daydream](#): > > From [URL=“[Residents In More Than 30 States File Secession Petitions | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/13/petition-to-secede-states_n_2120410.html)”]\What would happen if the deeply gerrymandered red states actually seceded from the US and formed their own Red States of America or Republican Republic of Republically Republican Republics of America (RRRRA)? How would their government fair in five or ten years?\ Shouldn’t it be **N** ew **R** epublican **A** merica (NRA) ? ---
**Author:** ![markdash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@markdash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markdash)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/39 "2013-10-15T22:55:07Z")
> [@Peremensoe](#): > > Who says the subsidy would end? Don’t both halves still need each other? Can the BSA feed itself? I’m having trouble finding anything resembling total agricultural yield by state, but what makes you think the BSA would have any problem feeding itself? California has a huge agricultural yield, and most of the major corn-producing states are blue as well (Iowa, Ohio, Illinois, Minnesota). Upstate NY and Washington State also have large agricultural regions. Sure, there’s a shortfall of wheat, but that could be exchanged for things that the red states don’t grow. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [October 16, 2013, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272/40 "2013-10-16T01:08:56Z")
> [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](#): > > If by ‘pick off’, you mean allow Maine to respectfully petition the Queen, her representative the Governor General, Parliament and the Prime Minister for inclusion in the Dominion of Canada, sure. Good riddance. You can get lost in neighboring New Hampshire and wander into Canada. Thank goodness they are a bunch of nice guys and not East Germany. Besides, it’s damn cold up there where my Ex Wife comes from. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/say-the-states-that-wanted-to-secede-did-then-what/671272.md?page=3)