Have you ever seen the Vagina Monologues? It’s not really a performance with dancing vagina’s that’s acted out or anything. It’s a series of, well monologues based on interviews with real women. How can you not use the word, or what word would you use? Why let them do it in the first place?
I, just like so many others, wish like hell that it were made clear what term was supposed to be used in place of “vagina”.
They cut off his testicles, natch.
Agreed, wholeheartedly. Just as your own daughter, mine learned proper terminology at an early age. I don’t think that the term is offensive at all, What is offensive is that someone would agree to act in a given way, then act in precisely the opposite way and think that they were being shat upon when they got called on it.
No, it’s not. And no, they’re not. A principal has to juggle a crapload of interests. A lot of them are absolute bullshit, but they still need to be juggled. To dismiss the principal’s concerns is to be shortsighted and willfully ignorant.
Waitaminute. . .are you actually trying to equate “elbow” and “vagina”? My mistake. You’re not shortsighted at all, just willfully ignorant.
Yet you believe that they are being mistreated when they get called out for saying it.
No, you ignorant piece of shit. My daughter is retarded. The actions of the school administrators were foolish. Ignorance has been joined by rank stupidity, I see.
Elbow: 1 a: the joint of the human arm b: a corresponding joint in the anterior limb of a lower vertebrate.
Navel: 1 : a depression in the middle of the abdomen that marks the point of former attachment of the umbilical cord or yolk stalk.
Vagina: 1 : a canal in a female mammal that leads from the uterus to the external orifice of the genital canal
So say Messrs. Merriam and Webster. I’m not seeing a monumental difference. Three anatomical terms; they all appear in pretty much every biology textbook, don’t they?
Unless you can provide an explanation for how they’re so very different, you don’t have much ground to stand on.
Yes, I have seen it. And what’s more, I thought it was good. I fail to see where you would think that I imagine dancing pudenda. Maybe it was that line about rails, drinks and then a late night cruise. If so, I assure you, I was joking.
Honestly, I don’t think you can avoid using “vagina” when doing a reading from “The Vagina Monologues”. As to why these girls were allowed to do it in the first place: Damned if I know. One thing I can guaran-goddamned-tee you, though, is that they’ll not be performing the show anytime soon. Hell, their fall play next year will probably be something as old and dessicated as “The Bat”. That’s the travesty in this situation.
Really?
“That’s your belly button. When you were growing inside Mommy before you were born, that’s where you got your food…and now it marks the spot where Mama blows belly bubbles! [ppppppbbbbtttttthhhhh]”
“Elbow, elbow, where’s Caileigh’s elbow? There it is! Look at it bend!”
“Yep, that’s your vagina! Where’s your belly? Good! Where are your knees?”
[While changing a boy’s diaper while babysitting] “That’s Brian’s penis. He has a penis because he’s a boy. You and I have vaginas, because we’re girls! Does Daddy have a penis? Yep, because he’s a boy. Here, put this diaper in the garbage for Mama.”
It’s really not that hard.
Wha…what?? You think there’s something inherently dirty or inadvisable about using a correct anatomical term for a body part?
There are of course numerous euphemisms for vagina - pussy, cunt, twat, slit, coo-coo, yoni, cunny… as there are for penis. But I would think the euphemisms far more offensive than the actual NAME of the body part, no?
(From now on, I am referring to my elbow as my “arm-bendy” so I don’t offend anyone by using the correct anatomical terminology.)
I doubt they think they really got shit on. It seems to me like they expected to get suspended. It was an act of civil disobedience where they expected consequences. I also don’t think there’s any particularly offensive about welshing on their agreement since the request was unreasonable in the first place.
I can’t defend a principal caving into concerns that morons will be offended by something, and it’s not exactly like he avoided controversy anyway.
Ignorant of what?
I never said they were mistreated by being suspended. I think they were (mildly) mistreated by being asked to agree to something stupid, but I’m not outraged by the suspension.
Sorry for any offense with the word “retarded.” I work in the DD field. I’m not insensitive to people with mental disabilities. It was a bad choice of words on my part. My apologies. I’ll call the school “chickenshit and thoughtless” instead.
FYI, the play is literally just a series of spoken word monologues. It’s usually performed by two people sitting at at table reading from the script. There’s nothing else to it. There’s no plot or characters or anything. It’s like an episode of Def poetry Jam about vaginas.
ETA that I missed where you had said that you’ve seen it. If you’ve seen it then why would you think that there’s a distinction between reading lines from the play and performing the play? Reading the lines IS how it’s performed.
Her C’s, her U’s and her T’s: why that?
