# School Officials Punish Student For Driving Drunk Friend Home **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 15, 2013, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309 "2013-10-15T14:52:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/21 "2013-10-18T17:51:54Z")
> [@BrickaBracka](#): > > Plus, I’d love for some douchebag prosecutor to press this charge against my daughter. What charge? ---
**Author:** ![BrickaBracka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c5a1d2/32.png) [@BrickaBracka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrickaBracka)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/22 "2013-10-18T18:07:10Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > What charge? From post #16 ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/23 "2013-10-18T18:13:54Z")
> [@BrickaBracka](#): > > From post #16 OK. So to be clear: We all agree that this girl was given a summons to go to court because of underage drinking, but wasn’t charged with any crime and doesn’t have a criminal record as a result of this incident. Her only punishment was five volleyball games and her position as captain of the team. It’s not like her life is ruined or anything. ---
**Author:** ![BrickaBracka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c5a1d2/32.png) [@BrickaBracka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrickaBracka)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/24 "2013-10-18T18:21:00Z")
Correct - but on principle, this is friggin’ ridiculous, and worthy of some outrage, even if only recreational. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/25 "2013-10-18T18:35:25Z")
> [@BrickaBracka](#): > > Alright hoss, if you want to take Wiki’s word for it. Jurisdictional variances don’t exist anymore? That’s an awful shaky cite that you didn’t even link - so something tells me it’s not cut and dried as the quote would make it appear. > > Plus, I’d love for some douchebag prosecutor to press this charge against my daughter. It’d be pretty easy to take it to the court of public opinion, and have their reputation hung from the stake. I didn’t mean to “take Wiki’s word”, I was trying to find substantiation for what a PA district court judge told us. I thought [Wiki’s Alcohol Laws of PA](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_laws_of_Pennsylvania) was better (just barely) than nothing. This was 7 years ago, so hearsay is worthless. But, the judge made a point of lecturing my daughter. She accepted the cop’s withdrawal of charges but wanted her to understand that in PA she would have her driving privileges suspended and be charged with a crime if she were present at a party where there was alcohol, even if she didn’t drink. Obviously, IANAL. But I hired a damned good one for her back then.🙂 Oh, and “hoss”?:rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/26 "2013-10-18T18:39:59Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > OK. So to be clear: We all agree that this girl was given a summons to go to court because of underage drinking, but wasn’t charged with any crime and doesn’t have a criminal record as a result of this incident. Her only punishment was five volleyball games and her position as captain of the team. > > It’s not like her life is ruined or anything. Turn this around and apply it to yourself, You get busted for something you didn’t do, have to go through forced public humiliation for something you didn’t do, and you are punished for something you didn’t do. All because you were giving a drunk friend a ride home. fuck that shit. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/27 "2013-10-18T19:01:50Z")
Not that they were ever anything much other than puritanical abolitionists, but at least they used to pay lip service to caring about drunk driving. And then [this](http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/10/17/madd-weighs-in-on-honors-student-punished-for-trying-to-help-drunk-friend-and-their-reaction-might-surprise-you/): > [@](#): > > The saga of Erin Cox — the Massachusetts high school honors student and former volleyball team captain who was punished by her school for trying to help a drunk friend — has gone viral. > > Despite overwhelming consensus that Cox — who police say was not drinking or in possession of alcohol — did the right thing and shouldn’t have been suspended from her team or stripped of her captain’s status, two prominent voices disagree. > > Mothers Against Drunk Driving President Jan Withers told Fox News that North Andover High School was right to punish Cox, They just came out and said it was better to let her friend drive home drunk that to go near people who have been drinking! ---
**Author:** ![BrickaBracka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c5a1d2/32.png) [@BrickaBracka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrickaBracka)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/28 "2013-10-18T19:12:15Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > I didn’t mean to “take Wiki’s word”, I was trying to find substantiation for what a PA district court judge told us. I thought [Wiki’s Alcohol Laws of PA](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_laws_of_Pennsylvania) was better (just barely) than nothing. > > This was 7 years ago, so hearsay is worthless. But, the judge made a point of lecturing my daughter. She accepted the cop’s withdrawal of charges but wanted her to understand that in PA she would have her driving privileges suspended and be charged with a crime if she were present at a party where there was alcohol, even if she didn’t drink. > > Obviously, IANAL. But I hired a damned good one for her back then.🙂 > > Oh, and “hoss”?:rolleyes: I didn’t realize (did I miss the post?) that your own daughter went through something similar. I’d be absolutely infuriated and flabbergasted that a judge would even bother to mention something so pathetically stupid. If he continued with the same illogical line of reasoning despite being told she was there to pick up a friend who elected to NOT DRIVE DRUNK, then I’d walk out in disgust and probably end up in more trouble than I started…but that’s just me. As for “hoss”, I interpreted your post as stating something authoritatively for which there is little actual substantiated fact. In my part of the world, that presentation is generally rebuffed in such a manner. Forgive me for reading into your post a sentiment which wasn’t there, and for assuming that something as stupid as charging someone for a crime they factually didn’t commit couldn’t possibly occur in our society. ---
**Author:** ![BrickaBracka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c5a1d2/32.png) [@BrickaBracka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrickaBracka)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/29 "2013-10-18T19:14:12Z")
> [@Critical1](#): > > Turn this around and apply it to yourself, You get busted for something you didn’t do, have to go through forced public humiliation for something you didn’t do, and you are punished for something you didn’t do. > > All because you were giving a drunk friend a ride home. > > fuck that shit. Agreed. Fuck it sideways, with a rusty spoon. Piss me off mightily, this does. