# Saying things are one way when all evidence points to the contrary? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 11, 2016, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251 "2016-10-11T16:39:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2016, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/21 "2016-10-11T21:19:33Z")
In the words of a wise man by the name of Shaggy just say [It Wasn’t Me.](https://youtu.be/ZrZDMlnnjVQ) ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2016, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/22 "2016-10-11T21:51:52Z")
> [@joyfool](#): > > When did this start? Genesis, Chapter 4 [QUOTE=Cain] While they were in the field, Cain attacked his brother Abel and killed him. Then the Lord said to Cain, “Where is your brother Abel?” “I don’t know,” he replied. “Am I my brother’s keeper?” [/Quote] Dude, Cain straight up lied to\*\* GOD\*\*:eek: ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2016, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/23 "2016-10-11T22:12:47Z")
I hate to come across as the angry atheist, but it starts the moment most of us first walk into Sunday School. I was 9 or 10 when I started realizing that the facts I learned in school weren’t jibing with the “facts” I learned in Sunday School. When I’d ask my Sunday School teacher to help me reconcile these things, I was always told that the evil scientists, working in cahoots with the Devil, were trying to trick me with their evil lies. So it’s no wonder that people reflexively downplay the importance scientific evidence. Even if a person doesn’t believe in the Devil, they’ve still been taught that faith-based knowledge is infallible, whereas scientific knowledge is always shrouded in doubt. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2016, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/24 "2016-10-11T22:35:07Z")
All good points, especially from a religious perspective, as to this day, I’m still fighting with Christians in my church who think atheists are possessed. I mean, what?? So that’s a very important bit of info to add to the discussion. Because if it goes back as far as those first instances of faith (Et tu, Cain?), then it’s as ingrained as human nature. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2016, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/25 "2016-10-12T15:29:41Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > I hate to come across as the angry atheist, but it starts the moment most of us first walk into Sunday School. > > I was 9 or 10 when I started realizing that the facts I learned in school weren’t jibing with the “facts” I learned in Sunday School. When I’d ask my Sunday School teacher to help me reconcile these things, I was always told that the evil scientists, working in cahoots with the Devil, were trying to trick me with their evil lies. So it’s no wonder that people reflexively downplay the importance scientific evidence. Even if a person doesn’t believe in the Devil, they’ve still been taught that faith-based knowledge is infallible, whereas scientific knowledge is always shrouded in doubt. I think that’s a lot of it- when religious authorities position science as the opponent of religion rather than something separate and alongside, it tends to color people’s opinions of science in all sorts of insidious ways. Essentially, rather than science and scientific thought being a an non-religious framework for discovering how the natural world works that could be complementary to religion, or at least non-threatening, these religious authorities slot it into the “Good Versus Evil” conflict on the side of evil. I mean, there’s nothing inherently ungodly about researching new antibiotics, or how nerve cells regenerate, or in doing something as innocuous as following the scientific method to solve a problem. The only real objection most of these ignorant religious types have is when scientific discovery and inquiry disagree or disprove the letter of their religious teachings, and most of that is squarely because these people are explicitly taught what amounts to a rule that if the secular conclusion and the religious conclusion about something are in conflict, that the religious one wins out every single time. There’s no element of evaluating both sides and coming to the conclusion that the Bible must be wrong, or must not be taken literally, because the Earth couldn’t possibly be 6000 some-odd years old. Nope, the teaching is that the Earth IS 6000 some-odd years old and any proof to the contrary is either put there by God, or by Satan to test your faith, and questioning this is questioning the Word of God. It seems pretty dumb, and it is. Thankfully, many mainstream Christian denominations don’t believe this- only the more fundamentalist, dumb-ass ones like the Southern Baptists do. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/26 "2016-10-12T15:53:19Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Beyond that, I think a lot of people just have issues with being wrong, or admitting that they’re wrong. So when confronted with facts that are not 100% overwhelming, they double down on their original opinion and get angry about it. This scenario has been described a lot recently, I don’t know if there is an official name for it or not, I’m not going to look it up right now, I think we have all seen it reported, etc. IMHO, from my experience, I believe, that the mechanism at work is that people are responding to being challenged - period. The informational content of their belief or of the challenge is really immaterial to them. Instead it is the act of being challenged that creates such an emotional response in them that it makes them unable to receive the new information. Now, it is important to understand that the delivery of the challenge can be very non-confrontational and purely information oriented, even random and not directed at them specifically, but if they perceive it as a challenge, then their emotional response kicks in, “RED ALERT! I AM BEING CHALLENGED! RED ALERT!” And the contrary information does not get absorbed or processed. So, for people predisposed to have this type of emotional response, it really is nearly impossible to change their minds with information. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2016, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/27 "2016-10-12T16:15:14Z")
