# Sayings you didn't realize were obscene **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 28, 2017, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507 "2017-09-28T12:38:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Cub\_Mistress](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea666f/32.png) [@Cub\_Mistress](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cub_Mistress)\ **Post date:** [September 30, 2017, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/81 "2017-09-30T23:46:09Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > It certainly wasn’t originated by the Tubes. It at least goes back to Lenny Bruce. He probably didn’t invent the saying either. This is what I was reading through the thread to find, someone else who remembered Lenny Bruce. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2017, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/82 "2017-10-01T00:01:46Z")
> [@Cub\_Mistress](#): > > This is what I was reading through the thread to find, someone else who remembered Lenny Bruce. He’s the guy that’s not afraid. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2017, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/83 "2017-10-01T00:16:23Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > Shmuck is actually a very bad word if you are a Yiddish speaker. I knew better than to say it as a child-- I’d get punished if I dared. Not for us Conservatives. And I assume not for Reform. And not for Lenny Bruce. But it was a bit startling the first time I went to a German speaking city (Salzburg) and went past jewelry stores. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2017, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/84 "2017-10-01T00:17:41Z")
I read James Bond in 7th grade, so it took me a while to truly appreciate Ian Fleming’s names for female characters - like Pussy Galore and Plenty O’Toole. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2017, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/85 "2017-10-05T19:28:28Z")
A couple of others occurred to me. Ironic ones, since they’re used as euphemisms, but their own origins are as direct obscenities. **Poppycock** – all-purpose expression meaning “nonsense”. It’s even the name of a popcorn-based snack. It’s unfortunate, then, that its etymology is: > [@](#): > > 1865, American English, probably from Dutch dialect pappekak, from Middle Dutch pappe “soft food” (see pap) + kak “dung,” from Latin cacare “to excrete” (from PIE root \*kakka- “to defecate”). > **[poppycock | Etymology of poppycock by etymonline](https://www.etymonline.com/word/poppycock)** > > "trivial talk, nonsense," 1865, American English, probably from Dutch dialect pappekak,… See origin and meaning of poppycock. It therefore means not merely “soft shit”, as someone once said, but sort of “soft shit baby food”. This can interfere with your snacking. **Blatherskite** – “blather” means “to talk foolishly” or “to talk nonsense” [http://www.finedictionary.com/blatherskite.html](http://www.finedictionary.com/blatherskite.html) The “skite” part means, according to some “a contemptible person”, but other sources unapologetically say it means “shit” (which I could see being used for “a disagreeable person”, but it’s not the prime meaning) > **[blatherskite | Etymology of blatherskite by etymonline](https://www.etymonline.com/word/blatherskite)** > > "one who talks blustering nonsense," c. 1650, bletherskate, in Scottish song "Maggie… See origin and meaning of blatherskite. [https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/blatherskite](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/blatherskite) ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2017, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/86 "2017-10-05T20:45:13Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > “Scumbag” gets tossed around rather freely these days. When I was a kid in the 1960s it referred to a condom, more specifically a used condom. aka Coney Island Whitefish. Thanks, Aerosmith, for educating me on another useful euphemism. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2017, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/87 "2017-10-05T22:24:43Z")
One that my parents used when I was small was oo-gee bird. It was an epithet for someone whose ignorance was an irritation and a burden to others. As cheerful as it sounded, I’m surprised I never tried to use it. When I was grown, I discovered that it was a reference to a bird (possibly in a drawn cartoon) whose head was shoved up it’s backside and whose reaction to that was to say “Oo, gee, it’s dark in here!” ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/88 "2017-10-07T02:49:47Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > There are, it turns out, quite a lot of obscene limericks that start out with that line (or one very similar). [**ETA: There was an old man from Nantucket…**] > > But, to be fair, there’s a trio of surprisingly good clean ones: > > To be honest, though, I doubt if these would exist were it not for the prior existence of the “dirty” forms. On the contrary, the clean version of the “Old Man From Nantucket” was the original. So sayeth the Master himself: [How does the limerick “There was an old man of Nantucket …” conclude? - The Straight Dope](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/456/how-does-the-limerick-there-was-an-old-man-of-nantucket-conclude) ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/89 "2017-10-07T06:20:41Z")
The most common English word which has a (probably) offensive origin is “bad,” which (probably) comes from a word meaning “effeminate man”: > **[bad | Etymology, origin and meaning of bad by etymonline](https://www.etymonline.com/word/bad)** > > BAD Meaning: "inadequate, unsatisfactory, worthless; unfortunate;" late 14c., "wicked, evil, vicious; counterfeit;"… See origin and meaning of bad. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/90 "2017-10-07T07:31:43Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > [“Teach your grandmother to suck eggs”](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teaching_grandmother_to_suck_eggs) is a very old saying in English, going back to the 1700s. It means trying to teach someone something they have more experience in than you do. And as you point out, it’s not remotely a sexual reference. At the time it emerged, grandmothers would quite commonly have lost their teeth and would have had their sustenance in as liquid a form as possible - so they only way they could eat an egg was to suck it out uncooked. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 7:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/91 "2017-10-07T07:34:37Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Like the joke (which has also appeared as a one-panel cartoon in _Playboy_) about the boy who goes into the pharmacy and asks the druggist for “a package of condominiums” I have heard people referring with disgust to the litter in odd patches of woodland including “used conservatives” ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 7:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/92 "2017-10-07T07:36:05Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > **Blatherskite** – “blather” means “to talk foolishly” or “to talk nonsense” > [Blatherskite Definition, Meaning & Usage | FineDictionary.com](http://www.finedictionary.com/blatherskite.html) > The “skite” part means, according to some “a contemptible person”, but other sources unapologetically say it means “shit” (which I could see being used for “a disagreeable person”, but it’s not the prime meaning) > > [http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=blatherskite](http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=blatherskite) > [blatherskite - Wiktionary, the free dictionary](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/blatherskite) Compare and contrast, as they say, with “gobshite” ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2017, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/93 "2017-10-07T07:40:05Z")
PS: Here’s one that people think obscene, but isn’t (more of a British-ism than universal, perhaps) - cock-up, meaning something not going right, a minor disaster or piece of ineptitude. It’s to do with old-fashioned gun firing mechanisms, as are “to go off at half-cock”, and “flash in the pan”, all of which indicate various sorts of misfiring. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2017, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/94 "2017-10-09T23:25:34Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > On the contrary, the clean version of the “Old Man From Nantucket” was the original. So sayeth the Master himself: [How does the limerick “There was an old man of Nantucket …” conclude? - The Straight Dope](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/456/how-does-the-limerick-there-was-an-old-man-of-nantucket-conclude) On the contrary again. Despite The Master’s pronouncement, although the version I cite is datable to 1902, Gershon Legman cites a Nantucket limerick dating back to 1879 (which rhymes “Nantucket”, “bucket” and “suck it”). It’s #1496 in his 1964 book _The Limerick_. He gives other “Nantucket” limericks, but they date from the 1940s and 1950s, and thus are probably influenced by the Princeton limericks of 1902. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2017, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/95 "2017-10-10T04:21:46Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > On the contrary again. Despite The Master’s pronouncement, although the version I cite is datable to 1902, Gershon Legman cites a Nantucket limerick dating back to 1879 (which rhymes “Nantucket”, “bucket” and “suck it”). It’s #1496 in his 1964 book _The Limerick_. He gives other “Nantucket” limericks, but they date from the 1940s and 1950s, and thus are probably influenced by the Princeton limericks of 1902. You…you…you _dare_ question the Master?! Pistols at dawn, sir! Hunh. That’s interesting. Ignorance fought. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2017, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/96 "2017-10-10T04:22:57Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > FUBAR = Fucked Up Beyond All Recognition > JANFU = Joint Army Navy Fuckup, and so on. I’ve wondered about that since I heard the radio-traffic recording from Iwa Jima. Which didn’t include any obsceneties. And I know that written English is different to spoken English, but I’ve /never/ seen any indication that “fuck” was common in spoken English in the 40’s, beyond the existance of the three words you quote. I’ve long suspected that most WWII American troops didn’t use the “fuck” word much, and perhaps inserting it into FUBAR is a back-construction Comments welcome. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2017, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/97 "2017-10-10T06:32:28Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > I’ve /never/ seen any indication that “fuck” was common in spoken English in the 40’s Because it was considered too obscene to write down until relatively recently. But there are plenty of coded references in novels and journalism, particularly about WW2, to indicate that it was more or less as close to universal in spoken usage among servicemen and the ordinary working men who didn’t get to write novels or newspapers in those days as it is nowadays, at least in the UK. I don’t suppose the US was very different - if my hazy memory of Norman Mailer’s The Naked and the Dead is anything to go by. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2017, 11:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507/98 "2017-10-10T11:34:42Z")
As **PatrickLondon** indicates, it wasn’t possible to write such obscenities down in polite and open press until the 1950s and 1960s (which lead to an amazing array of _faux_obscenities and euphemisms in literature and motion pictures. Have a look at the peculiar cursing language and stilted slang in 1930s movies, for instance. Although Mark Twain had long before written :cleaned up" language in his _Life on the Mississippi_.) Nevertheless people DID say “Fuck” (and other such words) in the 1940s and earlier. Have a look at the Gershon Legman book I cite above, which quotes from underground literature and the not-so-open media of its day, with examples of “Fuck” going back to the 19th century. Or see his book _The Rationale of the Dirty Joke_, or Baring-Gould’s _The Lure of the Limerick_, which also cites uses from the first half of the 20th century. There are plenty of other books that will bear this out. I don’t have a copy nearby, but the Oxford English Dictionary lists typical uses of words throughout its history, with dates, and these days they’re liberated enough to include obscenities. In addition, Alan Sherman’s book _The Rape of the A_P_E_, which I cite as my source for SNAFU and FUBAR, explicitly states that the slang dates back at least to WWII, and was, in fact, the first exposure some enlistees had to the free use of “Fuck”. A sort of corroboration exists in the Army-produced “Private SNAFU” cartoons (made by Warner Brothers). When they tell you what “SNAFU” (the name of the screw-up private) stands for, they linger suggestively longer before explaining what the “F” stands for. They wouldn’t do that if it REALLY stood for “Fouled” rather than “Fuck”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/sayings-you-didnt-realize-were-obscene/797507.md?page=4)