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/30 "2013-10-18T19:20:31Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > Actually, even that would be insufficient in Pennsylvania. When my daughter was sixteen her mom dropped her off at a party. When my daughter entered and realized there was alcohol, she left the party and walked home. While she was walking, the party was busted and kids ran every which way. > > My daughter was stopped by police. She blew 0.0%, but was cited for disorderly conduct when she refused to tell who was at the party. I hired a lawyer and got the charge dismissed, but the judge told us that she could be charged with an alcohol offense by simply being present, _even if she left the moment she became aware of the presence of alcohol_. If the judge said that, then he’s an idiot or he was just trying to convince her to avoid parties. You cannot be convicted of a constructive possession offense if you took reasonable efforts to learn if you were possessing the illegal contraband and immediately gave up possession once you learned you had it. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/31 "2013-10-18T19:24:36Z")
Not to mention simply by being present in a dwelling you don’t own, rent, lease or in some manner control. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/32 "2013-10-18T19:25:49Z")
They’re a bunch of prohibitionist wackos who are completely full of shit these days, and have abandoned their original mission. Fuck those guys. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/33 "2013-10-18T19:26:29Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Not to mention simply by being present in a dwelling you don’t own, rent, lease or in some manner control. A teenager at a party with alcohol may or may not have sufficient dominion or control over the alcohol to justify a constructive possession charge, it seems to me. But a teenager who immediately leaves such a party upon learning alcohol is present is not guilty regardless of the nature of the access for the party-goers. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/34 "2013-10-18T19:28:15Z")
[Active thread in this forum](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=704955) on this subject. ---
**Author:** ![Rhiannon8404](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rhiannon8404/32/17929_2.png) [@Rhiannon8404](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhiannon8404)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/35 "2013-10-18T19:30:28Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > OK. So to be clear: We all agree that this girl was given a summons to go to court because of underage drinking, but wasn’t charged with any crime and doesn’t have a criminal record as a result of this incident. Her only punishment was five volleyball games and her position as captain of the team. > > It’s not like her life is ruined or anything. Not ruined, but certainly damaged. I would absolutely stand up for my child who did nothing wrong, yet was being punished and publicly humiliated. Of course this whole thing brings into consideration, how much control over our children’s lives should the school system have? This didn’t happen on school property or during school hours. The student was cleared by the police as not breaking the law. Why was the school even involved? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/36 "2013-10-18T19:31:18Z")
> [@Richard\_Parker](#): > > A teenager at a party with alcohol may or may not have sufficient dominion or control over the alcohol to justify a constructive possession charge, it seems to me. Right, but you need at least some degree of physical proximity. ---
**Author:** ![Punoqllads](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/d2c977/32.png) [@Punoqllads](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Punoqllads)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/37 "2013-10-18T19:34:51Z")
> [@Rhiannon8404](#): > > Not ruined, but certainly damaged. I would absolutely stand up for my child who did nothing wrong, yet was being punished and publicly humiliated. Not just did nothing wrong. She was actively trying to do the right thing by picking up her friend rather than passing the buck. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/38 "2013-10-18T19:35:58Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Right, but you need at least some degree of physical proximity. Sure. For example, if you’re in another state, you’re unlikely to be in constructive possession. 🙂 It depends on the facts, of course. But if there’s 5 kegs in the kitchen and everyone has a solo cup with beer on the first floor, I don’t think you have a defense because you were in the attic making out with a freshman. * * * On the actual topic of this thread: more power to her. This was a bullshit punishment, and she is absolutely doing the right thing by fighting it. I am constantly amazed at how much money school districts could save by having just one decent lawyer on call to answer questions like whether they can randomly drug test everyone or whether they can punish a student for being a designated driver. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/39 "2013-10-18T19:43:22Z")
> [@Rhiannon8404](#): > > …Of course this whole thing brings into consideration, how much control over our children’s lives should the school system have? This didn’t happen on school property or during school hours. The student was cleared by the police as not breaking the law. Why was the school even involved? IMHO they shouldn’t have _any_ control whatsoever over students who aren’t either; one school property, at a school related event, or using school resources. _In loco parentis_ should not apply 24/7 (except of course at boarding schools). Everything else is a matter for parents and/or civil authorities, not the school. And naturally _private_ schools should be able to impose whatever restrictive rules they want (assuming of course they aren’t receiving any taxpayer $$$). ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [October 18, 2013, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309/40 "2013-10-18T19:44:49Z")
I normally wouldn’t be agreeing with this sentiment, since needless killing is sort of a bad thing, but MADD will never stop until zero BAC is the only allowable limit. Drunk driving = bad Driving after a few beers, spread over a few hours = responsible adult lifestyle. There are far worse things that will affect your driving ability than trace amounts of alcohol. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/school-officials-punish-student-for-driving-drunk-friend-home/671309.md?page=3)