> [@Icarus](#): > > This scenario has been described a lot recently, I don’t know if there is an official name for it or not, I’m not going to look it up right now, I think we have all seen it reported, etc. > > IMHO, from my experience, I believe, that the mechanism at work is that people are responding to being challenged - period. The informational content of their belief or of the challenge is really immaterial to them. Instead it is the act of being challenged that creates such an emotional response in them that it makes them unable to receive the new information. Now, it is important to understand that the delivery of the challenge can be very non-confrontational and purely information oriented, even random and not directed at them specifically, but if they perceive it as a challenge, then their emotional response kicks in, “RED ALERT! I AM BEING CHALLENGED! RED ALERT!” And the contrary information does not get absorbed or processed. > > So, for people predisposed to have this type of emotional response, it really is nearly impossible to change their minds with information. I know that it kicks in irrationally in my own mind, and I have to beat that urge back and consider what’s being said without assuming I’m automatically and irrevocably right. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2016, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/28 "2016-10-12T16:31:22Z")
Who ya gonna believe, me or your lying eyes? I think it has become more obvious now. But I had a boyfriend many many moons ago who tried very hard to convince me that he was not cheating on me, \* when I caught him in bed with another girl.\* but now the same tendency is still there, even with 24/7 video access. And post away on your phone! Auto correct be damned! ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2016, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/29 "2016-10-12T18:18:32Z")
> [@bump](#): > > I know that it kicks in irrationally in my own mind, and I have to beat that urge back and consider what’s being said without assuming I’m automatically and irrevocably right. I would say your self awareness and willingness and ability to combat the response puts you in the minority of people who have this response. I will say that I find this response I am describing is not present in everyone, or even most people I encounter. But it is present in some significant people in my life, (paired with a lack of self awareness and unwillingness), which is a struggle. ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2016, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/30 "2016-10-12T22:58:39Z")
There’s an old quote about man not being a rational animal, but a rationalizing animal. People tie their beliefs into their identity and how the world should operate. It’s important to protect your ego. It’s embarrassing to admit you’ve been wrong about something for years and that your enemies are right. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2016, 12:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/31 "2016-10-13T00:11:44Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > The [Big Lie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_lie) > > (i.e. You know who else did that? …) I like how the page gives an unsourced quote at the end of the article, which is then followed by a bunch of notes describing that the quote seems to be fiction. ---
**Author:** ![P-man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/p-man/32/3606_2.png) [@P-man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P-man)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2016, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/32 "2016-10-13T00:12:00Z")
I can go one better than the kid who screamed in front of everyone and then denied it. I’ve seen a few students deny something while they’re still doing it. Me: I said to stop using the computer. Lying kid: I’m not using it. Meanwhile, kid is still typing away. ---
**Author:** ![Me\_Billy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e480ec/32.png) [@Me\_Billy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Me_Billy)\ **Post date:** [October 13, 2016, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251/33 "2016-10-13T16:33:51Z")
There have been dumb people around for a LONG time. P.T. Barnum (of circus fame) said “There is a sucker born every minute!” The **Society for Indecency to Naked Animals** proved just how gullible people are when they objected to animals (dogs, cats, etc.) not wearing clothes in public and some people bought it hook, line, and sinker… > **[Society for Indecency to Naked Animals](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Society_for_Indecency_to_Naked_Animals)** > > The Society for Indecency to Naked Animals, or SINA \[pronounced "sinna"\], was a satirical hoax concocted by serial prankster Alan Abel. The group used the language and rhetoric of conservative moralists for the ostensible aim of clothing "indecent" naked animals, including domestic pets, barnyard animals, and large wildlife. The society and its aims were then largely presented in the public arena on news and talk shows by comedian/improviser Buck Henry (in the guise of SINA president "G. Cliffo... A good book on this is: Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds… > **[Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_Popular_Delusions_and_the_Madness_of_Crowds)** > > Extraordinary Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds is an early study of crowd psychology by Scottish journalist Charles Mackay, first published in 1841 under the title Memoirs of Extraordinary Popular Delusions. The book was published in three volumes: "National Delusions", "Peculiar Follies", and "Philosophical Delusions". Mackay was an accomplished teller of stories, though he wrote in a journalistic and somewhat sensational style. > The subjects of Mackay's debunking include alchemy, c... And more recently, a YouTube poster called “ThioJoe” has posted videos on such subjects as… How to Instantly Charge your Phone Upgrade Your Playstation 3 to PS4 for Free Double Your Internet Speed for Free > **[ThioJoe](https://www.youtube.com/user/ThioJoe)** > > I make technology videos, including tech news, reviews, and discussions. I also try to make complex topics not-boring. > > ━━━ > If you're a brand looking to do an integration, see the "Info For Brands" link. > ⚠️My official email addresses are all... (His more recent videos are serious.) Read the comments to these videos. Some people actually think these things will work! (He is making fun of stupid people.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/saying-things-are-one-way-when-all-evidence-points-to-the-contrary/768251.md?page=1)