This brings back memories of when we read Huckleberry Finn in 9th grade English. The teacher was white, all the students were white, it was a masterpiece of American literature, and our textbooks where uncensored. She made us refer to him as “N-word Jim” :rolleyes: . Even the other teachers thought that was stupid.
I’ll do you one better; we were required to read The Grapes of Wrath in tenth grade…but the last page was covered by a sticker. As if there was anything seriously salacious about a starving man drinking from the breast of a woman who’d just delivered a stillborn baby. :rolleyes:
Stranger
Or, you could handle it like this family:
I, too, don’t understand what is so horrible about correct anatomical terms. What is the shock that humans can reproduce and have organs devoted to this purpose? Where is the wrong?
Again, this is only an issue if this is a BAD word. Is it?
And out of curiousity, what is the appropirate age for children to know that there are sex organs, and to know the correct term for them? Or, are you like my mother who can live her whole adult live without uttering that word in mixed company?
If I might wade ever so gently into this conversation…
I suppose it varies from parent to parent. Different parents will teach their children different things at different times, based on the child’s age, maturity, gender (perhaps), and on the parents’ values, taboos, and intelligence (and maturity as well.) Which is exactly the point. Parents and others who care for children should be the ones making the decisions as to when is the best time to introduce sensitive topics to their kids.
And yes, “vagina” is most assuredly in a different category than “elbow.” Yeah, they’re both clinical. But I think we can all agree that only the most willfully ignorant person would believe that contemporary American society treats elbows and vaginas the same. (For example. it’s illegal in most places to appear in public with bare genitalia, whereas going out in public without an armband is perfectly fine.) Without determining if it’s right or wrong, it’s the way things are right now.
The principal is operating not in an ideal world where parents are enlightened and children are aware of the full extent of human anatomy, but in the real world, where it’s perfectly expected that a great many parents don’t want their kids to be exposed to such things. I personally believe that high school students are generally mature enough to hear the word “vagina” and not freak out. But then again, I’m not a parent yet, and I don’t know how I would react. One thing I’m absolutely sure of is that I want my children to be introduced to sex on my terms, not on the terms of their classmates. Idealistic, perhaps. But still my belief, and most assuredly my prerogative.
Also, these folks broke their word. Yeah, they might have broken their word in the pursuit of changing unfair societal views on vaginas and women in general, which is admirable. I just wish they didn’t have to be dishonest in the pursuit of those goals and undermine the parental prerogative. That’s bad news no matter how you slice it.
Ahh, strange world you live in if you think exposing your vagina is the same thing as saying vagina!
CMC fnord!
Didn’t say that. I only say that society treats vaginas and elbows differently, even if simply spoken. I think in the context of this incident, the facts speak for themselves in this matter.
What are you talking about? The USA was founded by puritans and remains in their control.
Okay. Would you object to linking to a picture of your elbow?
Would you object to linking to a picture of your navel?
Would you object to linking to a picture of your vagina?
Enquiring minds just want to know.
Hee hee… you said “snatch”… 
What would that explanation entail? “Mom…what’s a bagina?” “It’s the part of a mommy’s body where babies are born from.” Seriously…is this so freekin’ hard?
The expectation of the audience, when finding out that excerpts from the *Vagina Monologues * was being read, would be to hear the word “vagina.” Unless they’re complete idiots. Do we really think the school told the audience ahead of time that the word was being deleted?
"Folks, rather than saying the word “vagina”, we’re going to substitute it with “cooter” or “snatch” or “hoo-hoo” or “cunt.” Um…yeah.
The principal got punk’d because his/her desire to “shield” the audience was stupid and after some thought, the kids decided to take a stand. Good for them!
What would the “proper” word be that would even come close to expressing the intent of the piece? Using anatomically correct terminology is not considered “hip” or “groovy” (well…maybe groovy, in the case of a cooter) in any circles. The hip folks are the ones that come up with clever slang. It’s always been this way.
It’s irresponsible to tell kids to advertise that they’re performing a reading and then expect them to change the artist’s words. Most likely without the artist’s permission.
It seems you’ve reversed the order of events in your statement. You see, the girls were first told to change the artists words, and upon their agreement, they were allowed to advertise that they were performing a reading. Had there been no agreement, there would have been no advertisement. Who’s irresponsible? The girls, for lying about what they were going to perform.
The principal didn’t get “punk’d” (if there’s one term we can all agree upon to be banned, can this please be it?), he was lied to and took appropriate action to punish the liars. I didn’t see Ashton Kutcher supergluing his desk drawers shut or anything – he did his job, part of which includes punishing those who don’t abide by the rules he and the school board set.